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"Discussion about Mostwam"
Love you, too
Potatoman-J said: No possibility that someone else (Leon) could have logged into Lisa's account here. He's admitted to using the MostWam one that was previously "Leia" and "Charlotte" before that.
Leon posted about this at the start of page 5:
https://umd.net/forums/i/mostwam-owner-convicted-for-groping-wam/start/120#postid_907985
leonmoomin said:Lisa has posted as Lisa the whole time, although her and me have separated, she has continued to work for the company and do the administration.
Including working with a HR company to put new working practises into place, contracts and codes of conduct.
She can clearly be heard in the background of many of our newest videos.
I'm sure the person who brought this to the person posting here can confirm that Lisa still works for the company.
I don't have access to her UMD account.
Including working with a HR company to put new working practises into place, contracts and codes of conduct.
She can clearly be heard in the background of many of our newest videos.
I'm sure the person who brought this to the person posting here can confirm that Lisa still works for the company.
I don't have access to her UMD account.
Next Time said:
It's apparent VAVAVIE has a particular axe to grind here. They're not an impartial observer, there's a direct connection to someone involved, or they are that someone. No other reason an account with practically zero posts before this would become the "spokesperson".
I'm pretty sure you're the only one in this thread who thinks Al and Lisa are bad guys here. Do you not understand that MostWam is not the problem here? Leon is, and the two can be separated from each other going forward if Leon's decides to do the right thing, you know that right?
If YOU don't like MostWam, then good for you. Please don't attack anyone who does watch MostWam, and Kelsey herself said she had no problem with MostWam being here or people watching MostWam as long as Leon is out of the equation.
Jesus christ, you talk like a 5 year old throwing a temper tantrum, not a grown adult trying to do help someone. Your aggressive and nasty attitude does not make me want to support you, since it's clear you are a terrible person in reality and are using this situation to try and make yourself look better, but are failing miserably. I never said that all the money they have ever earned should go to charity, just a suggesting that at least some of the earnings at least should go forward to supporting them.
You have shown nothing but ill intent here. You're an angry person trying to violently destroy something, not someone who wants to make this community a better place.
Your own opinion of what should happen is not the "bleeding obvious thing that a professional business that respects its customers" should do, as you have been anything but professional, so I don't know how you think you have any right to lecture others on professionalism.
If YOU don't like MostWam, then good for you. Please don't attack anyone who does watch MostWam, and Kelsey herself said she had no problem with MostWam being here or people watching MostWam as long as Leon is out of the equation.
Jesus christ, you talk like a 5 year old throwing a temper tantrum, not a grown adult trying to do help someone. Your aggressive and nasty attitude does not make me want to support you, since it's clear you are a terrible person in reality and are using this situation to try and make yourself look better, but are failing miserably. I never said that all the money they have ever earned should go to charity, just a suggesting that at least some of the earnings at least should go forward to supporting them.
You have shown nothing but ill intent here. You're an angry person trying to violently destroy something, not someone who wants to make this community a better place.
Your own opinion of what should happen is not the "bleeding obvious thing that a professional business that respects its customers" should do, as you have been anything but professional, so I don't know how you think you have any right to lecture others on professionalism.
It's apparent VAVAVIE has a particular axe to grind here. They're not an impartial observer, there's a direct connection to someone involved, or they are that someone. No other reason an account with practically zero posts before this would become the "spokesperson".
He may have an axe to grind, but I do not. I am at risk here of losing my FAVORITE content producer. Please see the attached screenshot of my browser history.
https://umd.net/media/forum_uploads/10_22/screenshot20221023at51246pm_uid_77710_1666570987_50143.png
I literally check Mostwam.tv daily, sometimes more, to see if there's new content. And they operate on a fucking set release schedule!!! And I STILL check every single day, just on the off-chance that for some odd reason there might be a new video uploaded off-schedule. That's how obsessively in love with their content I am.
So with that information in mind, please read and consider my comments in this thread and know that they are absolutely not in any way coming from a place of interest in seeing Mostwam destroyed.
Potatoman-J said:
Wait, so Lisa and Al are accomplices now? I've been away most of the weekend and just trying to catch up on some of this now. No possibility that someone else (Leon) could have logged into Lisa's account here. He's admitted to using the MostWam one that was previously "Leia" and "Charlotte" before that.
Who are you? Where did you get all this info and when? If you've had it, why now, and now earlier when these things happened?
I understand wanting Leon gone, but now Lisa is the bad guy too?
VAVAVIE said:
Al has posted himself to confirm he has known all the time about the sexual assault and the conviction.
Leon has stated that Lisa has known all along too.
They have all misled this Forum and the business has taken thousands of pounds from members on here.
Do you not understand that is unacceptable and from here all trace should be removed?
I personally don't want to help these people, they seem to be vile in supporting what has happened.
Nobody is stopping them carrying on elsewhere. They can do whatever they want in whatever legal way they want.
If YOU want to persuade Leon,Lisa and Al to donate around £130k of profit to various charities plus pay back their wages to charity then I wish you all the luck in the world but do expect to have a face covered in piss as you'll be pissing in the wind.
I hope that shows you there is no ill intent as I don't know these people but I can see the bleeding obvious that if UMD is a professional business that respects its customers and producers then their collective actions must lead to their complete removal from UMD.
Al has posted himself to confirm he has known all the time about the sexual assault and the conviction.
Leon has stated that Lisa has known all along too.
They have all misled this Forum and the business has taken thousands of pounds from members on here.
Do you not understand that is unacceptable and from here all trace should be removed?
I personally don't want to help these people, they seem to be vile in supporting what has happened.
Nobody is stopping them carrying on elsewhere. They can do whatever they want in whatever legal way they want.
If YOU want to persuade Leon,Lisa and Al to donate around £130k of profit to various charities plus pay back their wages to charity then I wish you all the luck in the world but do expect to have a face covered in piss as you'll be pissing in the wind.
I hope that shows you there is no ill intent as I don't know these people but I can see the bleeding obvious that if UMD is a professional business that respects its customers and producers then their collective actions must lead to their complete removal from UMD.
Wait, so Lisa and Al are accomplices now? I've been away most of the weekend and just trying to catch up on some of this now. No possibility that someone else (Leon) could have logged into Lisa's account here. He's admitted to using the MostWam one that was previously "Leia" and "Charlotte" before that.
Who are you? Where did you get all this info and when? If you've had it, why now, and now earlier when these things happened?
I understand wanting Leon gone, but now Lisa is the bad guy too?
I can't speak to @VAVAVIE's assertion that Lisa and Al may be implicated in Leon's deceptions, nor can I speak to where he has gotten his information about Mostwam from. But as far as;
Potatoman-J said: There is a LOT of information we don't all seem to equally have at our disposal.
That is true, which is why I've just been going by the information reported in court, and the information stated by Leon here. You can find a nice summary of that in my previous post here; https://umd.net/forums/topicid/907582?start=180#postid_908157
Or you can find it in the court report linked in the initial post, and amongst Leon's posts across the two threads discussing this matter, however you may want to grab a pen and pad of paper first, as his story has changed frequently and confusingly along the way.
KelseyRose said:
I would never suggest otherwise, and I'm not commenting at all on the validity of the opinion, only noting that, after reading the threads, it's clear to me that VAVAVIE - unlike you - is not being entirely honest about their motivations.
So with that information in mind, please read and consider my comments in this thread and know that they are absolutely not in any way coming from a place of interest in seeing Mostwam destroyed.
I would never suggest otherwise, and I'm not commenting at all on the validity of the opinion, only noting that, after reading the threads, it's clear to me that VAVAVIE - unlike you - is not being entirely honest about their motivations.
Potatoman-J said:There is a LOT of information we don't all seem to equally have at our disposal.
That absolutely seems to be the case with A LOT of this. With just catching up, I will say to read Penny Banks lengthy post, Kelsey's MANY lengthy posts and Chantelle's. They will give you the best summaries and the best posts in this thread. Also, see Penny's Blog under the blog section.
What an unfortunate circumstance and a snapshot of human plight. The level of upset around this speaks volumes.
Do you remember back in middle school when all the boys stood on one side of the gym while the girls stood on the other? We like to think that we've grown up and matured beyond these things but that never seems to be the case. We categorize and take sides. Consequently we dig in our heels based on what leaves us feeling comfortable or safe. Well safe-ish.
As a man, I get it. You see some "poor guy" getting raked over the coals for a moment of indiscretion and feel afraid. What if that happens to me? On its surface I don't disagree.
But we live in what is meant to be a civil society where moments of indiscretion hold dire consequences. It's a harsh fact of participating in the world that you are required to fall in line even if it doesn't feel fair.
So whatever happened, however this situation played out, it played out. These are the cards that have been dealt. And in the interest of keeping society civil, the consequences hold sway. I only hope that the circumstances work out for the best and most appropriate for the parties involved.
I haven't read this forum fully enough to see all the replies. Yet it strikes me that there is a lack of consideration toward the hyper vigilance that women have to maintain just to function in the world. The truth is men are scary.
I realize that we all like to think of ourselves as good boys. But we are dangerous and threatening. Really, people in general are dangerous, but men bear a bit more weight of that burden. Men present a danger and need to manage that accordingly.
Imagine this, as a man: You're walking down the street. Up ahead there is a group of drunk, rowdy 22-year-old guys. Would that make you feel safe? Would you challenge them to a scrap? Or would you cross the street or choose another route?
Now imagine that scenario, but all those 22-year-olds want to bang you.
For a woman, it doesn't need to be a group of men for safety to sway. It only takes one. And it's not always the threat of physical violence. Sometimes it's just off-color comments and undesired aggressive solicitations. It takes that much more vigilance to maintain your sense of safety. You've got to keep your guard up.
Why am I saying all this? When a woman takes a moment to be more trusting and lower her guard, the feelings of betrayal are so much more intense when that trust is broken.
When a person walks onto a set, or really any job for that matter, there is an implied sense of safety that should be upheld. And that sense of safety can be easily disrupted.
When I'm walking down the street and I see an old lady clutch her purse and take a different path, I don't take that personally. Sure I'm not going to take her purse. But she didn't get to be an old lady by disregarding caution.
Tangent:
When I was in my early 20s, I remember watching the news with my uncle. A report came on about a woman who was allegedly sexually assaulted. My uncle's immediate comment was, "Oh come on, what was she wearing?" As if wearing something provocative, if that was even the case, implies she was inviting all sexual advances. It was a comment that I found as distasteful then as I do now. Even if she was looking to draw attention from someone, it doesn't mean she was looking to draw attention from the person who became her assailant.
But I also realize that is just another example of the sense of privilege that can live inside of the mindscape of the modern male. A privilege born out of bad social math. Just because you held her door open and bought her flowers doesn't mean she's required to accept your hand in marriage.
Conclusions such as, "She really wanted it so it was fine" or "She's a sex worker so she should be happy to do XYZ" (while these may be sophomoric examples) are also bad math. And poor coping. Kind of like believing that a person deserves to have their house robbed just because they forgot to lock the back door.
Don't get me wrong, there are bitter women who target men for their own designs. But the mere fact that those people exist doesn't mean we should dismiss those who may have actually been harmed.
I don't like to throw around terms like incel or misogynist. Blanket name calling and blind labeling is oftentimes not accurate enough to get to the heart of the matter. Vague descriptions rarely do. But, speaking more broadly, those who take a disdainful and dismissive approach toward women tend to take a disdainful and dismissive approach toward people in general.
Tangent over.
I sincerely like to think that we all have good intentions. Even if we are doing bad math and are clumsily working our ways through our lives.
In the meantime, I'm not much for supporting those convicted of this sort of assault. That doesn't seem like the behavior of my kind of people.
But I really do hope for the best. I believe in redemption. And for the sake of good things happening I hope I'm wrong.
That's about all I've got to say about that.
Do you remember back in middle school when all the boys stood on one side of the gym while the girls stood on the other? We like to think that we've grown up and matured beyond these things but that never seems to be the case. We categorize and take sides. Consequently we dig in our heels based on what leaves us feeling comfortable or safe. Well safe-ish.
As a man, I get it. You see some "poor guy" getting raked over the coals for a moment of indiscretion and feel afraid. What if that happens to me? On its surface I don't disagree.
But we live in what is meant to be a civil society where moments of indiscretion hold dire consequences. It's a harsh fact of participating in the world that you are required to fall in line even if it doesn't feel fair.
So whatever happened, however this situation played out, it played out. These are the cards that have been dealt. And in the interest of keeping society civil, the consequences hold sway. I only hope that the circumstances work out for the best and most appropriate for the parties involved.
I haven't read this forum fully enough to see all the replies. Yet it strikes me that there is a lack of consideration toward the hyper vigilance that women have to maintain just to function in the world. The truth is men are scary.
I realize that we all like to think of ourselves as good boys. But we are dangerous and threatening. Really, people in general are dangerous, but men bear a bit more weight of that burden. Men present a danger and need to manage that accordingly.
Imagine this, as a man: You're walking down the street. Up ahead there is a group of drunk, rowdy 22-year-old guys. Would that make you feel safe? Would you challenge them to a scrap? Or would you cross the street or choose another route?
Now imagine that scenario, but all those 22-year-olds want to bang you.
For a woman, it doesn't need to be a group of men for safety to sway. It only takes one. And it's not always the threat of physical violence. Sometimes it's just off-color comments and undesired aggressive solicitations. It takes that much more vigilance to maintain your sense of safety. You've got to keep your guard up.
Why am I saying all this? When a woman takes a moment to be more trusting and lower her guard, the feelings of betrayal are so much more intense when that trust is broken.
When a person walks onto a set, or really any job for that matter, there is an implied sense of safety that should be upheld. And that sense of safety can be easily disrupted.
When I'm walking down the street and I see an old lady clutch her purse and take a different path, I don't take that personally. Sure I'm not going to take her purse. But she didn't get to be an old lady by disregarding caution.
Tangent:
When I was in my early 20s, I remember watching the news with my uncle. A report came on about a woman who was allegedly sexually assaulted. My uncle's immediate comment was, "Oh come on, what was she wearing?" As if wearing something provocative, if that was even the case, implies she was inviting all sexual advances. It was a comment that I found as distasteful then as I do now. Even if she was looking to draw attention from someone, it doesn't mean she was looking to draw attention from the person who became her assailant.
But I also realize that is just another example of the sense of privilege that can live inside of the mindscape of the modern male. A privilege born out of bad social math. Just because you held her door open and bought her flowers doesn't mean she's required to accept your hand in marriage.
Conclusions such as, "She really wanted it so it was fine" or "She's a sex worker so she should be happy to do XYZ" (while these may be sophomoric examples) are also bad math. And poor coping. Kind of like believing that a person deserves to have their house robbed just because they forgot to lock the back door.
Don't get me wrong, there are bitter women who target men for their own designs. But the mere fact that those people exist doesn't mean we should dismiss those who may have actually been harmed.
I don't like to throw around terms like incel or misogynist. Blanket name calling and blind labeling is oftentimes not accurate enough to get to the heart of the matter. Vague descriptions rarely do. But, speaking more broadly, those who take a disdainful and dismissive approach toward women tend to take a disdainful and dismissive approach toward people in general.
Tangent over.
I sincerely like to think that we all have good intentions. Even if we are doing bad math and are clumsily working our ways through our lives.
In the meantime, I'm not much for supporting those convicted of this sort of assault. That doesn't seem like the behavior of my kind of people.
But I really do hope for the best. I believe in redemption. And for the sake of good things happening I hope I'm wrong.
That's about all I've got to say about that.
There is a very very important point to take away from this thread that has applicability to any of us who get in some sort of legal jam. I've had friends in this situation, I've been in this situation, accused of something you didn't do, the prosecution can't prove, or you did. The point is, it is all the same...
Your lawyer always suggests the easy way out, plead guilty, or else, it will cost ten times more for his services, but never goes into great detail about how that ruins your life and that you will come to regret pleading guilty later. The lawyer, whether in a civil or criminal case will correctly advise you that your whatever fetish lifestyle will come up in court and severely prejudice your case!...
The secret is, any lawyer that tells you this is just, not a very good lawyer, or is that solicitor for ya'll across the pond, as he doesn't feel confident about HIS ability to defend you, not the actual circumstances of your offence/charge. All this means is to find a better lawyer...
An amazing number of people plead guilty to stuff like this simply because they want all the bad vibes to go away, and go away right now. I've been here, done that, and yet found an ace lawyer to fix things regardless or my guilt or innocence, and, they fixed it. Doing so is never cheap, yet, failure to pay the price up front and plead innocent, regardless of whether you are or not, always results in you losing. Get a better lawyer and plead innocent and the loss of additional money and the hassle will be more, yet, years later, you'll be looking at this thread and be thankful you accepted the extra hassle, the short term extra risk of more severe consequences, the extra money, and yet, now, like me, you can kick back and see the bigger picture or how. you made the better choice...
Well, my legal problem went away, there is no record of it, unlike so many others I've known who did otherwise. Never allow any person, circumstance, whatever could be lost, and, most of all, emotion, to influence your decision, if you do, you always lose. The only way to ever win is to not lose because of being jammed up by the authorities, fear, being cheap, lazy, or, the worst of all, having emotions you cannot afford in difficult circumstances...
Your lawyer always suggests the easy way out, plead guilty, or else, it will cost ten times more for his services, but never goes into great detail about how that ruins your life and that you will come to regret pleading guilty later. The lawyer, whether in a civil or criminal case will correctly advise you that your whatever fetish lifestyle will come up in court and severely prejudice your case!...
The secret is, any lawyer that tells you this is just, not a very good lawyer, or is that solicitor for ya'll across the pond, as he doesn't feel confident about HIS ability to defend you, not the actual circumstances of your offence/charge. All this means is to find a better lawyer...
An amazing number of people plead guilty to stuff like this simply because they want all the bad vibes to go away, and go away right now. I've been here, done that, and yet found an ace lawyer to fix things regardless or my guilt or innocence, and, they fixed it. Doing so is never cheap, yet, failure to pay the price up front and plead innocent, regardless of whether you are or not, always results in you losing. Get a better lawyer and plead innocent and the loss of additional money and the hassle will be more, yet, years later, you'll be looking at this thread and be thankful you accepted the extra hassle, the short term extra risk of more severe consequences, the extra money, and yet, now, like me, you can kick back and see the bigger picture or how. you made the better choice...
Well, my legal problem went away, there is no record of it, unlike so many others I've known who did otherwise. Never allow any person, circumstance, whatever could be lost, and, most of all, emotion, to influence your decision, if you do, you always lose. The only way to ever win is to not lose because of being jammed up by the authorities, fear, being cheap, lazy, or, the worst of all, having emotions you cannot afford in difficult circumstances...
I'm not prominent on this site by any means, and I'm sorry because I definitely can't write with the eloquence. Thought or experience of some here. The level of interaction, while tense has actually been really robust and far better than others I've experienced on the forum (I've been around a long time). I'm adding my thoughts and apologise in advance if I sound like an idiot
My thoughts though are that Leon remaining in charge of Mostwam, or Mostwam remaining while Leon is profiting is untenable. He is a convicted sex offender, the nature of the case, the circumstances etc are secondary. I don't know Leon from Adam, I've no doubt enjoyed content he's produced and read posts by him before, but I can't make any claim to know him well enough to make any personal judgement, instead I have to go by the facts and information, his behaviour such as not informing the site, continuing to profit while on trial and then holding a conviction that would preclude him from all manner of jobs related to modelling, they are totally Unacceptable.
I saw some bizzare mention of cancelling but I see it as consequence. The consequence of what's happened is that the site is potentially at risk, reputation wise if nothing else (and I suspect there could be else but I'm no legal expert), the community it hurt, certain people are reliving or reminded of some heinous experiences and behaviour has been exhibited that is the nadir of how we've tried to be over the years. I believe people have been (rightly) banned for less. We also have I believe credible posts that this is not necessarily isolated or at least Leon's treatment of others before has not been great/ a high enough standard that we would hope for
I believe in the concept of rehabilitation but I have no idea what that looks, like, for now though, I think the community can only heal and move on with the absence of Leon, and if that takes Mostwam with it, that's the price that's required.
I don't think people are wrong to still enjoy Mostwam, there should be no guilt if you're sad it may have to go or wish it weren't so, but realistically Leon profiting from the community it just inappropriate, and he is the reason for that
My thoughts though are that Leon remaining in charge of Mostwam, or Mostwam remaining while Leon is profiting is untenable. He is a convicted sex offender, the nature of the case, the circumstances etc are secondary. I don't know Leon from Adam, I've no doubt enjoyed content he's produced and read posts by him before, but I can't make any claim to know him well enough to make any personal judgement, instead I have to go by the facts and information, his behaviour such as not informing the site, continuing to profit while on trial and then holding a conviction that would preclude him from all manner of jobs related to modelling, they are totally Unacceptable.
I saw some bizzare mention of cancelling but I see it as consequence. The consequence of what's happened is that the site is potentially at risk, reputation wise if nothing else (and I suspect there could be else but I'm no legal expert), the community it hurt, certain people are reliving or reminded of some heinous experiences and behaviour has been exhibited that is the nadir of how we've tried to be over the years. I believe people have been (rightly) banned for less. We also have I believe credible posts that this is not necessarily isolated or at least Leon's treatment of others before has not been great/ a high enough standard that we would hope for
I believe in the concept of rehabilitation but I have no idea what that looks, like, for now though, I think the community can only heal and move on with the absence of Leon, and if that takes Mostwam with it, that's the price that's required.
I don't think people are wrong to still enjoy Mostwam, there should be no guilt if you're sad it may have to go or wish it weren't so, but realistically Leon profiting from the community it just inappropriate, and he is the reason for that
messyface1994 said:
I'm pretty sure you're the only one in this thread who thinks Al and Lisa are bad guys here. Do you not understand that MostWam is not the problem here? Leon is, and the two can be separated from each other going forward if Leon's decides to do the right thing, you know that right?
If YOU don't like MostWam, then good for you. Please don't attack anyone who does watch MostWam, and Kelsey herself said she had no problem with MostWam being here or people watching MostWam as long as Leon is out of the equation.
Jesus christ, you talk like a 5 year old throwing a temper tantrum, not a grown adult trying to do help someone. Your aggressive and nasty attitude does not make me want to support you, since it's clear you are a terrible person in reality and are using this situation to try and make yourself look better, but are failing miserably. I never said that all the money they have ever earned should go to charity, just a suggesting that at least some of the earnings at least from now on should go forward to supporting them.
You have shown nothing but ill intent here. You're an angry person trying to violently destroy something, not someone who wants to make this community a better place.
Your own opinion of what should happen is not the "bleeding obvious thing that a professional business that respects its customers" should do, as you have been anything but professional, so I don't know how you think you have any right to lecture others on professionalism.
VAVAVIE said:
Al has posted himself to confirm he has known all the time about the sexual assault and the conviction.
Leon has stated that Lisa has known all along too.
They have all misled this Forum and the business has taken thousands of pounds from members on here.
Do you not understand that is unacceptable and from here all trace should be removed?
I personally don't want to help these people, they seem to be vile in supporting what has happened.
Nobody is stopping them carrying on elsewhere. They can do whatever they want in whatever legal way they want.
If YOU want to persuade Leon,Lisa and Al to donate around £130k of profit to various charities plus pay back their wages to charity then I wish you all the luck in the world but do expect to have a face covered in piss as you'll be pissing in the wind.
I hope that shows you there is no ill intent as I don't know these people but I can see the bleeding obvious that if UMD is a professional business that respects its customers and producers then their collective actions must lead to their complete removal from UMD.
messyface1994 said:
You aren't to win the argument that people who like MostWam and it's content and want it to continue are by default ok with Leon still being on the platform. Most people here, if not all, have come to the realisation that Leon needs to go. He's a convicted sex offender, and can't stay on the platform, and more serious and sincere efforts should be made to protect all the models that star in wam videos from now on, and to to make sure victims are taken seriously and have their situations dealt with efficiently.
Someone else pointed out that it's not that MostWam in general is being cancelled, but that we are figuring out how to move on, presumably without Leon. Others have also pointed out that MostWam should be able to continue if Leon steps down and hands the ownership to it to someone more responsible, or have a new site entirely, and would also make sense as a punishment for him, although that wouldn't be nearly enough to justify forgiveness, but it would be a start.
As I've said before, the money generated by MostWam that would have gone into Leons pocket, can be sent to various charities that support victims of sexual assault and rape, making MostWam a genuine force for good, as well as going into potential resources that can help safeguard models from predatory producers (hopefully, by making sure they don't exist in the first place by having some sort of sexual assault awareness course that people have to pass in order to become a producer).
Your tone and attitude isn't one of someone who wants to help. It's one of someone that wants to destroy something at any cost, and that's not being helpful. Instead of yelling at each other, let's actually do something productive and helpful for the people you claim to care so much about.
Also, when did Al become a bad guy here?
VAVAVIE said: I'm shocked at some of the male responses on here. I'm amazed any female would like to remain on this Forum. We all like sexual activity but very sinister opinions are flowing from customers and some producers alike. I suggest everybody reads the whole thread before choosing who to spend money with.
Separately though as the person who agreed to speak out about Leon and his companies here are very important bullet points in regards to this man and his company based on fact only and facts given in this thread by Leon and Mostwams 'Al' and facts available in the public domain
1) Leon admits the crime
2) A UK Crown Court convicted him
3)A huge sob story from Leon mitigated the sentence passed
4)He is a sex offender
5)A female Mostwam model was molested
6)Lisa left Leon in August 2020 at which point P.P.H. Ltd was split 60% Leon/ 40% Lisa
7)Leon took 100% ownership 10 days after Lisa left
8)The last accounts show £60k plus AFTER all expenses including wages are paid.
9)Leon confirms Lisa posted when Cassie left
10) Leon confirms Lisa is still an employee
11) Mostwam Al confirms he knew straight after the assault took place
This confirms Mostwam (or really P.P.H. Ltd) is rotten to the core with Al and Lisa joining Leon in being totally complicit in continuing to trade without informing the owner of UMD and taking over two years of income until being caught out by a third party.
Importantly in addition to the girl Leon was found guilty of molesting by a court of law he now states he has another problem with another girl and this is the girl who has approached me.
So that is two girls confirmed by Leon himself.
It isn't that girl who has approached me, nor it is Cassie and none of the girls this girl has put me in touch with are the girl he molested, Cassie or the girl he thinks has come to me.
I will have to stop giving any further information on here regarding the girls I am talking to as they have to now have a discussion themselves,take legal advice on their treatment by Leon.
Reading through the thread it was mentioned that the Jessie (Messy Jessie) or the guy behind her had complained about poor treatment towards the female models so I have asked a producer to find that conversation.
I only now say my heart goes out to the many females on here who now feel like shit about a lot of the responses which are shameful and have also have awful experiences themselves.
So far we've had lots of victim blaming (including by the guilty sex offender) and justification that poor little Leon is the actual victim and that the company producing the WAM content and receiving the income is very separate to Leon. It's not,he's own 100% of it and those 'running' it with him have made the decision to go along with his dishonesty.
How much more does an organisation have to do to be banished in all its forms from UMD?
As someone said manipulating sales figures to improve rank or whatever Messy Jessie did seems extremely tame by comparison. Ok so I'll have to wait now and take a lead from the girls as to what they want to do next regarding legal action.
Separately though as the person who agreed to speak out about Leon and his companies here are very important bullet points in regards to this man and his company based on fact only and facts given in this thread by Leon and Mostwams 'Al' and facts available in the public domain
1) Leon admits the crime
2) A UK Crown Court convicted him
3)A huge sob story from Leon mitigated the sentence passed
4)He is a sex offender
5)A female Mostwam model was molested
6)Lisa left Leon in August 2020 at which point P.P.H. Ltd was split 60% Leon/ 40% Lisa
7)Leon took 100% ownership 10 days after Lisa left
8)The last accounts show £60k plus AFTER all expenses including wages are paid.
9)Leon confirms Lisa posted when Cassie left
10) Leon confirms Lisa is still an employee
11) Mostwam Al confirms he knew straight after the assault took place
This confirms Mostwam (or really P.P.H. Ltd) is rotten to the core with Al and Lisa joining Leon in being totally complicit in continuing to trade without informing the owner of UMD and taking over two years of income until being caught out by a third party.
Importantly in addition to the girl Leon was found guilty of molesting by a court of law he now states he has another problem with another girl and this is the girl who has approached me.
So that is two girls confirmed by Leon himself.
It isn't that girl who has approached me, nor it is Cassie and none of the girls this girl has put me in touch with are the girl he molested, Cassie or the girl he thinks has come to me.
I will have to stop giving any further information on here regarding the girls I am talking to as they have to now have a discussion themselves,take legal advice on their treatment by Leon.
Reading through the thread it was mentioned that the Jessie (Messy Jessie) or the guy behind her had complained about poor treatment towards the female models so I have asked a producer to find that conversation.
I only now say my heart goes out to the many females on here who now feel like shit about a lot of the responses which are shameful and have also have awful experiences themselves.
So far we've had lots of victim blaming (including by the guilty sex offender) and justification that poor little Leon is the actual victim and that the company producing the WAM content and receiving the income is very separate to Leon. It's not,he's own 100% of it and those 'running' it with him have made the decision to go along with his dishonesty.
How much more does an organisation have to do to be banished in all its forms from UMD?
As someone said manipulating sales figures to improve rank or whatever Messy Jessie did seems extremely tame by comparison. Ok so I'll have to wait now and take a lead from the girls as to what they want to do next regarding legal action.
You aren't to win the argument that people who like MostWam and it's content and want it to continue are by default ok with Leon still being on the platform. Most people here, if not all, have come to the realisation that Leon needs to go. He's a convicted sex offender, and can't stay on the platform, and more serious and sincere efforts should be made to protect all the models that star in wam videos from now on, and to to make sure victims are taken seriously and have their situations dealt with efficiently.
Someone else pointed out that it's not that MostWam in general is being cancelled, but that we are figuring out how to move on, presumably without Leon. Others have also pointed out that MostWam should be able to continue if Leon steps down and hands the ownership to it to someone more responsible, or have a new site entirely, and would also make sense as a punishment for him, although that wouldn't be nearly enough to justify forgiveness, but it would be a start.
As I've said before, the money generated by MostWam that would have gone into Leons pocket, can be sent to various charities that support victims of sexual assault and rape, making MostWam a genuine force for good, as well as going into potential resources that can help safeguard models from predatory producers (hopefully, by making sure they don't exist in the first place by having some sort of sexual assault awareness course that people have to pass in order to become a producer).
Your tone and attitude isn't one of someone who wants to help. It's one of someone that wants to destroy something at any cost, and that's not being helpful. Instead of yelling at each other, let's actually do something productive and helpful for the people you claim to care so much about.
Also, when did Al become a bad guy here?
Al has posted himself to confirm he has known all the time about the sexual assault and the conviction.
Leon has stated that Lisa has known all along too.
They have all misled this Forum and the business has taken thousands of pounds from members on here.
Do you not understand that is unacceptable and from here all trace should be removed?
I personally don't want to help these people, they seem to be vile in supporting what has happened.
Nobody is stopping them carrying on elsewhere. They can do whatever they want in whatever legal way they want.
If YOU want to persuade Leon,Lisa and Al to donate around £130k of profit to various charities plus pay back their wages to charity then I wish you all the luck in the world but do expect to have a face covered in piss as you'll be pissing in the wind.
I hope that shows you there is no ill intent as I don't know these people but I can see the bleeding obvious that if UMD is a professional business that respects its customers and producers then their collective actions must lead to their complete removal from UMD.
I'm pretty sure you're the only one in this thread who thinks Al and Lisa are bad guys here. Do you not understand that MostWam is not the problem here? Leon is, and the two can be separated from each other going forward if Leon's decides to do the right thing, you know that right?
If YOU don't like MostWam, then good for you. Please don't attack anyone who does watch MostWam, and Kelsey herself said she had no problem with MostWam being here or people watching MostWam as long as Leon is out of the equation.
Jesus christ, you talk like a 5 year old throwing a temper tantrum, not a grown adult trying to do help someone. Your aggressive and nasty attitude does not make me want to support you, since it's clear you are a terrible person in reality and are using this situation to try and make yourself look better, but are failing miserably. I never said that all the money they have ever earned should go to charity, just a suggesting that at least some of the earnings at least from now on should go forward to supporting them.
You have shown nothing but ill intent here. You're an angry person trying to violently destroy something, not someone who wants to make this community a better place.
Your own opinion of what should happen is not the "bleeding obvious thing that a professional business that respects its customers" should do, as you have been anything but professional, so I don't know how you think you have any right to lecture others on professionalism.
You typify the reason the girl who told me about the court case didn't want to come on here.
You focus on your material you like to masturbate to and I'll worry about the facts that are now on here.
I haven't actually said I don't like the Mostwam site by the way, just pointing out what Leon has done and how the other staff have covered it up.
Potatoman J
"Wait, so Lisa and Al are accomplices now? I've been away most of the weekend and just trying to catch up on some of this now. No possibility that someone else (Leon) could have logged into Lisa's account here. He's admitted to using the MostWam one that was previously "Leia" and "Charlotte" before that."
Thanks for confirming that Leon has got form for pretending to be women on the site. Isn't that one reason Jessie and the boyfriend were banned
"Wait, so Lisa and Al are accomplices now? I've been away most of the weekend and just trying to catch up on some of this now. No possibility that someone else (Leon) could have logged into Lisa's account here. He's admitted to using the MostWam one that was previously "Leia" and "Charlotte" before that."
Thanks for confirming that Leon has got form for pretending to be women on the site. Isn't that one reason Jessie and the boyfriend were banned
Potatoman-J said:
Wait, so Lisa and Al are accomplices now? I've been away most of the weekend and just trying to catch up on some of this now. No possibility that someone else (Leon) could have logged into Lisa's account here. He's admitted to using the MostWam one that was previously "Leia" and "Charlotte" before that.
Who are you? Where did you get all this info and when? If you've had it, why now, and now earlier when these things happened?
I understand wanting Leon gone, but now Lisa is the bad guy too?
There is a LOT of information we don't all seem to equally have at our disposal.
VAVAVIE said:
Al has posted himself to confirm he has known all the time about the sexual assault and the conviction.
Leon has stated that Lisa has known all along too.
They have all misled this Forum and the business has taken thousands of pounds from members on here.
Do you not understand that is unacceptable and from here all trace should be removed?
I personally don't want to help these people, they seem to be vile in supporting what has happened.
Nobody is stopping them carrying on elsewhere. They can do whatever they want in whatever legal way they want.
If YOU want to persuade Leon,Lisa and Al to donate around £130k of profit to various charities plus pay back their wages to charity then I wish you all the luck in the world but do expect to have a face covered in piss as you'll be pissing in the wind.
I hope that shows you there is no ill intent as I don't know these people but I can see the bleeding obvious that if UMD is a professional business that respects its customers and producers then their collective actions must lead to their complete removal from UMD.
messyface1994 said:
You aren't to win the argument that people who like MostWam and it's content and want it to continue are by default ok with Leon still being on the platform. Most people here, if not all, have come to the realisation that Leon needs to go. He's a convicted sex offender, and can't stay on the platform, and more serious and sincere efforts should be made to protect all the models that star in wam videos from now on, and to to make sure victims are taken seriously and have their situations dealt with efficiently.
Someone else pointed out that it's not that MostWam in general is being cancelled, but that we are figuring out how to move on, presumably without Leon. Others have also pointed out that MostWam should be able to continue if Leon steps down and hands the ownership to it to someone more responsible, or have a new site entirely, and would also make sense as a punishment for him, although that wouldn't be nearly enough to justify forgiveness, but it would be a start.
As I've said before, the money generated by MostWam that would have gone into Leons pocket, can be sent to various charities that support victims of sexual assault and rape, making MostWam a genuine force for good, as well as going into potential resources that can help safeguard models from predatory producers (hopefully, by making sure they don't exist in the first place by having some sort of sexual assault awareness course that people have to pass in order to become a producer).
Your tone and attitude isn't one of someone who wants to help. It's one of someone that wants to destroy something at any cost, and that's not being helpful. Instead of yelling at each other, let's actually do something productive and helpful for the people you claim to care so much about.
Also, when did Al become a bad guy here?
VAVAVIE said: I'm shocked at some of the male responses on here. I'm amazed any female would like to remain on this Forum. We all like sexual activity but very sinister opinions are flowing from customers and some producers alike. I suggest everybody reads the whole thread before choosing who to spend money with.
Separately though as the person who agreed to speak out about Leon and his companies here are very important bullet points in regards to this man and his company based on fact only and facts given in this thread by Leon and Mostwams 'Al' and facts available in the public domain
1) Leon admits the crime
2) A UK Crown Court convicted him
3)A huge sob story from Leon mitigated the sentence passed
4)He is a sex offender
5)A female Mostwam model was molested
6)Lisa left Leon in August 2020 at which point P.P.H. Ltd was split 60% Leon/ 40% Lisa
7)Leon took 100% ownership 10 days after Lisa left
8)The last accounts show £60k plus AFTER all expenses including wages are paid.
9)Leon confirms Lisa posted when Cassie left
10) Leon confirms Lisa is still an employee
11) Mostwam Al confirms he knew straight after the assault took place
This confirms Mostwam (or really P.P.H. Ltd) is rotten to the core with Al and Lisa joining Leon in being totally complicit in continuing to trade without informing the owner of UMD and taking over two years of income until being caught out by a third party.
Importantly in addition to the girl Leon was found guilty of molesting by a court of law he now states he has another problem with another girl and this is the girl who has approached me.
So that is two girls confirmed by Leon himself.
It isn't that girl who has approached me, nor it is Cassie and none of the girls this girl has put me in touch with are the girl he molested, Cassie or the girl he thinks has come to me.
I will have to stop giving any further information on here regarding the girls I am talking to as they have to now have a discussion themselves,take legal advice on their treatment by Leon.
Reading through the thread it was mentioned that the Jessie (Messy Jessie) or the guy behind her had complained about poor treatment towards the female models so I have asked a producer to find that conversation.
I only now say my heart goes out to the many females on here who now feel like shit about a lot of the responses which are shameful and have also have awful experiences themselves.
So far we've had lots of victim blaming (including by the guilty sex offender) and justification that poor little Leon is the actual victim and that the company producing the WAM content and receiving the income is very separate to Leon. It's not,he's own 100% of it and those 'running' it with him have made the decision to go along with his dishonesty.
How much more does an organisation have to do to be banished in all its forms from UMD?
As someone said manipulating sales figures to improve rank or whatever Messy Jessie did seems extremely tame by comparison. Ok so I'll have to wait now and take a lead from the girls as to what they want to do next regarding legal action.
Separately though as the person who agreed to speak out about Leon and his companies here are very important bullet points in regards to this man and his company based on fact only and facts given in this thread by Leon and Mostwams 'Al' and facts available in the public domain
1) Leon admits the crime
2) A UK Crown Court convicted him
3)A huge sob story from Leon mitigated the sentence passed
4)He is a sex offender
5)A female Mostwam model was molested
6)Lisa left Leon in August 2020 at which point P.P.H. Ltd was split 60% Leon/ 40% Lisa
7)Leon took 100% ownership 10 days after Lisa left
8)The last accounts show £60k plus AFTER all expenses including wages are paid.
9)Leon confirms Lisa posted when Cassie left
10) Leon confirms Lisa is still an employee
11) Mostwam Al confirms he knew straight after the assault took place
This confirms Mostwam (or really P.P.H. Ltd) is rotten to the core with Al and Lisa joining Leon in being totally complicit in continuing to trade without informing the owner of UMD and taking over two years of income until being caught out by a third party.
Importantly in addition to the girl Leon was found guilty of molesting by a court of law he now states he has another problem with another girl and this is the girl who has approached me.
So that is two girls confirmed by Leon himself.
It isn't that girl who has approached me, nor it is Cassie and none of the girls this girl has put me in touch with are the girl he molested, Cassie or the girl he thinks has come to me.
I will have to stop giving any further information on here regarding the girls I am talking to as they have to now have a discussion themselves,take legal advice on their treatment by Leon.
Reading through the thread it was mentioned that the Jessie (Messy Jessie) or the guy behind her had complained about poor treatment towards the female models so I have asked a producer to find that conversation.
I only now say my heart goes out to the many females on here who now feel like shit about a lot of the responses which are shameful and have also have awful experiences themselves.
So far we've had lots of victim blaming (including by the guilty sex offender) and justification that poor little Leon is the actual victim and that the company producing the WAM content and receiving the income is very separate to Leon. It's not,he's own 100% of it and those 'running' it with him have made the decision to go along with his dishonesty.
How much more does an organisation have to do to be banished in all its forms from UMD?
As someone said manipulating sales figures to improve rank or whatever Messy Jessie did seems extremely tame by comparison. Ok so I'll have to wait now and take a lead from the girls as to what they want to do next regarding legal action.
You aren't to win the argument that people who like MostWam and it's content and want it to continue are by default ok with Leon still being on the platform. Most people here, if not all, have come to the realisation that Leon needs to go. He's a convicted sex offender, and can't stay on the platform, and more serious and sincere efforts should be made to protect all the models that star in wam videos from now on, and to to make sure victims are taken seriously and have their situations dealt with efficiently.
Someone else pointed out that it's not that MostWam in general is being cancelled, but that we are figuring out how to move on, presumably without Leon. Others have also pointed out that MostWam should be able to continue if Leon steps down and hands the ownership to it to someone more responsible, or have a new site entirely, and would also make sense as a punishment for him, although that wouldn't be nearly enough to justify forgiveness, but it would be a start.
As I've said before, the money generated by MostWam that would have gone into Leons pocket, can be sent to various charities that support victims of sexual assault and rape, making MostWam a genuine force for good, as well as going into potential resources that can help safeguard models from predatory producers (hopefully, by making sure they don't exist in the first place by having some sort of sexual assault awareness course that people have to pass in order to become a producer).
Your tone and attitude isn't one of someone who wants to help. It's one of someone that wants to destroy something at any cost, and that's not being helpful. Instead of yelling at each other, let's actually do something productive and helpful for the people you claim to care so much about.
Also, when did Al become a bad guy here?
Al has posted himself to confirm he has known all the time about the sexual assault and the conviction.
Leon has stated that Lisa has known all along too.
They have all misled this Forum and the business has taken thousands of pounds from members on here.
Do you not understand that is unacceptable and from here all trace should be removed?
I personally don't want to help these people, they seem to be vile in supporting what has happened.
Nobody is stopping them carrying on elsewhere. They can do whatever they want in whatever legal way they want.
If YOU want to persuade Leon,Lisa and Al to donate around £130k of profit to various charities plus pay back their wages to charity then I wish you all the luck in the world but do expect to have a face covered in piss as you'll be pissing in the wind.
I hope that shows you there is no ill intent as I don't know these people but I can see the bleeding obvious that if UMD is a professional business that respects its customers and producers then their collective actions must lead to their complete removal from UMD.
Wait, so Lisa and Al are accomplices now? I've been away most of the weekend and just trying to catch up on some of this now. No possibility that someone else (Leon) could have logged into Lisa's account here. He's admitted to using the MostWam one that was previously "Leia" and "Charlotte" before that.
Who are you? Where did you get all this info and when? If you've had it, why now, and now earlier when these things happened?
I understand wanting Leon gone, but now Lisa is the bad guy too?
There is a LOT of information we don't all seem to equally have at our disposal.
Strange reaction that you are more interested in who I am, where did I get the info from.
I've had thought you would be more concerned about the Mostwam model who was assaulted,the convicted sex offender who assaulted her and the website where they all covered it up,
Oh well takes all sorts.
To answer your questions , what would you like me to do, give my name, address, phone number and email to you or shall we stick to usernames like wanking potato J?
The info about the trail is publicly available at Bristol Crown Court in the UK.
The info about the company that Leon owns 100% of is available on the Companies House website including all documents regarding shares,profit
I posted the information about the court around 4 hours after I was told about it.
Leon and MostwamAl have also posted a lot of information.
Leon has stated it is Lisa on the forum using Lisamoomin and that profile posted about the removal of a certain models content the week of the court case.
So now you have all your answers and sources.
Maybe now focus more on the horrendous actions of some other people rather than dramatically having a go at shooting the messenger.
VAVAVIE said: Potatoman J
"Wait, so Lisa and Al are accomplices now? I've been away most of the weekend and just trying to catch up on some of this now. No possibility that someone else (Leon) could have logged into Lisa's account here. He's admitted to using the MostWam one that was previously "Leia" and "Charlotte" before that."
Thanks for confirming that Leon has got form for pretending to be women on the site. Isn't that one reason Jessie and the boyfriend were banned
"Wait, so Lisa and Al are accomplices now? I've been away most of the weekend and just trying to catch up on some of this now. No possibility that someone else (Leon) could have logged into Lisa's account here. He's admitted to using the MostWam one that was previously "Leia" and "Charlotte" before that."
Thanks for confirming that Leon has got form for pretending to be women on the site. Isn't that one reason Jessie and the boyfriend were banned
Likewise, thanks for confirming that you've been here much longer than a year and have a lot of knowledge about UMD and it's members extending far beyond Leon and this incident.
If I remember correctly (which I very well may not) I believe in the cases, it was in response to business queries and noted that in the post the Leon was posting, rather than pretending to be Charlotte. If someone wants to try and dig around for them, they will probably be under the "MostWAM" user as that's changed names several times between Leia and Charlotte who were working as office and support at different times.
Where as the boyfriend was specifically posing as Jessie. Said boyfriend I think also had a bone to pick with Leon, but I don't remember over what, and I don't have access to producer only areas of the site.
He's more potato now than man. Twisted and evil.
Potatoman-J said:
Likewise, thanks for confirming that you've been here much longer than a year and have a lot of knowledge about UMD and it's members extending far beyond Leon and this incident.
If I remember correctly (which I very well may not) I believe in the cases, it was in response to business queries and noted that in the post the Leon was posting, rather than pretending to be Charlotte. If someone wants to try and dig around for them, they will probably be under the "MostWAM" user as that's changed names several times between Leia and Charlotte who were working as office and support at different times.
Where as the boyfriend was specifically posing as Jessie. Said boyfriend I think also had a bone to pick with Leon, but I don't remember over what, and I don't have access to producer only areas of the site.
VAVAVIE said: Potatoman J
"Wait, so Lisa and Al are accomplices now? I've been away most of the weekend and just trying to catch up on some of this now. No possibility that someone else (Leon) could have logged into Lisa's account here. He's admitted to using the MostWam one that was previously "Leia" and "Charlotte" before that."
Thanks for confirming that Leon has got form for pretending to be women on the site. Isn't that one reason Jessie and the boyfriend were banned
"Wait, so Lisa and Al are accomplices now? I've been away most of the weekend and just trying to catch up on some of this now. No possibility that someone else (Leon) could have logged into Lisa's account here. He's admitted to using the MostWam one that was previously "Leia" and "Charlotte" before that."
Thanks for confirming that Leon has got form for pretending to be women on the site. Isn't that one reason Jessie and the boyfriend were banned
Likewise, thanks for confirming that you've been here much longer than a year and have a lot of knowledge about UMD and it's members extending far beyond Leon and this incident.
If I remember correctly (which I very well may not) I believe in the cases, it was in response to business queries and noted that in the post the Leon was posting, rather than pretending to be Charlotte. If someone wants to try and dig around for them, they will probably be under the "MostWAM" user as that's changed names several times between Leia and Charlotte who were working as office and support at different times.
Where as the boyfriend was specifically posing as Jessie. Said boyfriend I think also had a bone to pick with Leon, but I don't remember over what, and I don't have access to producer only areas of the site.
Actually as Wamchantelle and Penny Banks can confirm today is the day I learnt about the scenario about Jessie as somebody said in the thread that Jessie had complained about Leon and also people were saying whatever Jessie had done was much less than Leon/Mostwam.
Then tonight I've seen a thread from the producers lounge where Jessie is talking to Lisa and Leon and she says about the treatment, mainly regarding being left freezing covered in cold gunge for ages. They then discuss Leon formerly selling drugs which he says was only weed and says she brought her own bottle and was drunk at the shoot.
All sounds great.
Ok I'll bow out now as the facts are there to see,the sources are available for anybody to check for themselves and Messmaster is carrying out his investigation.
At the point where I'm questioned (and insults thrown) more than the people who have behaved badly I'll go back to just looking at the occasional wet and messy picture.
Wamchantelle, Penny, Kelsey Rose and Messmaster been nice to meet you and thankyou for your help.
At the point where I'm questioned (and insults thrown) more than the people who have behaved badly I'll go back to just looking at the occasional wet and messy picture.
Wamchantelle, Penny, Kelsey Rose and Messmaster been nice to meet you and thankyou for your help.
VAVAVIE said: Ok I'll bow out now as the facts are there to see,the sources are available for anybody to check for themselves and Messmaster is carrying out his investigation.
At the point where I'm questioned (and insults thrown) more than the people who have behaved badly I'll go back to just looking at the occasional wet and messy picture.
Wamchantelle, Penny, Kelsey Rose and Messmaster been nice to meet you and thankyou for your help.
At the point where I'm questioned (and insults thrown) more than the people who have behaved badly I'll go back to just looking at the occasional wet and messy picture.
Wamchantelle, Penny, Kelsey Rose and Messmaster been nice to meet you and thankyou for your help.
So you get called out and you run and hide. You have done your fair share of slinging at people in this thread. All it took was Potatoman to chase you away....
VAVAVIE said:
You typify the reason the girl who told me about the court case didn't want to come on here.
You focus on your material you like to masturbate to and I'll worry about the facts that are now on here.
I haven't actually said I don't like the Mostwam site by the way, just pointing out what Leon has done and how the other staff have covered it up.
messyface1994 said:
I'm pretty sure you're the only one in this thread who thinks Al and Lisa are bad guys here. Do you not understand that MostWam is not the problem here? Leon is, and the two can be separated from each other going forward if Leon's decides to do the right thing, you know that right?
If YOU don't like MostWam, then good for you. Please don't attack anyone who does watch MostWam, and Kelsey herself said she had no problem with MostWam being here or people watching MostWam as long as Leon is out of the equation.
Jesus christ, you talk like a 5 year old throwing a temper tantrum, not a grown adult trying to do help someone. Your aggressive and nasty attitude does not make me want to support you, since it's clear you are a terrible person in reality and are using this situation to try and make yourself look better, but are failing miserably. I never said that all the money they have ever earned should go to charity, just a suggesting that at least some of the earnings at least from now on should go forward to supporting them.
You have shown nothing but ill intent here. You're an angry person trying to violently destroy something, not someone who wants to make this community a better place.
Your own opinion of what should happen is not the "bleeding obvious thing that a professional business that respects its customers" should do, as you have been anything but professional, so I don't know how you think you have any right to lecture others on professionalism.
VAVAVIE said:
Al has posted himself to confirm he has known all the time about the sexual assault and the conviction.
Leon has stated that Lisa has known all along too.
They have all misled this Forum and the business has taken thousands of pounds from members on here.
Do you not understand that is unacceptable and from here all trace should be removed?
I personally don't want to help these people, they seem to be vile in supporting what has happened.
Nobody is stopping them carrying on elsewhere. They can do whatever they want in whatever legal way they want.
If YOU want to persuade Leon,Lisa and Al to donate around £130k of profit to various charities plus pay back their wages to charity then I wish you all the luck in the world but do expect to have a face covered in piss as you'll be pissing in the wind.
I hope that shows you there is no ill intent as I don't know these people but I can see the bleeding obvious that if UMD is a professional business that respects its customers and producers then their collective actions must lead to their complete removal from UMD.
messyface1994 said:
You aren't to win the argument that people who like MostWam and it's content and want it to continue are by default ok with Leon still being on the platform. Most people here, if not all, have come to the realisation that Leon needs to go. He's a convicted sex offender, and can't stay on the platform, and more serious and sincere efforts should be made to protect all the models that star in wam videos from now on, and to to make sure victims are taken seriously and have their situations dealt with efficiently.
Someone else pointed out that it's not that MostWam in general is being cancelled, but that we are figuring out how to move on, presumably without Leon. Others have also pointed out that MostWam should be able to continue if Leon steps down and hands the ownership to it to someone more responsible, or have a new site entirely, and would also make sense as a punishment for him, although that wouldn't be nearly enough to justify forgiveness, but it would be a start.
As I've said before, the money generated by MostWam that would have gone into Leons pocket, can be sent to various charities that support victims of sexual assault and rape, making MostWam a genuine force for good, as well as going into potential resources that can help safeguard models from predatory producers (hopefully, by making sure they don't exist in the first place by having some sort of sexual assault awareness course that people have to pass in order to become a producer).
Your tone and attitude isn't one of someone who wants to help. It's one of someone that wants to destroy something at any cost, and that's not being helpful. Instead of yelling at each other, let's actually do something productive and helpful for the people you claim to care so much about.
Also, when did Al become a bad guy here?
VAVAVIE said: I'm shocked at some of the male responses on here. I'm amazed any female would like to remain on this Forum. We all like sexual activity but very sinister opinions are flowing from customers and some producers alike. I suggest everybody reads the whole thread before choosing who to spend money with.
Separately though as the person who agreed to speak out about Leon and his companies here are very important bullet points in regards to this man and his company based on fact only and facts given in this thread by Leon and Mostwams 'Al' and facts available in the public domain
1) Leon admits the crime
2) A UK Crown Court convicted him
3)A huge sob story from Leon mitigated the sentence passed
4)He is a sex offender
5)A female Mostwam model was molested
6)Lisa left Leon in August 2020 at which point P.P.H. Ltd was split 60% Leon/ 40% Lisa
7)Leon took 100% ownership 10 days after Lisa left
8)The last accounts show £60k plus AFTER all expenses including wages are paid.
9)Leon confirms Lisa posted when Cassie left
10) Leon confirms Lisa is still an employee
11) Mostwam Al confirms he knew straight after the assault took place
This confirms Mostwam (or really P.P.H. Ltd) is rotten to the core with Al and Lisa joining Leon in being totally complicit in continuing to trade without informing the owner of UMD and taking over two years of income until being caught out by a third party.
Importantly in addition to the girl Leon was found guilty of molesting by a court of law he now states he has another problem with another girl and this is the girl who has approached me.
So that is two girls confirmed by Leon himself.
It isn't that girl who has approached me, nor it is Cassie and none of the girls this girl has put me in touch with are the girl he molested, Cassie or the girl he thinks has come to me.
I will have to stop giving any further information on here regarding the girls I am talking to as they have to now have a discussion themselves,take legal advice on their treatment by Leon.
Reading through the thread it was mentioned that the Jessie (Messy Jessie) or the guy behind her had complained about poor treatment towards the female models so I have asked a producer to find that conversation.
I only now say my heart goes out to the many females on here who now feel like shit about a lot of the responses which are shameful and have also have awful experiences themselves.
So far we've had lots of victim blaming (including by the guilty sex offender) and justification that poor little Leon is the actual victim and that the company producing the WAM content and receiving the income is very separate to Leon. It's not,he's own 100% of it and those 'running' it with him have made the decision to go along with his dishonesty.
How much more does an organisation have to do to be banished in all its forms from UMD?
As someone said manipulating sales figures to improve rank or whatever Messy Jessie did seems extremely tame by comparison. Ok so I'll have to wait now and take a lead from the girls as to what they want to do next regarding legal action.
Separately though as the person who agreed to speak out about Leon and his companies here are very important bullet points in regards to this man and his company based on fact only and facts given in this thread by Leon and Mostwams 'Al' and facts available in the public domain
1) Leon admits the crime
2) A UK Crown Court convicted him
3)A huge sob story from Leon mitigated the sentence passed
4)He is a sex offender
5)A female Mostwam model was molested
6)Lisa left Leon in August 2020 at which point P.P.H. Ltd was split 60% Leon/ 40% Lisa
7)Leon took 100% ownership 10 days after Lisa left
8)The last accounts show £60k plus AFTER all expenses including wages are paid.
9)Leon confirms Lisa posted when Cassie left
10) Leon confirms Lisa is still an employee
11) Mostwam Al confirms he knew straight after the assault took place
This confirms Mostwam (or really P.P.H. Ltd) is rotten to the core with Al and Lisa joining Leon in being totally complicit in continuing to trade without informing the owner of UMD and taking over two years of income until being caught out by a third party.
Importantly in addition to the girl Leon was found guilty of molesting by a court of law he now states he has another problem with another girl and this is the girl who has approached me.
So that is two girls confirmed by Leon himself.
It isn't that girl who has approached me, nor it is Cassie and none of the girls this girl has put me in touch with are the girl he molested, Cassie or the girl he thinks has come to me.
I will have to stop giving any further information on here regarding the girls I am talking to as they have to now have a discussion themselves,take legal advice on their treatment by Leon.
Reading through the thread it was mentioned that the Jessie (Messy Jessie) or the guy behind her had complained about poor treatment towards the female models so I have asked a producer to find that conversation.
I only now say my heart goes out to the many females on here who now feel like shit about a lot of the responses which are shameful and have also have awful experiences themselves.
So far we've had lots of victim blaming (including by the guilty sex offender) and justification that poor little Leon is the actual victim and that the company producing the WAM content and receiving the income is very separate to Leon. It's not,he's own 100% of it and those 'running' it with him have made the decision to go along with his dishonesty.
How much more does an organisation have to do to be banished in all its forms from UMD?
As someone said manipulating sales figures to improve rank or whatever Messy Jessie did seems extremely tame by comparison. Ok so I'll have to wait now and take a lead from the girls as to what they want to do next regarding legal action.
You aren't to win the argument that people who like MostWam and it's content and want it to continue are by default ok with Leon still being on the platform. Most people here, if not all, have come to the realisation that Leon needs to go. He's a convicted sex offender, and can't stay on the platform, and more serious and sincere efforts should be made to protect all the models that star in wam videos from now on, and to to make sure victims are taken seriously and have their situations dealt with efficiently.
Someone else pointed out that it's not that MostWam in general is being cancelled, but that we are figuring out how to move on, presumably without Leon. Others have also pointed out that MostWam should be able to continue if Leon steps down and hands the ownership to it to someone more responsible, or have a new site entirely, and would also make sense as a punishment for him, although that wouldn't be nearly enough to justify forgiveness, but it would be a start.
As I've said before, the money generated by MostWam that would have gone into Leons pocket, can be sent to various charities that support victims of sexual assault and rape, making MostWam a genuine force for good, as well as going into potential resources that can help safeguard models from predatory producers (hopefully, by making sure they don't exist in the first place by having some sort of sexual assault awareness course that people have to pass in order to become a producer).
Your tone and attitude isn't one of someone who wants to help. It's one of someone that wants to destroy something at any cost, and that's not being helpful. Instead of yelling at each other, let's actually do something productive and helpful for the people you claim to care so much about.
Also, when did Al become a bad guy here?
Al has posted himself to confirm he has known all the time about the sexual assault and the conviction.
Leon has stated that Lisa has known all along too.
They have all misled this Forum and the business has taken thousands of pounds from members on here.
Do you not understand that is unacceptable and from here all trace should be removed?
I personally don't want to help these people, they seem to be vile in supporting what has happened.
Nobody is stopping them carrying on elsewhere. They can do whatever they want in whatever legal way they want.
If YOU want to persuade Leon,Lisa and Al to donate around £130k of profit to various charities plus pay back their wages to charity then I wish you all the luck in the world but do expect to have a face covered in piss as you'll be pissing in the wind.
I hope that shows you there is no ill intent as I don't know these people but I can see the bleeding obvious that if UMD is a professional business that respects its customers and producers then their collective actions must lead to their complete removal from UMD.
I'm pretty sure you're the only one in this thread who thinks Al and Lisa are bad guys here. Do you not understand that MostWam is not the problem here? Leon is, and the two can be separated from each other going forward if Leon's decides to do the right thing, you know that right?
If YOU don't like MostWam, then good for you. Please don't attack anyone who does watch MostWam, and Kelsey herself said she had no problem with MostWam being here or people watching MostWam as long as Leon is out of the equation.
Jesus christ, you talk like a 5 year old throwing a temper tantrum, not a grown adult trying to do help someone. Your aggressive and nasty attitude does not make me want to support you, since it's clear you are a terrible person in reality and are using this situation to try and make yourself look better, but are failing miserably. I never said that all the money they have ever earned should go to charity, just a suggesting that at least some of the earnings at least from now on should go forward to supporting them.
You have shown nothing but ill intent here. You're an angry person trying to violently destroy something, not someone who wants to make this community a better place.
Your own opinion of what should happen is not the "bleeding obvious thing that a professional business that respects its customers" should do, as you have been anything but professional, so I don't know how you think you have any right to lecture others on professionalism.
You typify the reason the girl who told me about the court case didn't want to come on here.
You focus on your material you like to masturbate to and I'll worry about the facts that are now on here.
I haven't actually said I don't like the Mostwam site by the way, just pointing out what Leon has done and how the other staff have covered it up.
No I do not "typify the reason the girl who told you about the court case didn't want to come here". This is obvious because you completely fail to prove this.
You're not going to get anywhere by trying to kinkshame people by saying "You like to masturbate to this type of porn! This is an epic own and totally not childish behaviour!"
Also, what facts are you sticking to exactly? You mean your fan fiction about Al and Lisa? You have literally done nothing here but show your burning hatred for the MostWam brand and anyone who dares enjoy it, despite its hopefully soon to be former owner being an awful person, even if they rightfully disavow him and his actions.
The word misogyny seems to be getting thrown around a lot here at anybody who doesnt want to turn the thread into a which hunt.
To anybody who feels wronged by the fact that news of the conviction wasnt instantly sent to their pm's i ask: Is it really any of your business? Do you really believe that its your right to know? Do you think this information should be thust at everybody?
To anybody talking about precesent or leaving the site because of lack of precedent or whatever i ask: How for would you go? Would you have every member be forced to be varified and have to agree to have regular background checks done to access the site? Would you have convected offenders wear gold stars and have to walk in the gutter just to make you feel safer? Would you vote for the guy who says he would enforce that?
Nobody here has said that sexual offences are ok, but why should it spill here? We have a court sytem to deal with technicalities and judgement. We also have a public record for background checks for people or companies who feel its relevant to them. If you never want to meet a sex offender, avoid all the little dots on the map, but good luck, its a fucking minefield.
To anybody who feels wronged by the fact that news of the conviction wasnt instantly sent to their pm's i ask: Is it really any of your business? Do you really believe that its your right to know? Do you think this information should be thust at everybody?
To anybody talking about precesent or leaving the site because of lack of precedent or whatever i ask: How for would you go? Would you have every member be forced to be varified and have to agree to have regular background checks done to access the site? Would you have convected offenders wear gold stars and have to walk in the gutter just to make you feel safer? Would you vote for the guy who says he would enforce that?
Nobody here has said that sexual offences are ok, but why should it spill here? We have a court sytem to deal with technicalities and judgement. We also have a public record for background checks for people or companies who feel its relevant to them. If you never want to meet a sex offender, avoid all the little dots on the map, but good luck, its a fucking minefield.
Hannah x
Alright, I'm sick of listening to people (men) getting defensive and victim blaming. That's disgusting. Man up and show some fucking respect for the women who put their bodies at risk for your fucking enjoyment. I'm not here for character assassination against Leon, this isn't about Leon, it's about his actions. He is now a registered sex offender and instead of being honest about it and stepping away from the work he's tried to hide it and keep working. And now Penny Banks doesn't feel safe here anymore and wants to leave us, that is unbearable to me, and for all sexual assault survivors this conversation is triggering as fuck.
Regardless of the intention, a person's consent was violated. Leon admitted guilt and avoided jail time. So instead of going to jail, he's banned from the adult community and from doing adult work. This is not being unfair to Leon, this is being fair to the woman who is feeling fear, pain, and rejection for our community right now. This is also setting a standard, which needs to be held very high for the safety of the women who are putting their bodies at risk for your entertainment. Sex work is always a risk, STDs, stalkers, groomers, losing your bank account, not getting any work outside the industry once you've gotten involved, losing the respect and support of your family. You people have no clue what we put on the line as adult performers, it's very high risk. And the lack of compassion for that is heartbreaking, just, heartbreaking.
Just keep this in mind, we're deciding what is more important to this community, the safety of the model/performer or the pride/ego of the producer. And also keep in mind that we models, we performers, we women, we talk. We look out for each other in this industry and we will warn everyone we know about who is unsafe to work with and what communities are unsafe for us. Don't think there are no consequences to your actions, because there always will be. Your actions determine how severe those consequences are. DO BETTER.
Regardless of the intention, a person's consent was violated. Leon admitted guilt and avoided jail time. So instead of going to jail, he's banned from the adult community and from doing adult work. This is not being unfair to Leon, this is being fair to the woman who is feeling fear, pain, and rejection for our community right now. This is also setting a standard, which needs to be held very high for the safety of the women who are putting their bodies at risk for your entertainment. Sex work is always a risk, STDs, stalkers, groomers, losing your bank account, not getting any work outside the industry once you've gotten involved, losing the respect and support of your family. You people have no clue what we put on the line as adult performers, it's very high risk. And the lack of compassion for that is heartbreaking, just, heartbreaking.
Just keep this in mind, we're deciding what is more important to this community, the safety of the model/performer or the pride/ego of the producer. And also keep in mind that we models, we performers, we women, we talk. We look out for each other in this industry and we will warn everyone we know about who is unsafe to work with and what communities are unsafe for us. Don't think there are no consequences to your actions, because there always will be. Your actions determine how severe those consequences are. DO BETTER.
XeniaDressman said:
To anybody talking about precesent or leaving the site because of lack of precedent or whatever i ask: How for would you go? Would you have every member be forced to be varified and have to agree to have regular background checks done to access the site? Would you have convected offenders wear gold stars and have to walk in the gutter just to make you feel safer? Would you vote for the guy who says he would enforce that?
To anybody talking about precesent or leaving the site because of lack of precedent or whatever i ask: How for would you go? Would you have every member be forced to be varified and have to agree to have regular background checks done to access the site? Would you have convected offenders wear gold stars and have to walk in the gutter just to make you feel safer? Would you vote for the guy who says he would enforce that?
The rules of a community are not black and white like this and I don't think anyone is suggesting it should be. I'm sure lots of people you engage with may have questionable things in their past. The point here though is that a situation has come up and a producer sexually assaulted a model (charged and convicted). The model was working for the producer making content to be sold or advertised through UMD. That information is known and so the community has to deal with it. On a personal level that might be people choosing not to do business with mostwam again. On a site level for UMD then MM has to decide what that means. I'd say it would be hard to justify the continuation of selling or linking this producers content.
In more than 20 years here I haven't seen this situation before so it doesn't seem to need constant background checks or other things you are suggesting. But if a situation like this comes up and information is known then it's ok for UMD to say that they don't want to deal with a site where the sole director of the company sexually assaulted one of the models.
VAVAVIE said:
Strange reaction that you are more interested in who I am, where did I get the info from.
I've had thought you would be more concerned about the Mostwam model who was assaulted,the convicted sex offender who assaulted her and the website where they all covered it up,
Oh well takes all sorts.
To answer your questions , what would you like me to do, give my name, address, phone number and email to you or shall we stick to usernames like wanking potato J?
The info about the trail is publicly available at Bristol Crown Court in the UK.
The info about the company that Leon owns 100% of is available on the Companies House website including all documents regarding shares,profit
I posted the information about the court around 4 hours after I was told about it.
Leon and MostwamAl have also posted a lot of information.
Leon has stated it is Lisa on the forum using Lisamoomin and that profile posted about the removal of a certain models content the week of the court case.
So now you have all your answers and sources.
Maybe now focus more on the horrendous actions of some other people rather than dramatically having a go at shooting the messenger.
Potatoman-J said:
Wait, so Lisa and Al are accomplices now? I've been away most of the weekend and just trying to catch up on some of this now. No possibility that someone else (Leon) could have logged into Lisa's account here. He's admitted to using the MostWam one that was previously "Leia" and "Charlotte" before that.
Who are you? Where did you get all this info and when? If you've had it, why now, and now earlier when these things happened?
I understand wanting Leon gone, but now Lisa is the bad guy too?
There is a LOT of information we don't all seem to equally have at our disposal.
VAVAVIE said:
Al has posted himself to confirm he has known all the time about the sexual assault and the conviction.
Leon has stated that Lisa has known all along too.
They have all misled this Forum and the business has taken thousands of pounds from members on here.
Do you not understand that is unacceptable and from here all trace should be removed?
I personally don't want to help these people, they seem to be vile in supporting what has happened.
Nobody is stopping them carrying on elsewhere. They can do whatever they want in whatever legal way they want.
If YOU want to persuade Leon,Lisa and Al to donate around £130k of profit to various charities plus pay back their wages to charity then I wish you all the luck in the world but do expect to have a face covered in piss as you'll be pissing in the wind.
I hope that shows you there is no ill intent as I don't know these people but I can see the bleeding obvious that if UMD is a professional business that respects its customers and producers then their collective actions must lead to their complete removal from UMD.
messyface1994 said:
You aren't to win the argument that people who like MostWam and it's content and want it to continue are by default ok with Leon still being on the platform. Most people here, if not all, have come to the realisation that Leon needs to go. He's a convicted sex offender, and can't stay on the platform, and more serious and sincere efforts should be made to protect all the models that star in wam videos from now on, and to to make sure victims are taken seriously and have their situations dealt with efficiently.
Someone else pointed out that it's not that MostWam in general is being cancelled, but that we are figuring out how to move on, presumably without Leon. Others have also pointed out that MostWam should be able to continue if Leon steps down and hands the ownership to it to someone more responsible, or have a new site entirely, and would also make sense as a punishment for him, although that wouldn't be nearly enough to justify forgiveness, but it would be a start.
As I've said before, the money generated by MostWam that would have gone into Leons pocket, can be sent to various charities that support victims of sexual assault and rape, making MostWam a genuine force for good, as well as going into potential resources that can help safeguard models from predatory producers (hopefully, by making sure they don't exist in the first place by having some sort of sexual assault awareness course that people have to pass in order to become a producer).
Your tone and attitude isn't one of someone who wants to help. It's one of someone that wants to destroy something at any cost, and that's not being helpful. Instead of yelling at each other, let's actually do something productive and helpful for the people you claim to care so much about.
Also, when did Al become a bad guy here?
VAVAVIE said: I'm shocked at some of the male responses on here. I'm amazed any female would like to remain on this Forum. We all like sexual activity but very sinister opinions are flowing from customers and some producers alike. I suggest everybody reads the whole thread before choosing who to spend money with.
Separately though as the person who agreed to speak out about Leon and his companies here are very important bullet points in regards to this man and his company based on fact only and facts given in this thread by Leon and Mostwams 'Al' and facts available in the public domain
1) Leon admits the crime
2) A UK Crown Court convicted him
3)A huge sob story from Leon mitigated the sentence passed
4)He is a sex offender
5)A female Mostwam model was molested
6)Lisa left Leon in August 2020 at which point P.P.H. Ltd was split 60% Leon/ 40% Lisa
7)Leon took 100% ownership 10 days after Lisa left
8)The last accounts show £60k plus AFTER all expenses including wages are paid.
9)Leon confirms Lisa posted when Cassie left
10) Leon confirms Lisa is still an employee
11) Mostwam Al confirms he knew straight after the assault took place
This confirms Mostwam (or really P.P.H. Ltd) is rotten to the core with Al and Lisa joining Leon in being totally complicit in continuing to trade without informing the owner of UMD and taking over two years of income until being caught out by a third party.
Importantly in addition to the girl Leon was found guilty of molesting by a court of law he now states he has another problem with another girl and this is the girl who has approached me.
So that is two girls confirmed by Leon himself.
It isn't that girl who has approached me, nor it is Cassie and none of the girls this girl has put me in touch with are the girl he molested, Cassie or the girl he thinks has come to me.
I will have to stop giving any further information on here regarding the girls I am talking to as they have to now have a discussion themselves,take legal advice on their treatment by Leon.
Reading through the thread it was mentioned that the Jessie (Messy Jessie) or the guy behind her had complained about poor treatment towards the female models so I have asked a producer to find that conversation.
I only now say my heart goes out to the many females on here who now feel like shit about a lot of the responses which are shameful and have also have awful experiences themselves.
So far we've had lots of victim blaming (including by the guilty sex offender) and justification that poor little Leon is the actual victim and that the company producing the WAM content and receiving the income is very separate to Leon. It's not,he's own 100% of it and those 'running' it with him have made the decision to go along with his dishonesty.
How much more does an organisation have to do to be banished in all its forms from UMD?
As someone said manipulating sales figures to improve rank or whatever Messy Jessie did seems extremely tame by comparison. Ok so I'll have to wait now and take a lead from the girls as to what they want to do next regarding legal action.
Separately though as the person who agreed to speak out about Leon and his companies here are very important bullet points in regards to this man and his company based on fact only and facts given in this thread by Leon and Mostwams 'Al' and facts available in the public domain
1) Leon admits the crime
2) A UK Crown Court convicted him
3)A huge sob story from Leon mitigated the sentence passed
4)He is a sex offender
5)A female Mostwam model was molested
6)Lisa left Leon in August 2020 at which point P.P.H. Ltd was split 60% Leon/ 40% Lisa
7)Leon took 100% ownership 10 days after Lisa left
8)The last accounts show £60k plus AFTER all expenses including wages are paid.
9)Leon confirms Lisa posted when Cassie left
10) Leon confirms Lisa is still an employee
11) Mostwam Al confirms he knew straight after the assault took place
This confirms Mostwam (or really P.P.H. Ltd) is rotten to the core with Al and Lisa joining Leon in being totally complicit in continuing to trade without informing the owner of UMD and taking over two years of income until being caught out by a third party.
Importantly in addition to the girl Leon was found guilty of molesting by a court of law he now states he has another problem with another girl and this is the girl who has approached me.
So that is two girls confirmed by Leon himself.
It isn't that girl who has approached me, nor it is Cassie and none of the girls this girl has put me in touch with are the girl he molested, Cassie or the girl he thinks has come to me.
I will have to stop giving any further information on here regarding the girls I am talking to as they have to now have a discussion themselves,take legal advice on their treatment by Leon.
Reading through the thread it was mentioned that the Jessie (Messy Jessie) or the guy behind her had complained about poor treatment towards the female models so I have asked a producer to find that conversation.
I only now say my heart goes out to the many females on here who now feel like shit about a lot of the responses which are shameful and have also have awful experiences themselves.
So far we've had lots of victim blaming (including by the guilty sex offender) and justification that poor little Leon is the actual victim and that the company producing the WAM content and receiving the income is very separate to Leon. It's not,he's own 100% of it and those 'running' it with him have made the decision to go along with his dishonesty.
How much more does an organisation have to do to be banished in all its forms from UMD?
As someone said manipulating sales figures to improve rank or whatever Messy Jessie did seems extremely tame by comparison. Ok so I'll have to wait now and take a lead from the girls as to what they want to do next regarding legal action.
You aren't to win the argument that people who like MostWam and it's content and want it to continue are by default ok with Leon still being on the platform. Most people here, if not all, have come to the realisation that Leon needs to go. He's a convicted sex offender, and can't stay on the platform, and more serious and sincere efforts should be made to protect all the models that star in wam videos from now on, and to to make sure victims are taken seriously and have their situations dealt with efficiently.
Someone else pointed out that it's not that MostWam in general is being cancelled, but that we are figuring out how to move on, presumably without Leon. Others have also pointed out that MostWam should be able to continue if Leon steps down and hands the ownership to it to someone more responsible, or have a new site entirely, and would also make sense as a punishment for him, although that wouldn't be nearly enough to justify forgiveness, but it would be a start.
As I've said before, the money generated by MostWam that would have gone into Leons pocket, can be sent to various charities that support victims of sexual assault and rape, making MostWam a genuine force for good, as well as going into potential resources that can help safeguard models from predatory producers (hopefully, by making sure they don't exist in the first place by having some sort of sexual assault awareness course that people have to pass in order to become a producer).
Your tone and attitude isn't one of someone who wants to help. It's one of someone that wants to destroy something at any cost, and that's not being helpful. Instead of yelling at each other, let's actually do something productive and helpful for the people you claim to care so much about.
Also, when did Al become a bad guy here?
Al has posted himself to confirm he has known all the time about the sexual assault and the conviction.
Leon has stated that Lisa has known all along too.
They have all misled this Forum and the business has taken thousands of pounds from members on here.
Do you not understand that is unacceptable and from here all trace should be removed?
I personally don't want to help these people, they seem to be vile in supporting what has happened.
Nobody is stopping them carrying on elsewhere. They can do whatever they want in whatever legal way they want.
If YOU want to persuade Leon,Lisa and Al to donate around £130k of profit to various charities plus pay back their wages to charity then I wish you all the luck in the world but do expect to have a face covered in piss as you'll be pissing in the wind.
I hope that shows you there is no ill intent as I don't know these people but I can see the bleeding obvious that if UMD is a professional business that respects its customers and producers then their collective actions must lead to their complete removal from UMD.
Wait, so Lisa and Al are accomplices now? I've been away most of the weekend and just trying to catch up on some of this now. No possibility that someone else (Leon) could have logged into Lisa's account here. He's admitted to using the MostWam one that was previously "Leia" and "Charlotte" before that.
Who are you? Where did you get all this info and when? If you've had it, why now, and now earlier when these things happened?
I understand wanting Leon gone, but now Lisa is the bad guy too?
There is a LOT of information we don't all seem to equally have at our disposal.
Strange reaction that you are more interested in who I am, where did I get the info from.
I've had thought you would be more concerned about the Mostwam model who was assaulted,the convicted sex offender who assaulted her and the website where they all covered it up,
Oh well takes all sorts.
To answer your questions , what would you like me to do, give my name, address, phone number and email to you or shall we stick to usernames like wanking potato J?
The info about the trail is publicly available at Bristol Crown Court in the UK.
The info about the company that Leon owns 100% of is available on the Companies House website including all documents regarding shares,profit
I posted the information about the court around 4 hours after I was told about it.
Leon and MostwamAl have also posted a lot of information.
Leon has stated it is Lisa on the forum using Lisamoomin and that profile posted about the removal of a certain models content the week of the court case.
So now you have all your answers and sources.
Maybe now focus more on the horrendous actions of some other people rather than dramatically having a go at shooting the messenger.
1) You're out of your mind if you think people questioning you, or where you got sensitive information from is "strange"
2) If you could read, which you evidently can't, you would easily find out that I have shown nothing but support to not just the victim of this case, but for others as well as anyone who is at risk. What you're trying to do is repeat the same accusations over and over again in hopes they will come true. That will never happen, and you should accept that before further indulging in your delusion.
I would like you to act like a decent human being who can engage in a civilised conversation, without attacking anyone who dares even slightly question you. If even that is too much for you, you really need to revaluate yourself.
3) I've already addressed why you've said here before and I won't repeat myself
4) This entire thread has been doing nothing but focusing on the horrendous actions of certain people. If you can't remember what your own thread is about, that just shows what level you're actually on. This method of repeating false accusation over and over again ad nauseam doesn't work with people who know how to stand up to you.
Also, you have done nothing but be aggressive and be confrontational and angry to anyone who even slightly questions you on this thread. How you can criticise someone for "having a go" at you, is extremely hypocritical.
I don't have much to add that hasn't already been very eloquently stated by KelseyRose, Creamy, and a few others; other than adding my support for their posts.
In the "vanilla" business world (as in non-fetish, not as in custard & cream, you beautiful pervs!), here's how it has to happen (and as mentioned: should have happened here).
- The accused, after an investigation and an admission of, and/or proof of, guilt (whether publicly or not) steps down from their role at the company; usually at the request of the company, but some will step down voluntarily.
- The company issues a statement to employees, customers, and partners as soon as reasonably possible.
- The company provides private channels of communication for the employees, customers, and partners.
The reasons should be clear: to insure trust in the company by it's employees (and this includes contractors), customers, and partners.
It's hard to Mea Culpa when you have to: Something along the lines of "We screwed-up. We apologize to all whom we've caused pain. We've notified everyone of the incident and our response, and have put processes into place to do our best to insure this never happens again." Substitute I for We where appropriate. But it has to happen. It's not only good business but more importantly it's the right thing to do, for everyone.
(As an aside, I am a writer; or at least I like to think I'm a writer. Kelsey, again, takes me to school on eloquence and clarity. Hat tip, once more, for your posts!).
In the "vanilla" business world (as in non-fetish, not as in custard & cream, you beautiful pervs!), here's how it has to happen (and as mentioned: should have happened here).
- The accused, after an investigation and an admission of, and/or proof of, guilt (whether publicly or not) steps down from their role at the company; usually at the request of the company, but some will step down voluntarily.
- The company issues a statement to employees, customers, and partners as soon as reasonably possible.
- The company provides private channels of communication for the employees, customers, and partners.
The reasons should be clear: to insure trust in the company by it's employees (and this includes contractors), customers, and partners.
It's hard to Mea Culpa when you have to: Something along the lines of "We screwed-up. We apologize to all whom we've caused pain. We've notified everyone of the incident and our response, and have put processes into place to do our best to insure this never happens again." Substitute I for We where appropriate. But it has to happen. It's not only good business but more importantly it's the right thing to do, for everyone.
(As an aside, I am a writer; or at least I like to think I'm a writer. Kelsey, again, takes me to school on eloquence and clarity. Hat tip, once more, for your posts!).
MMasia said:
The rules of a community are not black and white like this and I don't think anyone is suggesting it should be. I'm sure lots of people you engage with may have questionable things in their past. The point here though is that a situation has come up and a producer sexually assaulted a model (charged and convicted). The model was working for the producer making content to be sold or advertised through UMD. That information is known and so the community has to deal with it. On a personal level that might be people choosing not to do business with mostwam again. On a site level for UMD then MM has to decide what that means. I'd say it would be hard to justify the continuation of selling or linking this producers content.
In more than 20 years here I haven't seen this situation before so it doesn't seem to need constant background checks or other things you are suggesting. But if a situation like this comes up and information is known then it's ok for UMD to say that they don't want to deal with a site where the sole director of the company sexually assaulted one of the models.
XeniaDressman said:
To anybody talking about precesent or leaving the site because of lack of precedent or whatever i ask: How for would you go? Would you have every member be forced to be varified and have to agree to have regular background checks done to access the site? Would you have convected offenders wear gold stars and have to walk in the gutter just to make you feel safer? Would you vote for the guy who says he would enforce that?
To anybody talking about precesent or leaving the site because of lack of precedent or whatever i ask: How for would you go? Would you have every member be forced to be varified and have to agree to have regular background checks done to access the site? Would you have convected offenders wear gold stars and have to walk in the gutter just to make you feel safer? Would you vote for the guy who says he would enforce that?
The rules of a community are not black and white like this and I don't think anyone is suggesting it should be. I'm sure lots of people you engage with may have questionable things in their past. The point here though is that a situation has come up and a producer sexually assaulted a model (charged and convicted). The model was working for the producer making content to be sold or advertised through UMD. That information is known and so the community has to deal with it. On a personal level that might be people choosing not to do business with mostwam again. On a site level for UMD then MM has to decide what that means. I'd say it would be hard to justify the continuation of selling or linking this producers content.
In more than 20 years here I haven't seen this situation before so it doesn't seem to need constant background checks or other things you are suggesting. But if a situation like this comes up and information is known then it's ok for UMD to say that they don't want to deal with a site where the sole director of the company sexually assaulted one of the models.
Yea i agree, its a shit situation for MM. To ban or not to ban. If ban then how many others is he gunna be asked to ban by the mob? 3 have already been mentioned but i think one was already gone. Thats why i ask how far past the courts they want this to go.
Its ultimately the site owners choice, whatever decision he makes will be percieved as the wrong one but people will have to either learn to not let it bother them or just ignore that one part of that one website.
Hannah x
CreamMeAgain said: Alright, I'm sick of listening to people (men) getting defensive and victim blaming. That's disgusting. Man up and show some fucking respect for the women who put their bodies at risk for your fucking enjoyment. I'm not here for character assassination against Leon, this isn't about Leon, it's about his actions. He is now a registered sex offender and instead of being honest about it and stepping away from the work he's tried to hide it and keep working. And now Penny Banks doesn't feel safe here anymore and wants to leave us, that is unbearable to me, and for all sexual assault survivors this conversation is triggering as fuck.
Regardless of the intention, a person's consent was violated. Leon admitted guilt and avoided jail time. So instead of going to jail, he's banned from the adult community and from doing adult work. This is not being unfair to Leon, this is being fair to the woman who is feeling fear, pain, and rejection for our community right now. This is also setting a standard, which needs to be held very high for the safety of the women who are putting their bodies at risk for your entertainment. Sex work is always a risk, STDs, stalkers, groomers, losing your bank account, not getting any work outside the industry once you've gotten involved, losing the respect and support of your family. You people have no clue what we put on the line as adult performers, it's very high risk. And the lack of compassion for that is heartbreaking, just, heartbreaking.
Just keep this in mind, we're deciding what is more important to this community, the safety of the model/performer or the pride/ego of the producer. And also keep in mind that we models, we performers, we women, we talk. We look out for each other in this industry and we will warn everyone we know about who is unsafe to work with and what communities are unsafe for us. Don't think there are no consequences to your actions, because there always will be. Your actions determine how severe those consequences are. DO BETTER.
Regardless of the intention, a person's consent was violated. Leon admitted guilt and avoided jail time. So instead of going to jail, he's banned from the adult community and from doing adult work. This is not being unfair to Leon, this is being fair to the woman who is feeling fear, pain, and rejection for our community right now. This is also setting a standard, which needs to be held very high for the safety of the women who are putting their bodies at risk for your entertainment. Sex work is always a risk, STDs, stalkers, groomers, losing your bank account, not getting any work outside the industry once you've gotten involved, losing the respect and support of your family. You people have no clue what we put on the line as adult performers, it's very high risk. And the lack of compassion for that is heartbreaking, just, heartbreaking.
Just keep this in mind, we're deciding what is more important to this community, the safety of the model/performer or the pride/ego of the producer. And also keep in mind that we models, we performers, we women, we talk. We look out for each other in this industry and we will warn everyone we know about who is unsafe to work with and what communities are unsafe for us. Don't think there are no consequences to your actions, because there always will be. Your actions determine how severe those consequences are. DO BETTER.
I've typed and deleted responses to this thread and situation many times, but I'm really not in the right headspace to try and be eloquent. My Nan has been rotting in a box for a month, it's her cremation today and I'm experiencing the weirdest extended grief ever.
I just wanted to at least show my support for Penny Banks and Creammeagain's comments and guidance. They are right.
Also I want to make it clear I wish no ill will to Leon, and while (personal opinion) I don't think what happened was from a dark place of intentional harm, it is still more than unacceptable.
I love and enjoy 'competition' from other producers, it makes me try harder and be better. I regularly send other producers enquiries I receive that I don't or can't deal with or even if I think they would be better for the job. I'm a clothed wam fan, so obviously I love Mostwams content as well.
I want everyone to succeed. The more the merrier, and the better the community and standards of content.
But for everyone to succeed this needs to be a safer place for all.
Purpleport will remove a photographer for boundary pushing - doesn't have to be assault, just words.
They know they have to do this or the entire point of their site, the models, will leave.
I firmly believe Mostwam will be fine and still prosper without a umd platform. The fans will always find them, and I think UMD should take a page from Purpleports playbook on safety
They issue guides to anyone signing up as a studio, model or photographer on safety and guidelines, best practices etc, and remove people who get complained about
For anyone who wants to learn more about it I recommend Ariel Anderson's YouTube channel, she's very good at explaining the reasons photographers shouldn't do certain things, from the subtle to the awful. Also more practical safety on site and other things.
I came very close to leaving yesterday. I want to leave. But as mentioned before, I know I am not in the headspace for decisions right now and it's really hard to even hit send on this message
I've been building this for 15 years. I have a lot of content and lovely things planned and I don't want to lose all that work.
I hope I can stop feeling like I should, (via how this is handled) because it is devastating and confusing.
See my sites for tons of other content & coupons
I will say again, I think some of the comments here have been Disturbing to say to least!
I want to continue to support these girls as they want to continue to support us! they are willing to continue working with mostwam, to support our community...
YET we treat anyone that supports mostwam after knowing the "truth" with such disgusted!
I don't believe that these women deserve that... I don't believe I deserve that... I don't believe people deserve that
I want to continue to support these girls as they want to continue to support us! they are willing to continue working with mostwam, to support our community...
YET we treat anyone that supports mostwam after knowing the "truth" with such disgusted!
I don't believe that these women deserve that... I don't believe I deserve that... I don't believe people deserve that
Philippa Forrester Found
Sweet Mithras this is disgusting, not to mention depressing...
OK, a little personal disclosure first: I am not a woman, nor have I ever been the victim of sexual harassment or assault or accused of either. However, I do have around two decades of community management experience, mostly focused around the anime and table-top gaming fandoms (yes, I'm one of THOSE types...). Both of those have, in recent years, suffered heavily both as venues for/sources of sexual malfeasance and due to how various organizations in those fandoms have handled accusations. Thankfully, none of the productions I've been part of have faced such a crisis directly, but I did have the opportunity to directly watch a fiasco unfold centered around a convention in my region (more on this later, though), and I have as a matter of pseudo-professional interest maintained tabs on other, similar scandals.
As a result of that experience, I've learned one thing - it's often the responses of the community that have the most effect on its continued health, even more than the actions of its organizers. Administrative action - that is: banning an undesireable, increasing security, tightening down rules regarding interactions, and so forth - often seems little more than an afterthought compared to the scars left behind by people who think that it's an issue that's OK to take sides on.
It isn't. At all. While some people might (almost reflexively) consider a zero-tolerance policy on the matter excessive, the truth is that it is absolutely necessary in order to protect people who should be considered by all as valued members of the community from being traumatically victimized. What's more, discussions of the topic need to be intensely scrutinized, and sometimes moderated with a heavy hand, in order to weed out elements that serve to enable such abominable behavior. It's not just the perpetrators that give communities a bad name and taint their atmosphere...
...and now I'm watching that unfold right here. Creamy, Penny, and Kelsey have all called it out (edit: and now CandyCustard, too - I took too long writing, it seems), with Penny unfortunately feeling the need to take a step away from the UMD by way of resigning as a moderator. That she shouldn't be made to feel that way should be obvious. The fact that the problems she cited have continued after her heart-wrenching post is inexcusable.
"Where did the information come from?"
"...make your own decision..."
"...witch hunt..."
"...plead out to avoid making a scene..."
"...twisted legal system..."
"...guilty plea is not a guilty verdict..."
"...the person and the company are separate..."
This thread reads like a bloody checklist of bad-faith arguments I've seen too many times before. Especially that last one, and here's where my story about the regional con fiasco comes into play. Almost the same damned thing happened - the convention founder was accused of sexually harassing and assaulting a number of women who were guests and/or attendants at his event (read more here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anime_Matsuri#Controversies as well as https://www.chron.com/life/article/Houston-s-Anime-Matsuri-festival-draws-12789687.php). Anime Matsuri was irrevocably tainted because its founder and organizer used it to enable his abuse, and remains tainted as long as he's involved. The same is true with MostWAM. If Leon can divest himself of his interest in the property, then maybe that can change. Otherwise, if the supposition that he is the sole owner of the property is correct, then I just can't see a way forward for it. Ultimately, it doesn't matter who's behind what account - if, at the end of the day, Leon is the sole owner, then the UMD needs to remove him and everything associated with MostWAM until the situation can be rectified. Until that point, arguing that he can go while it stays is absolutely disingenuous.
It's probably already too late, though. See, like I said, it's actually only tangentially about Leon, or the action (or lack thereof) taken by the administration. It's about the shit that came to the surface when the pond was disturbed. The shroud of the dark side has fallen, and we've all had the chance to see the absolute worst of some of the people around us. We now know who considers the exclusion of a predator "cancel culture", and who is willing to quibble about the definition of "guilty". Who's prepared to derail a very serious discussion by claiming the informant "has an axe to grind", or by debating who's posting from what accounts. Who is ready to defend the indefensible, both now and the next time it comes up. And it will. It always does.
That damage isn't going to go away. MM could have banned Leon and wiped out the MostWAM UMD store while I've been typing this, and it still won't clear away the fact that some very vocal posters here have revealed themselves to be, if I may paraphrase from Kelsey's summary post, "(people) of generally poor character".
As I said, disgusting and depressing.
OK, a little personal disclosure first: I am not a woman, nor have I ever been the victim of sexual harassment or assault or accused of either. However, I do have around two decades of community management experience, mostly focused around the anime and table-top gaming fandoms (yes, I'm one of THOSE types...). Both of those have, in recent years, suffered heavily both as venues for/sources of sexual malfeasance and due to how various organizations in those fandoms have handled accusations. Thankfully, none of the productions I've been part of have faced such a crisis directly, but I did have the opportunity to directly watch a fiasco unfold centered around a convention in my region (more on this later, though), and I have as a matter of pseudo-professional interest maintained tabs on other, similar scandals.
As a result of that experience, I've learned one thing - it's often the responses of the community that have the most effect on its continued health, even more than the actions of its organizers. Administrative action - that is: banning an undesireable, increasing security, tightening down rules regarding interactions, and so forth - often seems little more than an afterthought compared to the scars left behind by people who think that it's an issue that's OK to take sides on.
It isn't. At all. While some people might (almost reflexively) consider a zero-tolerance policy on the matter excessive, the truth is that it is absolutely necessary in order to protect people who should be considered by all as valued members of the community from being traumatically victimized. What's more, discussions of the topic need to be intensely scrutinized, and sometimes moderated with a heavy hand, in order to weed out elements that serve to enable such abominable behavior. It's not just the perpetrators that give communities a bad name and taint their atmosphere...
...and now I'm watching that unfold right here. Creamy, Penny, and Kelsey have all called it out (edit: and now CandyCustard, too - I took too long writing, it seems), with Penny unfortunately feeling the need to take a step away from the UMD by way of resigning as a moderator. That she shouldn't be made to feel that way should be obvious. The fact that the problems she cited have continued after her heart-wrenching post is inexcusable.
"Where did the information come from?"
"...make your own decision..."
"...witch hunt..."
"...plead out to avoid making a scene..."
"...twisted legal system..."
"...guilty plea is not a guilty verdict..."
"...the person and the company are separate..."
This thread reads like a bloody checklist of bad-faith arguments I've seen too many times before. Especially that last one, and here's where my story about the regional con fiasco comes into play. Almost the same damned thing happened - the convention founder was accused of sexually harassing and assaulting a number of women who were guests and/or attendants at his event (read more here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anime_Matsuri#Controversies as well as https://www.chron.com/life/article/Houston-s-Anime-Matsuri-festival-draws-12789687.php). Anime Matsuri was irrevocably tainted because its founder and organizer used it to enable his abuse, and remains tainted as long as he's involved. The same is true with MostWAM. If Leon can divest himself of his interest in the property, then maybe that can change. Otherwise, if the supposition that he is the sole owner of the property is correct, then I just can't see a way forward for it. Ultimately, it doesn't matter who's behind what account - if, at the end of the day, Leon is the sole owner, then the UMD needs to remove him and everything associated with MostWAM until the situation can be rectified. Until that point, arguing that he can go while it stays is absolutely disingenuous.
It's probably already too late, though. See, like I said, it's actually only tangentially about Leon, or the action (or lack thereof) taken by the administration. It's about the shit that came to the surface when the pond was disturbed. The shroud of the dark side has fallen, and we've all had the chance to see the absolute worst of some of the people around us. We now know who considers the exclusion of a predator "cancel culture", and who is willing to quibble about the definition of "guilty". Who's prepared to derail a very serious discussion by claiming the informant "has an axe to grind", or by debating who's posting from what accounts. Who is ready to defend the indefensible, both now and the next time it comes up. And it will. It always does.
That damage isn't going to go away. MM could have banned Leon and wiped out the MostWAM UMD store while I've been typing this, and it still won't clear away the fact that some very vocal posters here have revealed themselves to be, if I may paraphrase from Kelsey's summary post, "(people) of generally poor character".
As I said, disgusting and depressing.
Profile pic from SexyMessyBabes, co-starring me.
So, this information has been known for several days now and Leon still hasn't been banned from UMD. Why?
All flesh is equal when gunged.
MostWam AL said: I'd just like to say my girlfriend Poppy from mostwam who is a model is outraged at the hate and comments on this thread. Maybe it's because you don't really know the people involved.
Her and her friends work for us and are comfortable working for us knowing what they know. They have heard about the case along the way with necessary updates.
One girl who works for us knows the girl involved in this case, she doesn't trust her and continues to work for us feeling safe.
Just because I have an account on this forum doesn't make me responsible for posting personal matters. I'm here to work and check comments etc and interact as a person not to feed personal information to the public forum.
In my opinionalthough it's a business it's not just about money, I work hard to create content to give customers content I hope they enjoy. we don't withhold information because of profits. It's a private matter that went to court and went public, it's up to the public to see that not us promote it.
I Speak for myself and not the company as whole really, it's not for me to talk about these details.
I understand why people maybe shook, shocked by the information about the case but it has now been settled in court by a plea of guilt due to bad advice.
The original poster of this is feeding from a model with a vendetta because she wasn't given work. With vage information and claims.
So ask yourself if the girls in the real world here in person understand what has happened, one knows the girl, and are happy to work for us, is it really as it seams?
I understand if you guys want to deplatform some involved but to do it to all of us is a bit far and looses faith in what I thought was a good community. It's no up to me, it's not my responsibility to inform you of details a which I have no right to share and talk about.
Like people say where does it stop, are you going to hate on the models who in person are comfortable working still when they know what has happened ?
Poppy says be kind x
Her and her friends work for us and are comfortable working for us knowing what they know. They have heard about the case along the way with necessary updates.
One girl who works for us knows the girl involved in this case, she doesn't trust her and continues to work for us feeling safe.
Just because I have an account on this forum doesn't make me responsible for posting personal matters. I'm here to work and check comments etc and interact as a person not to feed personal information to the public forum.
In my opinionalthough it's a business it's not just about money, I work hard to create content to give customers content I hope they enjoy. we don't withhold information because of profits. It's a private matter that went to court and went public, it's up to the public to see that not us promote it.
I Speak for myself and not the company as whole really, it's not for me to talk about these details.
I understand why people maybe shook, shocked by the information about the case but it has now been settled in court by a plea of guilt due to bad advice.
The original poster of this is feeding from a model with a vendetta because she wasn't given work. With vage information and claims.
So ask yourself if the girls in the real world here in person understand what has happened, one knows the girl, and are happy to work for us, is it really as it seams?
I understand if you guys want to deplatform some involved but to do it to all of us is a bit far and looses faith in what I thought was a good community. It's no up to me, it's not my responsibility to inform you of details a which I have no right to share and talk about.
Like people say where does it stop, are you going to hate on the models who in person are comfortable working still when they know what has happened ?
Poppy says be kind x
You've lost faith in a community because people want the women who appear in the content we enjoy to be safe from sexual predators?
Behave.
Your concern is the impact this has on revenue streams into MostWAM. That's your priority. And it's clear that MostWAM, sadly, is quite a shady operation.
"Be kind"? How's about you take a leaf out of your own book? MostWAM should have removed Leon from operations and been transparent about the situation. You'd have seen kindness then. Instead, you hid a sexual predator and continued to work with him in the exact environment that he offended within.
Absolutely rancid.
All is love 👌🏻
MostWam AL said: I'd just like to say my girlfriend Poppy from mostwam who is a model is outraged at the hate and comments on this thread. Maybe it's because you don't really know the people involved.
Her and her friends work for us and are comfortable working for us knowing what they know. They have heard about the case along the way with necessary updates.
One girl who works for us knows the girl involved in this case, she doesn't trust her and continues to work for us feeling safe.
Just because I have an account on this forum doesn't make me responsible for posting personal matters. I'm here to work and check comments etc and interact as a person not to feed personal information to the public forum.
In my opinionalthough it's a business it's not just about money, I work hard to create content to give customers content I hope they enjoy. we don't withhold information because of profits. It's a private matter that went to court and went public, it's up to the public to see that not us promote it.
I Speak for myself and not the company as whole really, it's not for me to talk about these details.
I understand why people maybe shook, shocked by the information about the case but it has now been settled in court by a plea of guilt due to bad advice.
The original poster of this is feeding from a model with a vendetta because she wasn't given work. With vage information and claims.
So ask yourself if the girls in the real world here in person understand what has happened, one knows the girl, and are happy to work for us, is it really as it seams?
I understand if you guys want to deplatform some involved but to do it to all of us is a bit far and looses faith in what I thought was a good community. It's no up to me, it's not my responsibility to inform you of details a which I have no right to share and talk about.
Like people say where does it stop, are you going to hate on the models who in person are comfortable working still when they know what has happened ?
Poppy says be kind x
Her and her friends work for us and are comfortable working for us knowing what they know. They have heard about the case along the way with necessary updates.
One girl who works for us knows the girl involved in this case, she doesn't trust her and continues to work for us feeling safe.
Just because I have an account on this forum doesn't make me responsible for posting personal matters. I'm here to work and check comments etc and interact as a person not to feed personal information to the public forum.
In my opinionalthough it's a business it's not just about money, I work hard to create content to give customers content I hope they enjoy. we don't withhold information because of profits. It's a private matter that went to court and went public, it's up to the public to see that not us promote it.
I Speak for myself and not the company as whole really, it's not for me to talk about these details.
I understand why people maybe shook, shocked by the information about the case but it has now been settled in court by a plea of guilt due to bad advice.
The original poster of this is feeding from a model with a vendetta because she wasn't given work. With vage information and claims.
So ask yourself if the girls in the real world here in person understand what has happened, one knows the girl, and are happy to work for us, is it really as it seams?
I understand if you guys want to deplatform some involved but to do it to all of us is a bit far and looses faith in what I thought was a good community. It's no up to me, it's not my responsibility to inform you of details a which I have no right to share and talk about.
Like people say where does it stop, are you going to hate on the models who in person are comfortable working still when they know what has happened ?
Poppy says be kind x
There's two sides to a story of course but I'm am sorry for pointing the finger. I don't know the truth and neither do a lot of key board warriors on here. I want to see the company keep on going. There are a lot of jobs create by this company and it shouldn't be brought down by one persons wrong doing if it's true or not.
Keep on going mostwam and be kind people.
The Lost One said:
I've been doing my best not to comment anymore then I had. I felt I had expressed my view fairly and kindly, but I do have to ask this.
Why were the procedures not in place before this. MostWam has been going for 20 years, it's not a one person job, it's a legitimate business, with an office and staff, many who seem like responsible and upstanding people.
Why did it take a sexual assault charge for procedures to protect models safety to be put in place?
Hindsight is 20-20 but with everything that has come to light with so many industries in the last decade, it just doesn't feel like something that should have been passed over.
MostWam AL said:
I lost faith in the community when I saw the response on this thread. Because people are hating on everyone involved not just Leon.
Mostwam isn't a shady operation it's the most professional wam business there is and many know that, no company is perfect, but this as mentioned many times was handled with by the police and the courts.
Is that not the proper way?
We didn't allow it to continue, we put procedures in place and hired a HR company, have a 90 page handbook written about guidelines for working for us. That's probably longer than most company's guidelines.
Leon's involvement is mostly as a director, he isnt actually that involved in a lot of filming. It's mainly Lisa and me that are running things 90% of the time.
BoRnSloppy said:
You've lost faith in a community because people want the women who appear in the content we enjoy to be safe from sexual predators?
Behave.
Your concern is the impact this has on revenue streams into MostWAM. That's your priority. And it's clear that MostWAM, sadly, is quite a shady operation.
"Be kind"? How's about you take a leaf out of your own book? MostWAM should have removed Leon from operations and been transparent about the situation. You'd have seen kindness then. Instead, you hid a sexual predator and continued to work with him in the exact environment that he offended within.
Absolutely rancid.
MostWam AL said: I'd just like to say my girlfriend Poppy from mostwam who is a model is outraged at the hate and comments on this thread. Maybe it's because you don't really know the people involved.
Her and her friends work for us and are comfortable working for us knowing what they know. They have heard about the case along the way with necessary updates.
One girl who works for us knows the girl involved in this case, she doesn't trust her and continues to work for us feeling safe.
Just because I have an account on this forum doesn't make me responsible for posting personal matters. I'm here to work and check comments etc and interact as a person not to feed personal information to the public forum.
In my opinionalthough it's a business it's not just about money, I work hard to create content to give customers content I hope they enjoy. we don't withhold information because of profits. It's a private matter that went to court and went public, it's up to the public to see that not us promote it.
I Speak for myself and not the company as whole really, it's not for me to talk about these details.
I understand why people maybe shook, shocked by the information about the case but it has now been settled in court by a plea of guilt due to bad advice.
The original poster of this is feeding from a model with a vendetta because she wasn't given work. With vage information and claims.
So ask yourself if the girls in the real world here in person understand what has happened, one knows the girl, and are happy to work for us, is it really as it seams?
I understand if you guys want to deplatform some involved but to do it to all of us is a bit far and looses faith in what I thought was a good community. It's no up to me, it's not my responsibility to inform you of details a which I have no right to share and talk about.
Like people say where does it stop, are you going to hate on the models who in person are comfortable working still when they know what has happened ?
Poppy says be kind x
Her and her friends work for us and are comfortable working for us knowing what they know. They have heard about the case along the way with necessary updates.
One girl who works for us knows the girl involved in this case, she doesn't trust her and continues to work for us feeling safe.
Just because I have an account on this forum doesn't make me responsible for posting personal matters. I'm here to work and check comments etc and interact as a person not to feed personal information to the public forum.
In my opinionalthough it's a business it's not just about money, I work hard to create content to give customers content I hope they enjoy. we don't withhold information because of profits. It's a private matter that went to court and went public, it's up to the public to see that not us promote it.
I Speak for myself and not the company as whole really, it's not for me to talk about these details.
I understand why people maybe shook, shocked by the information about the case but it has now been settled in court by a plea of guilt due to bad advice.
The original poster of this is feeding from a model with a vendetta because she wasn't given work. With vage information and claims.
So ask yourself if the girls in the real world here in person understand what has happened, one knows the girl, and are happy to work for us, is it really as it seams?
I understand if you guys want to deplatform some involved but to do it to all of us is a bit far and looses faith in what I thought was a good community. It's no up to me, it's not my responsibility to inform you of details a which I have no right to share and talk about.
Like people say where does it stop, are you going to hate on the models who in person are comfortable working still when they know what has happened ?
Poppy says be kind x
You've lost faith in a community because people want the women who appear in the content we enjoy to be safe from sexual predators?
Behave.
Your concern is the impact this has on revenue streams into MostWAM. That's your priority. And it's clear that MostWAM, sadly, is quite a shady operation.
"Be kind"? How's about you take a leaf out of your own book? MostWAM should have removed Leon from operations and been transparent about the situation. You'd have seen kindness then. Instead, you hid a sexual predator and continued to work with him in the exact environment that he offended within.
Absolutely rancid.
I lost faith in the community when I saw the response on this thread. Because people are hating on everyone involved not just Leon.
Mostwam isn't a shady operation it's the most professional wam business there is and many know that, no company is perfect, but this as mentioned many times was handled with by the police and the courts.
Is that not the proper way?
We didn't allow it to continue, we put procedures in place and hired a HR company, have a 90 page handbook written about guidelines for working for us. That's probably longer than most company's guidelines.
Leon's involvement is mostly as a director, he isnt actually that involved in a lot of filming. It's mainly Lisa and me that are running things 90% of the time.
I've been doing my best not to comment anymore then I had. I felt I had expressed my view fairly and kindly, but I do have to ask this.
Why were the procedures not in place before this. MostWam has been going for 20 years, it's not a one person job, it's a legitimate business, with an office and staff, many who seem like responsible and upstanding people.
Why did it take a sexual assault charge for procedures to protect models safety to be put in place?
Hindsight is 20-20 but with everything that has come to light with so many industries in the last decade, it just doesn't feel like something that should have been passed over.
The same could be said about many risks / threats or incidents of any nature in any business. Anything from a trip hazard upwards is a learning opportunity and some of the most comprehensive policies, procedures and routines only come into being because of incidents gone by. Surely dwelling on the whys and wherefores of previous operational procedure isn't going to get anyone anywhere now.
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