I've been a member on and off for a number of years within this community, however, the last couple of years has, for me personally, seen UMD die a death. All the major WAM "models" have either left, don't post regularly, are involved in drama which inevitably makes its way to forums, or some other reason. Whilst not for me admittedly, half the site is bombarded with AI/synthetic images.

The main WAM models nowadays are more active on OnlyFans generally (again, not for me). I used to love coming on here, seeing new models open up to a new fetish, posting about how much fun they have. It seems now that any new "model" only wants to profiteer from their pics and vids.

Can completely forget talking to someone if you're a guy seeking a female about a mutual fetish and who knows one day maybe meet up - Fet is far easier for this.

What does everyone think? (There are exceptions, MessyGirl, Hotwam I'm looking at you as examples)

Hi! UMD'er for 26.5 years,here!

While UMD has it's ebbs and flows, I still consider it an invaluable hub for this fetish.

I think the expansion of the UMD user base over the years has had some unintended consequences. For me, I learned that I'm not nearly as interested in everybody else's WAM fetish as I am my own. So nowadays the only threads I click on are either meta threads about the UMD (like this one), threads about the business/creativity of WAM, or threads about clothes filling. 90% of threads here are very much not that.

Then the UMD has made it so that anyone can throw an mp4 on their store and call themselves a producer, which I know sounds very gatekeep-y. But I'm sorry: if the quality of WAM videos has gone down due to a lower barrier of entry--and it has--I'm not going to want to stick around to see how much lower it can go.

Bottom line, I don't want to take away from anything MM has built. I don't care how niche WAM is. To have your site be the definitive resource for all things WAM is outstanding. But in practice it's an ever-growing sausage fest of poor social skills and fly-by-night bathroom shooters churning out poor content. IMHO, not quite the attractive proposition compared to when there were fewer of us but everyone knew how to write in complete sentences and those who tried to make their own content put an honest effort into it.

No disrespect to anyone, but I am tired of seeing the same small pool of UK models filming for almost everyone. With Honour and Satine having retired, that pool is even smaller now.

I've never come here to see models or videos. I come here as it's a safe place to talk to other people with similar interests.

Yes, it has.

1. Been a user for 22 years on and off, my wife used to have an account too. The last 15 years and the transformation of the forums from a chat forum and platform to plug subscription sites with samples, to a download hub which aimed to be the internet's central WAM porn shop (so that the owner could take passive income from it), has over time brought it to its knees. Year after year there have been layers upon layers of increasingly draconian rules enforced upon regular users in order to appease the mysterious 'paymasters' who administrate transactions, without ever consulting users as to whether the tradeoff is acceptable to them, all so the site can take its percentage cut. When the 'no references to kids shows that haven't been on for over 20 years anyway and which no kids alive today have ever heard of' rule came in that was harsh enough, but the requirements for the ID verification were a step too far for a lot of people - we are in a situation now where amateurs cannot post material here unless they send a stranger on the internet highly sensitive documents through a non-encrypted network. Well of course it's in decline. A chat forum for a sexual fetish that is supposed to promote sensory liberation is now unbearably hostile and chilling for any wannabe contributors.

2. Harassment to female members. Still happening, still terrible, still being swept under the carpet. Still living under the cloud of producers having their transgressions covered up and being treated favourably because they brought/bring in income to UMD - the reason a lot of prominent female members fled a few years ago never to return. The more money you bring in, the more you get away with.

3. Being a pirate's/trader's dream. Because UMD's download based business model is still stuck in the 2000s, and based around non-DRM-protected downloads of uncompressed clones of the ACTUAL MASTER FILES of scenes, in a new world where dozens of tube sites exist, it is the source of most of the web's pirated WAM content. It takes one person to buy one scene off here once, upload it to a tube site (they don't need verification of course), and it's there pretty much forever on sites much more mainstream than this. This piracy vulnerability is continually stated by new producers/members (esp female ones) as a reason for quitting or deleting stores and moving to streaming subscription models like OnlyFans. Nothing is done about it. There was lip service once about a reporting network, but that was when there was one big tube site - now there are two dozen sites about that cannot be contacted about removals. And all the files originate from the download stores on here.

4. The increasing percentage of disgusting content. Fake shit (oh sorry "alternative farm clay"), fake vomit, a fake baby (?!), rotten food, pet food, fish, offal, force feeding, models gagging or feeling ill, 'extreme' everything. It did not used to be like this here. Even savory was rare. Extreme BDSM content like this is bodysnatching the fetish from the sweet food/paint/mud/slime dominance of before. You can't show new partners this website. It's not fun and sexy, it's harsh and frightening. It's turning into real dark web stuff. If you are scrolling through it's like Russian roulette about whether you'll see something so disgusting you will want to immediately close the tab. We are continually told that we can't have a "gross/savory" checkbox/filter because it is too technically difficult (even though we can have filters for gender and AI?), but the main reason is that it would further expose just how little 'pleasant' WAM is on here now.

5. Zero engagement. Because all the casual users have been scared off, and all the women get harrassed, posts hardly ever get replies anyway. So if a girl WERE to send a scan of their passport and bank statements to the site in order to upload something, they would have no positive engagement (the replies used to go onto multiple pages!), except the four guys who would message to harrass them, and the one sleaze who buys the sole copy of the scene to pirate on Reddit where somebody puts it on a widely seen tube site where it cannot be taken down. Worth it? No wonder they're all on OnlyFans or TikTok.

The site has been dying for years. It's pretty much done for now.

Yep, once producers who were creeps were protected here that was about the last gasp among a lot of folks.

I pretty much keep an account to give likes on pictures on occasion to somewhat keep folks around and that's very rare now. I've left multiple times for how some producers talk to others on here, but always come back since it was the first place I ever found a community.

Underrated point. And this is the tradeoff of opening your site--and aforementioned passive income generator--to more and more people. Yeah, kink-shaming is wrong but fuuuuuuuuuuuck if I ever show UMD to anyone anymore as an example of WAM. I cringe whenever I share any of my work here because why the hell would I want my relatively-tame-in-comparison content sharing space with gross-out brutal imagery? You can make your tent as big as possible, but guilt by association still matters to some.

You can easily remove all the AI content if you don't want to see it:
Go to the Messy Forum
Top-right of the screen you'll see three pull-downs, one for gender, one for synthetic/natural, and one for explicit or not.
Set the middle one to "natural". All correctly tagged AI content will now be blocked, which will remove 99% of it from your view. And if you find any AI content that isn't tagged, click the Report link on it and let the mods know, we'll sort it.

As to the rest, the world has changed over the last three decades and UMD has changed with it. The on-line fetish environment in 2025 is very different to what it was in 1998, and the biggest change is that it is now much easier for models to self-produce and run their own stores instead of having to rely on (mostly male) producers to do all the technical stuff. Though having said that, some of the people I work with have specifically said they prefer to have the protection of a male producer between them and the world at large, to fend off all the inappropriate messaging and exhausting bad chat-up attempts disguised as custom enquiries that they'd otherwise have to deal with.

I gather the appeal of OnlyFans and similar sites for self-producing female models is that they can restrict interactions to paying subscribers only, ensuring there is some kind of definite return for the time they put in. Threads here warning new models about time-wasters who'll try and engage them in hours of conversation while never actually buying anything have been a thing for years. We live in a world where everything is monetised, and that's not the fault of UMD, it's just the way the world has moved. TBH a potential way to persuade more female models to return would be if MM set up an arrangement where only subscribers to their content could message or interact with models, or reply to their forum threads. Not sure how feasible that would be with the current codebase though.

I've no idea how effective the personals forum is at helping people to date, while most threads appear on the surface to go unanswered, I gather in fact responding by PM is a big feature there. But the fact is, just about any woman who puts up fetish pics (of any fetish, not just WAM) does so in order to generate sales of content. That doesn't mean there aren't genuine female fetishists out there, but they'll mostly be lurking in the shadows to avoid being run down by the stampede of predators that would happen if they revealed themselves. This is something that young women now are much more aware of than the young women of 20 or 30 years ago were, which is a good thing, though at the same time heartbreaking to realise just how viciously misogynistic an awful lot of society still is. I grew up in the 70s and 80s beleving in total gender equality. Yeah, right.

I've been here since the start but never regarded UMD as a place to meet wam women, but rather somewhere where those of us who have this fetish can be open and honest about it, and make and purchase content. Most of those of us who have "wam partners" didn't meet them here, or on any fetish site, but rather met and hit it off with someone in general life, who then turned out to be open to a wam relationship.

This is a very good summing up with very valid points.
I remember here as being somewhere to check daily. Now I might look in once or twice a month.
I go straight for the pictures archive to see if there is anything worth looking at. There rarely is these days and it's difficult not be totally cynical about the models and whoever is pulling the strings behind them when there has been bad behaviour from so many. There are producers still on here who various models have said in private they think are pervo's but they needed the money. Occasionally one of these producers gets properly caught out but the aggressive defence of their behaviour has driven models away from here.
When a new model appears you can't help but be suspicious of the true story behind their 'newly discovered love of WAM' . There was one new model in the last couple of years I thought was genuinely into WAM and it wasn't all about the money and recognition but like most in recent times they are unreliable and their prices hugely increased.
The Only Fans type scenario is a much easier and cheaper way to get exactly what you want on a custom without the model pretending they are a lifetime wammer.
Having said all of this I don't think it takes away from the very hard work that it must take to have created a site like UMD and keep it going. It's just that the standard of external content has gone downhill or has becoming repetitive plus so many established names have left,retired or been exposed as awful people.
Sad but true.
What is very noticeable is how infrequently a pie in the face or gunging of a lovely female celebrity on maintream tv happens these days as well.
So I would say the input to the UMD is not what it was but not sure how anybody can control or improve that input.

In what way is banning anything invoving or made-for kids "harsh"? It doesn't matter whether any modern kids have heard of them or not - "if it was made for chidren it's not appropriate for an adult sexual forum" is hardly a major leap of logic.

And the ID requirement only applies for explicit content, non-verified accounts are still free to post as much non-explicit content as they like. Given the requirement on explicit content massively reduces the opportunities for revenge porn and unauthorised uploads or unwilling models, how is that a bad thing?

And point of order - the upload connection is encrypted, the whole site is https. So no-one using wireshark or equivalent somewhere between you and the site servers is going to get any unencrypted documents.


The producer who got convicted of an offence got booted along with all his associates, and multiple of the more vociferously nasty accounts got booted too. Given that was probably the world's biggest wam producer at the time, doesn't look as if income meant got away with anything.


I once made the mistake of buying DRM-content from one of Japan's major producers. Then a few years later I upgraded (from Windows 2003 to Windows 7) and have never been able to watch that content since. So I wouldn't thank you for DRM and I suspect most other buyers wouldn't either. And given that anyone can just point their phone at the screen to video anything they are watching, even making things streaming-only isn't going to make any difference.

On the other hand if you do have technical solutions, why not start a thread discussing them?

I do see that the OF model where only paying subscribers can message or otherwise interact with the model will be more appealing in terms of models avoiding timewasters, perhaps that's something UMD should look at adding?


Ok, here we're on the same page, TBH (and speaking entirely personally), I would ban anything at all that featured the active use of a toilet (even if it was just full of custard), and I would like to see a gross filter and a way for people to flag gross content that would automatically apply the tag if say more than 5 people clicked it - so no need to wait for a mod to act, just auto-tag as gross anything the community says is gross. So with you there.


The engagement that matters is sales, not forum thread replies. Yeah, it's a bit disappointing when you post a promo and no-one replies to it but I can remember when even the biggest producers would have threads like that so it's nothing new. Foums are seen as a bit old-fashioned compared to feed-based systems like FB and X, younger folk are less used to the forum format, and it is noticable that there's less forum activity than there once was. But forums are not the be-all and end-all, I can remember when there weren't any forums here.

And as I mentioned before, the ID requirements only apply to explicit content, and are common to all commercial sites that allow user-generated content. Ok, if a site is non-commercial and hence doesn't have any billers then it could avoid such restrictions, but a) that'd open the door to all kinds of illegal content like revenge porn and b) the bandwidth bills would be enormous, how would those be paid for?

Now, see, I was thinking of posting something, but I figgered it was ME -- too old, too out of touch.

I don't like the really hardcore porn stuff, which is increasing. I don't like girl-on-girl, which is increasing. I keep posting my AI stuff in the AI forum but see others posting it in Messy and Wet, which I thought was only for material with real-life victims, while my stuff is ignored in the AI group.

More and more the messy stuff is slime rather than pies. Guess many of you grew up with Nikkelodeon; I grew up with the Stooges. Or maybe slime is just easier.

I rarely see women pied or soaked (or both) while wearing formal outfits and godd-forbid long gloves, so I figgered I was just not in tune with the times. (I know I'm out of step on tattoos and piercings, neither of which I like. In fact I wont buy anything with piercings)

So maybe as DungeonMasterOne said, the UMD is evolving and this dinosaur is not. Guess that's life.

Have been on here daily for 26+ years. I think messy fetishes are waning overall. Too much stimulus for the younger generation. Hope for a rebound, Don't see any Lenny's, Rich's (not sure how to pluralize), Jayce's, Mostwam's, Messygirl's, etc, in the farm system. AI is a consistent alternative.

Yep!

I dont see onlyfans as a replacement for the umd, i see it as less permemant competition. All it would take is for them to raise their rates too much (like twitch did) for models/producers to look somewhere else, then the umd looks a bit better as a long term wam kink focused option with direct personal help from the owner.

I think there are things with the UMD that have changed and things that have stayed the same. I think that life and social media have a lot to do with it. This was the social media type site for a bit. Then when other sites came along more attention went to those places. Then there is the boogie man called the card processing companies that cause various rules to be put in place. Sometimes more strict than I think they need to be. But there are some things I am glad they brought. In the same vein as some of the other discussions that have happened around appropriateness of someone with a fetish tricking people into participating, the no kids is and should be a hard line. I understand the nostalgia around discovering this fetish during puberty and some things being frozen in time so to say. The desire to be that age again and discovering this for the first time and expanding your fetishes. The age difference was more appropriate then. There is no world where enjoying content that was not produced as fetish content that has kids in it is spank bank material.

I think that one of the things that has lead to the exodus and reduced commenting we are seeing is the wait and see what the community thinks mentality that exists here. There are some things that should be a hard line no and no matter how much the community debates the topic, there needs to be lines. People debate the meaning of no kids every few months, if that can have a hard line, other things need to as well.

The DRM approach is still a 10 year old solution to the problem of piracy. The most popular and common app for streaming on all the major platforms is free. It functions like a VCR's record button. There is really no way to combat piracy. If people are motivated enough to do it, they will find a way. The one thing about the internet and advancements in technology is that people find a way to archive. If I am remembering correctly, Nintendo ended up using people's ROMs with their NES and SNES mini consoles that came out a few years ago. People wanted to preserve games so they could enjoy them forever. I think that the subscription model is the best one, it does not combat the piracy aspect of things, but it does solve the archive situation. For those around in the subscription times that are selling individual downloadable movies, do you see an increase in piracy now VS then? For those that are only doing the subscription model here, do you see piracy and how bad is it if you do?

I don't know that I would say the UMD had its day, it outlasted pretty much everyone else except newsgroups. There are more platforms out there than there used to be. People have learned that the UMD is not the only way to do things. I think instead of talking about if the UMD is on life support, we could look at what the other methods people are using do that is not done at the UMD and if that should change. There is no difference between a forum thread, a tweet thread, bluesky thread etc. The difference is in how the threads are viewed, replied to and the privacy around them. A lot of social media companies are going to a model where you can block who can and cannot see your threads. That not logging into a place will not allow you to see posts that are made on accounts from people that have blocked you. Yes I know there is a box that can be checked to make a thread private, I think that should be the default. You could talk about one username per IP address setup unless you have a store or husband/wife, roomates shared internet etc. But there are also ways around all of that. I think the biggest way to combat the creepers that slide into DM's is to stop protecting them. We also need to do more as a community to make people feel safe being here and contributing. If people are harassed and don't report it and leave instead, it does not help root out the problem. But, there is also that line where when your inbox is flooded with vile human beings that you figure it is not worth the effort and say fuck it and leave. The features of only being able to message women if you are friends being the default is a great change towards that. Unfortunately, there are people that make accounts just for that. Nothing in their bio and very few posts or post all positive and hide who they are. Then the friend request is sent and the damage gets done. I think that when someone leaves, since MM can read all the messages anyways, maybe spot check some and see if there are usernames that have messaged the person that left with shitty behavior. Then create a list of those users and look at who else they are messaging. If the messages are the same, kick the shitheads out.

I think the site is great-
We also have to remember we went from seeing pictures/videos on a monthly basis to an almost daily/hourly basis. We have more content then ever before.
The only downsides are really two-
1- People who are here from a financial upside who are just here to sell content and don't really have any interest in sharing with the community unless you will get into the paywall.
2- People who just rummage the site and want to re upload content they like to other socials to "share"

I've had some of the best meetups- and been able to enjoy some great people on this site. Plenty of good real people on here.
I think the site is what you make into it.

Has UMD had it's day?

No.

I have been here 26.5 years and so much has changed, UMD has only gotten better in many ways. This is thanks to the producers, the admins/MM and technology improving. We now have better quality shoots, from more people and more often. UMD is the best place to promote that as every WAMmer ends up here eventually.

BUT

Things change, other sites appear, it is now harder to make money as models cost the same but competition drives down prices or forces producers to improve. Good for the customer but producers can't all do that so quit, as it their right, they owe us nothing.

UMD needs to change with the times and evolve as a site, it does so slowly.
Laws make things tougher and have to be obeyed or risk shutting the whole site down.

Are there problems with UMD, god yes, every site has them. The vast majority of folks on here are men and due to anonymity and ability to create a new profile in minutes, means harassment of the few women brave enough to appear is constant. Worse, some of the men don't realise they are harassing. This happens on all websites with interactions and I don't know how to stop it. Calling folks out doesn't work as the harassers don't care about others opinions. But that is another debate.

UMD will continue as long as MM runs it, the laws allow it and people like WAM content. Other sites will pop up, fill a niche, and they will have some of the traffic too. Tastes will change and thus content will change (I remember someone using catfood for the first time and 95% of folks said it was revolting, now it's seen fortnightly), this is natural, unstoppable and you either get cantankerous about change or you embrace it, even if it isn't your thing...you know, the way we do with music.

Here's to another 26.5 years, I guess.
Silver sea: 3 wombats and a sloth in a trench coat, skewing metrics since the 1970s.

Perhaps this is just a can't see the forest for the trees thing, UMD still seems the universal meeting place and I'm not seeing any sign of decline. The times are always changing and generations exchanging and yet UMD has manage to still stay not only afloat, but still maintain its position as the #1 place to find this type of content and meet others into it. No debate about it for me, isn't there a song about this, "I don't care what they may say, I don't care what they may do, UMD is just alright with me!"

This is absolutely untrue. Trying to let this thread run without engaging too much, but a lot of this stuff is just completely wrong and I couldn't just not acknowledge it.

Sounds a little like me. I still come to the UMD every day so it can't be so bad off. But I missed the forum aspect of the site, which I think has nosedived. Good conversation-- particularly about mainstream WAM-- don't happen that often.
Also, for a pie fan, there are a few good producers keeping the flame (Rich (of course), Messygirl, TMTWTS, etc.) but the quality and quantity of good content has declined. Some model lightly pieing herself in the face with a little whipped cream on a paper plate, filmed with a phone, is not my idea of good content.

Like Sleazoid said, I find much of the content on UMD does nothing for me.
I like and make some AI, but there is nothing like the real thing.

I also like formal and enjoy messy women in stockings and suspenders.
Perhaps i just need to accept that i am getting older, and still enjoy more old fashioned mess.
(Three stooges, Sticky Tara and Clown Julie are more my thing).

I prefer Co-ed mess, rather than girl/girl.

I still enjoy using UMD to find like minded people to chat to.

I my feeling is umd IS better or NOT worse than it was when I first found it in 2000.
My memory is starting to fad but I recall just having links to different sites like actual producers or people who just posted appreciation pics.

I don't remember having a profile until years later think after a break up I got one maybe mid 2000s? But I recall mostly men doing the posting and really bad toxic shit was being said at times.

Now we can Flag things (maybe we could then and I don't remember) but also I know now people are speaking out about behaviors are problematic.

I'd say while not perfect lgbt people seem to be posting more which before I'd argue unless a lady with a lady scene people would complain. Now we can tag different preferences so if people only prefer certain styles they can have that while letting others play.

I will admit I was less open to really messy sloppy wam and savory wam but over time have become into it, largely because of tigger benson and her super messy savory and sweet / super messed up scenes. But seeing another Asian person I bought her scenes just cause she's hot and wanted to support another azn person.

Things always change and while nothing perfect I feel this place is far safer than fetlife, I know they protect abusers and even people stealing pictures and pretending to be other people. Here when flagged and people can do some checking I know I've reported people for stealing actual users pictures and things have been taken down.

Of course there are going to be shitty people and wam as a whole has changed but I'd argue it's because of its growing exposure to others. I can think of at least two big profiles they are not active anymore who I found on fetlife and they had no idea this place existed.

As far as money goes I would say I can think of at least half a dozen producers/ profiles being banned and public out cry pushing some others out for some shady manipulations and if money was the motivation these people could have been allowed to stay.

Also how many of us actually pay to be on the one vip ? I am getting this for free cause I've posted pics of my wife but when the likes tapper off I don't get the vip thing (not sure if it says temporary on my profile since I'm writing here)

And I imagine any vip paying profiles and what $ site makes goes to operating costs and electricity and the time it takes to run this place

All though maybe at this point we should have to pay to be on here since costs of stuff have gone up insanely for everything. If I ran this place at this point for all the hassle and how fucking expensive shit is getting I'd make people pay a Monthly fee or annual fee cause I assume this is a side thing and MM ISNT screge mcducking it swimming in gold coins from what % he gets from video sales and paying vip

There are alot of opinions being expressed in this thread and I'm not exactly sure what mine are yet, but the one thing that I can definitely agree with is that sometype of filter for gross/savory WAM would be GREATLY appreciated. Slime should be cake batter, not actually legitimately gross and unpleasant for the model. I don't know why there isn't one when the site has filters for gender, explicit/hardcore, and AI content already.

I hope not - that's all I really had to say. I've read the other posts and problem statements but see few solutions, so also hopeful that community pulls together to first agree on 'problems' or 'areas to improve' and devise solutions.

Categorisation of content will always be subjective, so unless those sharing the content confirm what substances are involved and what type of scene it is used in, how does UMD get this right? And how can this be straight forward so that content levels are not reduced by additional field population reqs?

I don't really know what OP is hoping to get out of this "debate". The answer is going to vary a lot person to person.

People tend to see the past in rose tinted glasses, especially the longer it has been. Also, you tend to only get out of something what you put into it. And while people exit (for all the various reasons others have listed) new people, producers and model come in; and with them new ideas and content.

I've been on and off here for over 20 years. In that time UMD helped me with the following:

1. Show me that I'm not alone in this odd, but wonderful fetish/kink/whatever it is to you
2. Bring to me constant new material and see fantastic new things on a regular basis
3. Interact with people I otherwise never would have, make friends and even meet them in person!
4. Actually LIVE OUT some of the best moments of my life with those people.
5. As a bonus: function as group therapy for myself and a number of other users here.

I'm still happy here as a lot of others are. But not everyone has had that experience as other people in recent threads have indicated. For some people, that's their own fault, and others it's because of a few select dickheads.

If UMD has had "it's day" I still don't see that as a bad thing, it's been nearly 30 years, privately owned and maintained. As far as any business or community goes, that's a pretty damn good track record.

I don't see a problem and we have little or nothing like this site left here in the UK. I think MM has done a fantastic job keeping this site going all this time. If there have been technical issues he has solved them quickly for me.
I regularly post free vids and pics, I do not charge to view my content and I have met some great guys on here over the many years I have been a member.
This site works as long as the politics of the day don't get in the way. It's a fun thing and people get what they want out of the experience.
Definitely not had its' day !! Long may the mess continue.

Going back to the thread title ... No.

Whenever I see posts like these, I am always curious how long people have been here. I have been around since the beginning and have watched many iterations (for lack of a better word) come and go. This forum is made up of people, and the vibe changes as people come and go. Because of that, there have been times that I myself have been more or less active depending on what is going on in my personally life and what the general atmosphere was here. At times, I did not participate at all. But even then, I would still drop in and peruse the pic browser here at least once a week

I certainly think things have generally moved in a positive direction here. I can remember a time when gay or trans people would have been scared to post. Things have definitely improved in that regard But getting back to the original question, do I think the UMD has had its day as a site? No, it still seems to be going strong despite all the negatives that have happened. Now if I wanted to view that question through a more personal lens, it may be a bit different. My preference is clothed WAM with nice outfits that include tights/stockings. 25+ years ago when I found this place, that is exactly what Rob Blaine's Messyfun, Bill Shipton's Splosh!, Mark Kelly's Wamtec and others were doing. Of course I look back on that time with fondness! But times change and people change... Not to mention fashion changes; how many women wear tights/stockings in general these days, let alone make WAM videos in them And like others have mentioned, the "gross out" WAM is not my thing. But just because my tastes aren't being catered to at the moment, doesn't mean the UMD as a whole is any less relevant.

And one final thought, always remember that noone has to pay anything to be here (which is pretty amazing in this day and age!). While some may complain of the "commercialization" of the site, MessMaster has to make money somehow to keep it going! And not just a message forum, he does allow people to post free content which costs him bandwidth. There are currently 34 free videos on our profile alone, now multiply that times multiple other users and wow! I guess I'll just sum my thoughts up by saying be thankful for what we have, and not just lament what we don't

-JD

Regarding the "extreme" end of content, I feel differently about it depending on the motivation and the intended audience. I pretty much can't get into watching stuff that I wouldn't willingly be there doing, so self-producing models who come across as genuinely into it, or stuff shared as fun challenges/forfeits among peers feels fine to me. But some of the stuff that's pitched as degrading with hired women models for the straight male gaze, that's where I get the ick a little.