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"Why do producers quit?"
Love you, tooSaturation Hall, Langstonedale
Lord of the Pies
OscillatorSlop said:
Wait, messmaster take a 50% higher commission than Manyvids?
The Man and The Wife said: - Piracy
- Not having the WAM fetish and trying it thinking it's easy money (there are some exceptions of course)
- Buying products, writing scripts (if applicable), set up, the shoot itself, clean up, laundry, editing, promoting/having a forum presence all cumulatively take a massive amount of time for WAM
- Life changes
- For the average producer, a smaller profit margin in general:
The UMD takes 30% of all sales
Self Employment tax rate is then 15.3%
And in general, Federal Tax based on your bracket...
all this combined with the ever increasing cost of supplies, costumes, props and model fees...I cannot express to you how GIANT of a chunk all this cumulatively takes out of your profit. It's honestly staggering. Deductions on your tax return only go so far.
- Not having the WAM fetish and trying it thinking it's easy money (there are some exceptions of course)
- Buying products, writing scripts (if applicable), set up, the shoot itself, clean up, laundry, editing, promoting/having a forum presence all cumulatively take a massive amount of time for WAM
- Life changes
- For the average producer, a smaller profit margin in general:
The UMD takes 30% of all sales
Self Employment tax rate is then 15.3%
And in general, Federal Tax based on your bracket...
all this combined with the ever increasing cost of supplies, costumes, props and model fees...I cannot express to you how GIANT of a chunk all this cumulatively takes out of your profit. It's honestly staggering. Deductions on your tax return only go so far.
Wait, messmaster take a 50% higher commission than Manyvids?
10% less than C4S as I understand it. Do Manyvids really only take 15%? 30% has been industry standard for adult content since forever.
Saturation Hall - Forth! The Gungemaidens!
DungeonMasterOne said:
10% less than C4S as I understand it. Do Manyvids really only take 15%? 30% has been industry standard for adult content since forever.
OscillatorSlop said:
Wait, messmaster take a 50% higher commission than Manyvids?
The Man and The Wife said: - Piracy
- Not having the WAM fetish and trying it thinking it's easy money (there are some exceptions of course)
- Buying products, writing scripts (if applicable), set up, the shoot itself, clean up, laundry, editing, promoting/having a forum presence all cumulatively take a massive amount of time for WAM
- Life changes
- For the average producer, a smaller profit margin in general:
The UMD takes 30% of all sales
Self Employment tax rate is then 15.3%
And in general, Federal Tax based on your bracket...
all this combined with the ever increasing cost of supplies, costumes, props and model fees...I cannot express to you how GIANT of a chunk all this cumulatively takes out of your profit. It's honestly staggering. Deductions on your tax return only go so far.
- Not having the WAM fetish and trying it thinking it's easy money (there are some exceptions of course)
- Buying products, writing scripts (if applicable), set up, the shoot itself, clean up, laundry, editing, promoting/having a forum presence all cumulatively take a massive amount of time for WAM
- Life changes
- For the average producer, a smaller profit margin in general:
The UMD takes 30% of all sales
Self Employment tax rate is then 15.3%
And in general, Federal Tax based on your bracket...
all this combined with the ever increasing cost of supplies, costumes, props and model fees...I cannot express to you how GIANT of a chunk all this cumulatively takes out of your profit. It's honestly staggering. Deductions on your tax return only go so far.
Wait, messmaster take a 50% higher commission than Manyvids?
10% less than C4S as I understand it. Do Manyvids really only take 15%? 30% has been industry standard for adult content since forever.
C4S is 40%. Gumroad is 10% however no sexual content ever
Making smut is easy. Making art takes more!
Slop Slvt said: Another reason is the overwhelming number of creeps in the wam "community." It's quite discouraging when the majority of the people you interact with, are just not good people. Whether it's piracy, overstepping boundaries, complete lack of respect for creators, demanding to meet up for a messy session without a vetting period, not taking "no" for an answer, etc.
Super late to the party but 1,000x this. And I hate that it spills over into regular life. I found myself shying away from a genuinely friendly older guy at a group I go to because I've gotten so used to people being creepy. It's not just due to interactions from here, but at the same time online is by far the worst because people do so many things they wouldn't in person.
TheRealSlimeShady said:
Does this fetish have a disproportionately higher level of creeps than other fetishes? I've always wondered. I don't have a strong enough interest in any other kinks/fetishes to read message boards about those to have a point of reference. It's been one of the main reasons that I have been hesitant to engage with this community in a meaningful way.
Slop Slvt said: Another reason is the overwhelming number of creeps in the wam "community." It's quite discouraging when the majority of the people you interact with, are just not good people. Whether it's piracy, overstepping boundaries, complete lack of respect for creators, demanding to meet up for a messy session without a vetting period, not taking "no" for an answer, etc.
Does this fetish have a disproportionately higher level of creeps than other fetishes? I've always wondered. I don't have a strong enough interest in any other kinks/fetishes to read message boards about those to have a point of reference. It's been one of the main reasons that I have been hesitant to engage with this community in a meaningful way.
From the perspective of someone who was aspiring to produce fully clothed while posting things on here, honestly no. They were definitely a thing, but FL has been *FAR* worse and that's with mostly posting vanilla content. Way creepier, way less looking at things like what my orientation actually is before sending stupid messages, and most of them were locals. At least there are no unicorn hunters here.
OscillatorSlop said:
The Man and The Wife said: -
'The UMD takes 30% of all sales'
Wait, messmaster take a 50% higher commission than Manyvids?
'The UMD takes 30% of all sales'
Wait, messmaster take a 50% higher commission than Manyvids?
Just as a point of clarification, Manyvids states that they take 40% of video sales, so UMD actually takes less than Manyvids and Clips4Sale on a like for like basis.
Subscribe! Stream 1700+ scenes for $17 a month.
dlodoski said:
'Quit' is relative.
But I can tell you why we stopped shooting (at least for now); Piracy.
...What causes producers to pack up shop and close their store, so often?
'Quit' is relative.
But I can tell you why we stopped shooting (at least for now); Piracy.
I've been Chief Defender of the Faith and Head of the Copyright Infringement team at MPV for some years now. First there's piracy which is individual and relatively easy to beat with a determined effort. Then there's organized piracy, theft really, that builds a system blatantly devoted to your particular product and no matter how many take downs you issue, the system remains. They normalize piracy and make it a game for all the participants. They view themselves as sort of a Robin Hood for the oppressed or unfortunate. I've read more than a few posts where we were taunted and even wished an early death given our relatively advanced age. This is organized crime and not only does it ignore simple economics it's just plain evil. More painful still is when some of these yahoos try to pick up where you left off as though nothing ever happened and then, in indescribably blind irony, THEY COMPLAIN ABOUT PIRATES!
Beyond making your enterprise financially untenable it's just a freaking demoralizing gut punch. Nobody gets into business for that.
Dirty Job but I got to do it 20+ years. Thanks.
The exact reason why I quit producing was a cheap red office chair at a demanding day job that is no longer in business in part because they didn't think people who worked at their company actually needed lives outside of their offices.
I had a spinal catastrophe. And I was getting a bit up there in age anyway.
I just thought I'd offer an honest answer as to why somebody would stop making video that wasn't about creeps or money or piracy.
Nessie
I had a spinal catastrophe. And I was getting a bit up there in age anyway.
I just thought I'd offer an honest answer as to why somebody would stop making video that wasn't about creeps or money or piracy.
Nessie
DungeonMasterOne said:
10% less than C4S as I understand it. Do Manyvids really only take 15%? 30% has been industry standard for adult content since forever.
10% less than C4S as I understand it. Do Manyvids really only take 15%? 30% has been industry standard for adult content since forever.
We only charge 15% on LXdownloads to wam producers as well. Just enough to cover overheads but then we don't particulrly profit from that.
OF is 20% we believe.
Messages & replies are not regularly monitored.
Someone already ran the math but as a producer I'll run it on my end and it's the reason I decided with stick with producing other fetishes and not pies (which is a huge fetish of mine.)
Minimum rate for hiring 2 models for 1 hour: $300. Getting multiple scenes done is a huge challenge since the girls would have to shower/blow dry their hair between scenes. So, 2 scenes done. Extra $100 minimum in pie supplies = $400 total or $200 per scene. Selling the scenes for $10 each with an average cut of 30% for platform fees means selling each scene a minimum of 30 times. And that's breaking even.
Then there's my time. Scheduling models, getting the pie ingredients, prep, shooting, clean up and editing. There's between zero real profit or not enough to make it worth it.
Pie sales are on the low end since the community is very fractured. Some want real pies (way too expensive) others don't mind shaving cream, some want direct hits, others want them thrown. So regardless of which style of pie video I'd be making, only a percentage of the pie community would be interested.
Minimum rate for hiring 2 models for 1 hour: $300. Getting multiple scenes done is a huge challenge since the girls would have to shower/blow dry their hair between scenes. So, 2 scenes done. Extra $100 minimum in pie supplies = $400 total or $200 per scene. Selling the scenes for $10 each with an average cut of 30% for platform fees means selling each scene a minimum of 30 times. And that's breaking even.
Then there's my time. Scheduling models, getting the pie ingredients, prep, shooting, clean up and editing. There's between zero real profit or not enough to make it worth it.
Pie sales are on the low end since the community is very fractured. Some want real pies (way too expensive) others don't mind shaving cream, some want direct hits, others want them thrown. So regardless of which style of pie video I'd be making, only a percentage of the pie community would be interested.
GungeTankBabes said: For us it was a combination of increasing costs, finding suitable models and above all else time and space. We had our 'studio' for quite a few years and found that the sessions did help towards the cost of that. To some degree the customs and sponsors helped towards the costs of models, equipment and the studio but the films don't really make a profit on their own. When the studio rent doubled overnight we had to give the studio up and then concentrated on the films in the garden which were the ones in the marquee. It's not ideal working like that some our filming sessions with the Dunk Tank were not happening that often.
We moved a few years ago and no longer have the big garden so it's even more difficult to film although never say never. We still have 2 dunk tanks and 2 gunge tanks, I did get the second tanks specifically for filming but have just not had the time.
So, I guess some producers just take extended breaks but may well return.
We moved a few years ago and no longer have the big garden so it's even more difficult to film although never say never. We still have 2 dunk tanks and 2 gunge tanks, I did get the second tanks specifically for filming but have just not had the time.
So, I guess some producers just take extended breaks but may well return.
I'm wondering what you tell friends and family when they ask what are those tanks for.
That be very awkward for me
Optimist said: Hey folks 
A lot of producers make a few scenes and then close up shop.
What is the main reason for this?
- They get bored of the novelty of sliming hot models
- The returns are not worth the work
- Art moves on
What causes producers to pack up shop and close their store, so often?
A lot of producers make a few scenes and then close up shop.
What is the main reason for this?
- They get bored of the novelty of sliming hot models
- The returns are not worth the work
- Art moves on
What causes producers to pack up shop and close their store, so often?
Because people CONSTANTLY steal and repost their shit, next question.
Damn fool of a tuber
DungeonMasterOne said: The reasons will vary depending on the type of producer:
To shoot three fully clothed scenes with two models, including supplies, model fees, transport costs, heat and light, and food and drink during the day, comes to between eight hundred and a thousand pounds, call it £900. Split between the three scenes that's £300 each that has to be made back before costs are covered, never mind making a profit. If those scenes are sold on UMD for $15 each, the producer gets $10.50 (70%) from each sale. At current echange rates that's £8.50 in UK pounds. Which means each of those scenes needs to sell at least 36 copies just to earn the costs back. Ask any newbie producer how many of their scenes have sold 36 or more copies. The answer will be very few. And that, plus having their hard work stolen and traded, is why so many new-starts bail out after a few scenes.
To shoot three fully clothed scenes with two models, including supplies, model fees, transport costs, heat and light, and food and drink during the day, comes to between eight hundred and a thousand pounds, call it £900. Split between the three scenes that's £300 each that has to be made back before costs are covered, never mind making a profit. If those scenes are sold on UMD for $15 each, the producer gets $10.50 (70%) from each sale. At current echange rates that's £8.50 in UK pounds. Which means each of those scenes needs to sell at least 36 copies just to earn the costs back. Ask any newbie producer how many of their scenes have sold 36 or more copies. The answer will be very few. And that, plus having their hard work stolen and traded, is why so many new-starts bail out after a few scenes.
Really the cost is astronomical compared to other easier fetishes. If I didn't like this genre so much I would have packed up long ago. This is definitely a passion project but if the community can't support the work enough for the producers to thrive then there are limits.
Alana of SexyMessyBabes
SpookTrailJones said: My simple answer, divorcing your model, lol.
This was my case as well. Her leaving just took any desire to want to produce for public viewing and killed it. Even with my girlfriend now, who enjoys getting muddy with me and lets me film it, I just don't feel and need to broadcast it. It feels good to be retired.
Optimist said: Hey folks
A lot of producers make a few scenes and then close up shop.
What is the main reason for this?
- They get bored of the novelty of sliming hot models
- The returns are not worth the work
- Art moves on
What causes producers to pack up shop and close their store, so often?
A lot of producers make a few scenes and then close up shop.
What is the main reason for this?
- They get bored of the novelty of sliming hot models
- The returns are not worth the work
- Art moves on
What causes producers to pack up shop and close their store, so often?
I would think all those reasons and a bit of piracy and lack of return of investment
Paint with play and surrender
Sales are obviously a big factor in someone being able to remain a producer.
Our 'You Can't Do That On Set: Episode 7 - The Movie Special' needed a whopping 112 sales to recoup it's production cost...and that was just for the model and supply cost to create it while taking into account the 30% UMD cut. I also never factor in my time to any recoup cost either. I certainly have a few scenes that haven't recouped their production cost after a year (or more!). But streaming helps fill up a lot of those holes. And honestly, that's okay! They can't all be bangers. It's almost like a puzzle for me. Like, hmmm...I wonder why this particular scene didn't work as well. *mental gears turning*
But damnit I love WAM. It is 100% my biggest kink and I love it. And I love producing! :love
Our 'You Can't Do That On Set: Episode 7 - The Movie Special' needed a whopping 112 sales to recoup it's production cost...and that was just for the model and supply cost to create it while taking into account the 30% UMD cut. I also never factor in my time to any recoup cost either. I certainly have a few scenes that haven't recouped their production cost after a year (or more!). But streaming helps fill up a lot of those holes. And honestly, that's okay! They can't all be bangers. It's almost like a puzzle for me. Like, hmmm...I wonder why this particular scene didn't work as well. *mental gears turning*
But damnit I love WAM. It is 100% my biggest kink and I love it. And I love producing! :love
Slime...more slime!!!!!
The Man and The Wife said: Sales are obviously a big factor in someone being able to remain a producer.
Our 'You Can't Do That On Set: Episode 7 - The Movie Special' needed a whopping 112 sales to recoup it's production cost...and that was just for the model and supply cost to create it while taking into account the 30% UMD cut. I also never factor in my time to any recoup cost either. I certainly have a few scenes that haven't recouped their production cost after a year (or more!). But streaming helps fill up a lot of those holes. And honestly, that's okay! They can't all be bangers. It's almost like a puzzle for me. Like, hmmm...I wonder why this particular scene didn't work as well. *mental gears turning*
But damnit I love WAM. It is 100% my biggest kink and I love it. And I love producing! :love
Our 'You Can't Do That On Set: Episode 7 - The Movie Special' needed a whopping 112 sales to recoup it's production cost...and that was just for the model and supply cost to create it while taking into account the 30% UMD cut. I also never factor in my time to any recoup cost either. I certainly have a few scenes that haven't recouped their production cost after a year (or more!). But streaming helps fill up a lot of those holes. And honestly, that's okay! They can't all be bangers. It's almost like a puzzle for me. Like, hmmm...I wonder why this particular scene didn't work as well. *mental gears turning*
But damnit I love WAM. It is 100% my biggest kink and I love it. And I love producing! :love
Indeed, you guys certainly have an understanding of the "it" factor as well as continuing to nail it on a quality/production level. - I'd be surprised to know which scenes haven't been bangers, and which ones have been the most successful?
Zan said:
Indeed, you guys certainly have an understanding of the "it" factor as well as continuing to nail it on a quality/production level. - I'd be surprised to know which scenes haven't been bangers, and which ones have been the most successful?
The Man and The Wife said: Sales are obviously a big factor in someone being able to remain a producer.
Our 'You Can't Do That On Set: Episode 7 - The Movie Special' needed a whopping 112 sales to recoup it's production cost...and that was just for the model and supply cost to create it while taking into account the 30% UMD cut. I also never factor in my time to any recoup cost either. I certainly have a few scenes that haven't recouped their production cost after a year (or more!). But streaming helps fill up a lot of those holes. And honestly, that's okay! They can't all be bangers. It's almost like a puzzle for me. Like, hmmm...I wonder why this particular scene didn't work as well. *mental gears turning*
But damnit I love WAM. It is 100% my biggest kink and I love it. And I love producing! :love
Our 'You Can't Do That On Set: Episode 7 - The Movie Special' needed a whopping 112 sales to recoup it's production cost...and that was just for the model and supply cost to create it while taking into account the 30% UMD cut. I also never factor in my time to any recoup cost either. I certainly have a few scenes that haven't recouped their production cost after a year (or more!). But streaming helps fill up a lot of those holes. And honestly, that's okay! They can't all be bangers. It's almost like a puzzle for me. Like, hmmm...I wonder why this particular scene didn't work as well. *mental gears turning*
But damnit I love WAM. It is 100% my biggest kink and I love it. And I love producing! :love
Indeed, you guys certainly have an understanding of the "it" factor as well as continuing to nail it on a quality/production level. - I'd be surprised to know which scenes haven't been bangers, and which ones have been the most successful?
I'd be happy to at least tell the most successful:
https://the-man-the-wife-the-store.umd.net/download_info/a-day-in-the-life
https://the-man-the-wife-the-store.umd.net/download_info/zoeys-first-time-lillys-younger-sister
https://the-man-the-wife-the-store.umd.net/download_info/types-of-slime
https://the-man-the-wife-the-store.umd.net/download_info/the-raft
https://the-man-the-wife-the-store.umd.net/download_info/paiges-first-time-lexis-18-year-old-sist
https://the-man-the-wife-the-store.umd.net/download_info/you-cant-do-that-on-set-episode-7--the-m
https://the-man-the-wife-the-store.umd.net/download_info/the-initiation
Slime...more slime!!!!!
Well, not sure I need to wade into this because most of what I am going to say has been said but I think these were all straight producers and I thought I would give the perspective of a gay producer, so here goes.
I started doing videos 17 years ago, yikes I'm old, because at first I thought I had this fetish. Then I made my first video and, nope not for me. But I did really well with the first video so I continued to make videos because it was bringing in really nice extra money.
I made all male videos so there was very little competition. I think there was only one other producer at the time. So it was worth doing and at first fun. I mean I wasn't into the pies and gunge but I did enjoy hiring really hot guys. Plus I enjoyed shooting the videos and editing. It was a fun way to be creative. But it was hard work. Putting down plastic, making all the pies and gunge then cleaning everything up. Most of the time I did that all by myself and often did 2 or 3 videos in one day.
I have rambled a bit, but I quit because it just got to damn hard and expensive. I paid the models $50 for non nude and $100 for nude videos when I started but by the time I stopped I was paying $100 for non nude and $250 a model for nude, and I think even more for some models near the end, and it was getting harder and harder to find guys for those prices. I was lucky to have very nice guys doing customs but it was still getting too pricey. Plus, as more guys on here made their own video's less and less profitable, and as I mentioned, I am old, so it was really exhausting. Oh and I haven't even mentioned how flakey models are! I never knew if they would show up and often they wouldn't. So I stopped uppercrust 10 years ago and Abs 9 years ago.
I started doing videos 17 years ago, yikes I'm old, because at first I thought I had this fetish. Then I made my first video and, nope not for me. But I did really well with the first video so I continued to make videos because it was bringing in really nice extra money.
I made all male videos so there was very little competition. I think there was only one other producer at the time. So it was worth doing and at first fun. I mean I wasn't into the pies and gunge but I did enjoy hiring really hot guys. Plus I enjoyed shooting the videos and editing. It was a fun way to be creative. But it was hard work. Putting down plastic, making all the pies and gunge then cleaning everything up. Most of the time I did that all by myself and often did 2 or 3 videos in one day.
I have rambled a bit, but I quit because it just got to damn hard and expensive. I paid the models $50 for non nude and $100 for nude videos when I started but by the time I stopped I was paying $100 for non nude and $250 a model for nude, and I think even more for some models near the end, and it was getting harder and harder to find guys for those prices. I was lucky to have very nice guys doing customs but it was still getting too pricey. Plus, as more guys on here made their own video's less and less profitable, and as I mentioned, I am old, so it was really exhausting. Oh and I haven't even mentioned how flakey models are! I never knew if they would show up and often they wouldn't. So I stopped uppercrust 10 years ago and Abs 9 years ago.
Piracy is a real concern for us as well and I fight it off as best we can. But at the end of the day, we still like getting messy and I think some people actually enjoy watching us get messy. Model fees are crazy so thankfully I have a small pool of models that I work with. I dont think any of us can legitimately make a profit once you count the time for the setup, cleanup, and editing. That time is typically just ignored but in the real market that is labor and that would be a wage you would have to pay somebody.
I have to agree with The Man and The Wife on this but I have yet to come up with any common denominator of what sells really well and what doesn't. Plus, we don't film stuff just to sell it. We focus on what we like to see and do. If that hurts us in the end, so be it. But Kate and I have been wamming in private for a decade before we opened our store.
I also enjoy the creativity aspect of actually producing and doing the video editing. Occasionally I get to have fun exploring the creativity in my mind but my normal job is just a grind and I dont get to express any form of creativity. When that runs out in our WAM productions, I presume we would be done as well.
Shit is crazy expensive and that contributes to the producer downfall as well. I am struggling to find alternative pie crusts because Wal-Mart prices went up by over $1 per pie crust for their in house brand. I have a hard time justifying that.
The most common reason producers quit though (I think) - life changes directions. We all have other personal ambitions and/or obligations that take over and that limits our ability to get messy. And that should be accepted and not frowned upon. Some of us have kids and it gets really hard to film.
I have to agree with The Man and The Wife on this but I have yet to come up with any common denominator of what sells really well and what doesn't. Plus, we don't film stuff just to sell it. We focus on what we like to see and do. If that hurts us in the end, so be it. But Kate and I have been wamming in private for a decade before we opened our store.
I also enjoy the creativity aspect of actually producing and doing the video editing. Occasionally I get to have fun exploring the creativity in my mind but my normal job is just a grind and I dont get to express any form of creativity. When that runs out in our WAM productions, I presume we would be done as well.
Shit is crazy expensive and that contributes to the producer downfall as well. I am struggling to find alternative pie crusts because Wal-Mart prices went up by over $1 per pie crust for their in house brand. I have a hard time justifying that.
The most common reason producers quit though (I think) - life changes directions. We all have other personal ambitions and/or obligations that take over and that limits our ability to get messy. And that should be accepted and not frowned upon. Some of us have kids and it gets really hard to film.
Saturation Hall, Langstonedale
Lord of the Pies
WildThang said: I have to agree with The Man and The Wife on this but I have yet to come up with any common denominator of what sells really well and what doesn't. Plus, we don't film stuff just to sell it. We focus on what we like to see and do. If that hurts us in the end, so be it. But Kate and I have been wamming in private for a decade before we opened our store.
It's almost impossible to predict what will and won't sell, or when, because there are so many niches. I've occasionally had sales surges where someone's come along and really liked either one of our models or a specific outfit style, and "bought the catalogue", sometimes years after the scenes in question were shot. And even things you might expect, like nude vs clothed - our biggest selling scenes are all fully clothed, even though we have nude and topless ones in the stores.
Right from the start I've always shot what I wanted to see, as part of my reason for getting into production was that no-one else was shooting the kind of scenes I was after. I think all of the long-term producers are people who are a) into WAM themselves, and b) have a specific idea of the kind of scenes they enjoy producing. I remember way back in the 90s, Rob Blaine advising people "Don't try to chase the market, shoot what you like personally. That way, even if it doesn't sell, you have something you'll enjoy out of it." Sound advice, then and now.
Saturation Hall - Forth! The Gungemaidens!
DungeonMasterOne said:
Right from the start I've always shot what I wanted to see, as part of my reason for getting into production was that no-one else was shooting the kind of scenes I was after. I think all of the long-term producers are people who are a) into WAM themselves, and b) have a specific idea of the kind of scenes they enjoy producing. I remember way back in the 90s, Rob Blaine advising people "Don't try to chase the market, shoot what you like personally. That way, even if it doesn't sell, you have something you'll enjoy out of it." Sound advice, then and now.
WildThang said: I have to agree with The Man and The Wife on this but I have yet to come up with any common denominator of what sells really well and what doesn't. Plus, we don't film stuff just to sell it. We focus on what we like to see and do. If that hurts us in the end, so be it. But Kate and I have been wamming in private for a decade before we opened our store.
Right from the start I've always shot what I wanted to see, as part of my reason for getting into production was that no-one else was shooting the kind of scenes I was after. I think all of the long-term producers are people who are a) into WAM themselves, and b) have a specific idea of the kind of scenes they enjoy producing. I remember way back in the 90s, Rob Blaine advising people "Don't try to chase the market, shoot what you like personally. That way, even if it doesn't sell, you have something you'll enjoy out of it." Sound advice, then and now.
This is the way^
Possibly the wisest thing I heard on the topic of production and art as a whole was by Rick Rubin
https://www.tiktok.com/t/ZTL4DdScG/
Making smut is easy. Making art takes more!
WildThang said: Piracy is a real concern for us as well and I fight it off as best we can. But at the end of the day, we still like getting messy and I think some people actually enjoy watching us get messy. Model fees are crazy so thankfully I have a small pool of models that I work with. I dont think any of us can legitimately make a profit once you count the time for the setup, cleanup, and editing. That time is typically just ignored but in the real market that is labor and that would be a wage you would have to pay somebody.
I have to agree with The Man and The Wife on this but I have yet to come up with any common denominator of what sells really well and what doesn't. Plus, we don't film stuff just to sell it. We focus on what we like to see and do. If that hurts us in the end, so be it. But Kate and I have been wamming in private for a decade before we opened our store.
I also enjoy the creativity aspect of actually producing and doing the video editing. Occasionally I get to have fun exploring the creativity in my mind but my normal job is just a grind and I dont get to express any form of creativity. When that runs out in our WAM productions, I presume we would be done as well.
Shit is crazy expensive and that contributes to the producer downfall as well. I am struggling to find alternative pie crusts because Wal-Mart prices went up by over $1 per pie crust for their in house brand. I have a hard time justifying that.
The most common reason producers quit though (I think) - life changes directions. We all have other personal ambitions and/or obligations that take over and that limits our ability to get messy. And that should be accepted and not frowned upon. Some of us have kids and it gets really hard to film.
I have to agree with The Man and The Wife on this but I have yet to come up with any common denominator of what sells really well and what doesn't. Plus, we don't film stuff just to sell it. We focus on what we like to see and do. If that hurts us in the end, so be it. But Kate and I have been wamming in private for a decade before we opened our store.
I also enjoy the creativity aspect of actually producing and doing the video editing. Occasionally I get to have fun exploring the creativity in my mind but my normal job is just a grind and I dont get to express any form of creativity. When that runs out in our WAM productions, I presume we would be done as well.
Shit is crazy expensive and that contributes to the producer downfall as well. I am struggling to find alternative pie crusts because Wal-Mart prices went up by over $1 per pie crust for their in house brand. I have a hard time justifying that.
The most common reason producers quit though (I think) - life changes directions. We all have other personal ambitions and/or obligations that take over and that limits our ability to get messy. And that should be accepted and not frowned upon. Some of us have kids and it gets really hard to film.
We have very similar stories for sure. The Wife and myself got messy in private for 8 years before our store. And I 100% agree that if you shoot mainly what you want to shoot, it turns out better and people will dig it.
Slime...more slime!!!!!
Time.
Revenue, which often only covers the costs.
Get older.
Being one of two producers in all of Berlin: even here it is difficult to find models. And when they do, many expect astronomical salaries.
Even if I won't be quitting straight away, I won't have more than a few films left in the evidence cabinet.
Fun Fact: Toilet Trouble (Part 1) is my best selling video here. That was really good plus...
Revenue, which often only covers the costs.
Get older.
Being one of two producers in all of Berlin: even here it is difficult to find models. And when they do, many expect astronomical salaries.
Even if I won't be quitting straight away, I won't have more than a few films left in the evidence cabinet.
Fun Fact: Toilet Trouble (Part 1) is my best selling video here. That was really good plus...
zmfx_6 said:
Hi there UMD community,
Thank you so much for the enlightening forum topic and heartfelt support! Alana and I both feel extremely grateful for providing her with the opportunity to work with this passionate community and share many fond experiences with it over the years. At the same time, we feel that it is time to part ways. Alana and I would like to start a family, and doing so precludes her continuing this work. We appreciate your understanding. Again, thank you all so much for the encouragement! Take care!
Kind regards,
ZmFx_6
Alana SexyMessyBabes said:
Really the cost is astronomical compared to other easier fetishes. If I didn't like this genre so much I would have packed up long ago. This is definitely a passion project but if the community can't support the work enough for the producers to thrive then there are limits.
DungeonMasterOne said: The reasons will vary depending on the type of producer:
To shoot three fully clothed scenes with two models, including supplies, model fees, transport costs, heat and light, and food and drink during the day, comes to between eight hundred and a thousand pounds, call it £900. Split between the three scenes that's £300 each that has to be made back before costs are covered, never mind making a profit. If those scenes are sold on UMD for $15 each, the producer gets $10.50 (70%) from each sale. At current echange rates that's £8.50 in UK pounds. Which means each of those scenes needs to sell at least 36 copies just to earn the costs back. Ask any newbie producer how many of their scenes have sold 36 or more copies. The answer will be very few. And that, plus having their hard work stolen and traded, is why so many new-starts bail out after a few scenes.
To shoot three fully clothed scenes with two models, including supplies, model fees, transport costs, heat and light, and food and drink during the day, comes to between eight hundred and a thousand pounds, call it £900. Split between the three scenes that's £300 each that has to be made back before costs are covered, never mind making a profit. If those scenes are sold on UMD for $15 each, the producer gets $10.50 (70%) from each sale. At current echange rates that's £8.50 in UK pounds. Which means each of those scenes needs to sell at least 36 copies just to earn the costs back. Ask any newbie producer how many of their scenes have sold 36 or more copies. The answer will be very few. And that, plus having their hard work stolen and traded, is why so many new-starts bail out after a few scenes.
Really the cost is astronomical compared to other easier fetishes. If I didn't like this genre so much I would have packed up long ago. This is definitely a passion project but if the community can't support the work enough for the producers to thrive then there are limits.
Hi there UMD community,
Thank you so much for the enlightening forum topic and heartfelt support! Alana and I both feel extremely grateful for providing her with the opportunity to work with this passionate community and share many fond experiences with it over the years. At the same time, we feel that it is time to part ways. Alana and I would like to start a family, and doing so precludes her continuing this work. We appreciate your understanding. Again, thank you all so much for the encouragement! Take care!
Kind regards,
ZmFx_6
will existing scenes be removed?
Two things would do it for me:
1) I finally fall out of love with WAM
2) Something creepy happens online that puts me at risk
1) I finally fall out of love with WAM
2) Something creepy happens online that puts me at risk
There's nothing I can really add that hasn't already been said.
I could write a dissertation on why I'm tempted to quit. The easier answer is why I continue.
I may be a little addicted. Like I'm chasing the feeling when I first started, even though I understand that ship has sailed.
However, the greatest concern I have is regarding the people who actually like what I do. Not that I'll anger them. No, it's much worse. That I'd disappoint them.
I could write a dissertation on why I'm tempted to quit. The easier answer is why I continue.
I may be a little addicted. Like I'm chasing the feeling when I first started, even though I understand that ship has sailed.
However, the greatest concern I have is regarding the people who actually like what I do. Not that I'll anger them. No, it's much worse. That I'd disappoint them.
Dr. of Splatterology
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