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"Discussion about Mostwam"
Love you, too
messyface1994 said: I don't think banning MostWam completely is fair to everyone else who works for it either, even if Leon is to blame here. Lots of other people work for MostWam, and they were still able to continue filming content, so conditions at MostWam can't be that bad. I don't think an isolated incident we don't know the full details of means everything to do with MostWam should be erased. I don't see how that's fair.
Very naive. The court transcript is available in the public domain so full details are known. The accounts for Mostwam are available in the public domain. There is one owner,Leon.The amount after expenses,wages etc is clearly shown.
Can you explain how you know:
It's an isolated incident
Why that would matter after a young girl has had her naked breasts felt?
What is the employee structure at Mostwam?
Why is being able to buy porn more important to you than having a convicted sex offender on this forum who deceitfully hid the fact from all the customers,other producers and Messmaster and also allowed people to think Lisa was still on the forum long after they had split up?
Strange strange response.
Didn't we have this conversation a couple of weeks ago? Stop simping for producers. Do you think they'll go to bat for you when you're convicted of a sex crime or take heat for stealing from a bunch of people? No, they'll just find someone else's $20 to take. Principles over penises.
Check out Project 20M on IG! @Project20M
VAVAVIE said:
Have you read a comment and had a thought that you didn't feel the need to share? I mean seriously you post like nothing the whole time you are here and since this thread you have more than made up for any time you spent not posting.
A LOT OF CRAP
Have you read a comment and had a thought that you didn't feel the need to share? I mean seriously you post like nothing the whole time you are here and since this thread you have more than made up for any time you spent not posting.
MudMadPhil said:
Kelsey, most Men feel shame about there sexual preferences even with a wife. Society pressures Men to be a certain way sexually and bonking in chocolate is not!
Kelsey, most Men feel shame about there sexual preferences even with a wife. Society pressures Men to be a certain way sexually and bonking in chocolate is not!
Wow. Thank you for enlightening me that society pressures men to be a certain way sexually. As a woman, I simply had no idea that this was the case... Because it's not like society also pressures us to be a certain way sexually too... :/
https://umd.net/media/forum_uploads/10_22/eyerolldonttrustthebinapt23_uid_77710_1666487535_40160.gif
Gonna just double down real quick and once again say to everyone, regardless of your gender, do not be ashamed of your kinks! Literally 99% of ppl do not give a shit about what turns you on, and the 1% that do are shitty insecure ppl anyways, so pay them no mind (even if you happen to be unfortunately married to one of them)
As for the rest of your casually misogynistic post Phil, I get that you do not like women and I'm sure the 3 that you married have a great deal to do with that, but I sincerely encourage not letting your frustration (whether it be justified or not) regarding them color your view on all of us.
Because if you continue to generalize and allow pain and anger to shape your perspective, you might end up doing something stupid, like, I don't know, unnecessarily defend a convicted sex offender on a public forum because you simply just can't see women as anything other than sex objects or villainous shrews.
Also...
MudMadPhil said:
5. Never touch a model, if you do need to, ask before you do it. (excuse me darling beautiful tits, mind if I squeeze one?) LOL Just kidding.
5. Never touch a model, if you do need to, ask before you do it. (excuse me darling beautiful tits, mind if I squeeze one?) LOL Just kidding.
Fantastic sexual assault joke bro! ...in the thread about A PRODUCER HERE BEING CONVICTED OF SEXUAL ASSAULT
Like fuckin really?! Read the room dude. Or better yet, read Penny's post from earlier in this thread, and just pretend it wasn't written by a woman, so that way you'll be able to feel even just one iota of empathy towards what's being discussed.
Also sorry to get fired up and add to your case file of women being outspoken bitches towards you, but your post just made me so so sooooo angry. Perhaps we can chalk up our differences here though as just one of those Mars/Venus things and move on...
MudMadPhil said:
This is why the divorce rate is so high and no one wants to have a partner any more. Yep just call me Henry Higgins, that why I am super happy, best advice ever: Never Let A Woman In Your Life
This is why the divorce rate is so high and no one wants to have a partner any more. Yep just call me Henry Higgins, that why I am super happy, best advice ever: Never Let A Woman In Your Life
P.S. You might wanna re-watch My Fair Lady. Higgins changes his view on women in the end. Hopefully you will at some point too.
VAVAVIE said:
Very naive. The court transcript is available in the public domain so full details are known. The accounts for Mostwam are available in the public domain. There is one owner,Leon.The amount after expenses,wages etc is clearly shown.
Can you explain how you know:
It's an isolated incident
Why that would matter after a young girl has had her naked breasts felt?
What is the employee structure at Mostwam?
Why is being able to buy porn more important to you than having a convicted sex offender on this forum who deceitfully hid the fact from all the customers,other producers and Messmaster and also allowed people to think Lisa was still on the forum long after they had split up?
Strange strange response.
messyface1994 said: I don't think banning MostWam completely is fair to everyone else who works for it either, even if Leon is to blame here. Lots of other people work for MostWam, and they were still able to continue filming content, so conditions at MostWam can't be that bad. I don't think an isolated incident we don't know the full details of means everything to do with MostWam should be erased. I don't see how that's fair.
Very naive. The court transcript is available in the public domain so full details are known. The accounts for Mostwam are available in the public domain. There is one owner,Leon.The amount after expenses,wages etc is clearly shown.
Can you explain how you know:
It's an isolated incident
Why that would matter after a young girl has had her naked breasts felt?
What is the employee structure at Mostwam?
Why is being able to buy porn more important to you than having a convicted sex offender on this forum who deceitfully hid the fact from all the customers,other producers and Messmaster and also allowed people to think Lisa was still on the forum long after they had split up?
Strange strange response.
Not naive all. MostWam is more than just Leon. There are other people who work at MostWam who aren't Leon, who have absolutely nothing to do with his actions.
1) This is the only incident that we know of, so it's an isolated incident. At least for now. If you have evidence that suggests otherwise, I invite you to present it, because that's how this works. To make a claim, especially one like this, you need some kind of evidence.
2) It doesn't matter. Literally no one here is defending such actions by Leon, so your attacks on people simply suggesting "hey, maybe MostWam in general isn't the literal devil incarnate, and that we should still enjoy that while still also condemning Leon and his actions, and find ways that can resolve this other than to shut everything down." How about keeping MostWam and its current content up, and having any subsequent money made from it going to charities that help victims of sexual assault? The models can go on to work for other producers that are more reputable, and Leon is no longer earning money from it, and the MostWam brand can actually be used for good?
3) It doesn't take a genius to figure out that the models that work for MostWam, work for MostWam.
4) Your last point is quite nefarious, and you seem to be repeating it quite a lot, and I would like to counter it with my own question: Why are you trying to vilify and attack, completely innocent people who are simply suggesting that MostWam, something they have supported and invested in for years, not be completely eradicated from existence with little to no warning? If you were attacking people who were maliciously defending sexual assault and predators, then I would understand, but no one here is doing that. How do you go from someone saying "this site I like should stay up" to immediately assuming that by itself makes them some kind of sexual assault/rape apologist? There are more options than just "keep the site with Leon still making profit with no consequences" and "shut it down completely and t hell with anyone who questions it", and we should probably think about this more for the best for our community, and to discuss how to protect and safeguard models and sex workers from predatory producers, so incidents like this NEVER happen again. It's far more productive than whatever it is you're doing, or being disappointed in anyone that has anything to say that you don't immediately see eye to eye with.
Okay so I left the thread 12 hours ago to let my hair down and I will be suffering one hell of a hangover when I finally get up tomorrow morning even though it's now 5:30 am UK time so it may be the afternoon before you see me again 
As most of you know I originally dealt with this or is it a first appeared on the forums yesterday so I've been with this from the start
I have been carefully reading through all the comments and Penny you are absolutely spot-on with your very detailed reply this evening and absolutely applaud the fact that you are still even doing what you do despite what has happened to you in the past
As I'm writing this I've just finished reading a very long email from Leon that was sent to me personally though some of it does have it sob story And other part so I'm not about to disclose I am still amazed by the fact that in most of it the blame still lies with everyone else but himself are now coming up with the fact that as well as all the other stuff he has said he has now told me that he is suffering from Asperger's and ADHD
As this may well be the case I'm still amazed that he seems to be trying to defend yourself here more than he did when he was in court because so far the excuses he has come up with should not been heard here in a court Ware he should've properly represent the self he told me he has a very like you a message but I can't understand why someone with a very high IQ would I not understand these are able to swap his legal team at a moments notice and be how are you would accept such poor advice from a legal team
There also seems to be a lot of confusion as to who has been replying to some of the messages regarding one off his original models leaving was it Lisa was it Leon this is something that the site looks against when there are too many people impersonating with multi user logins we all know where that went last time with Jesse
Then there is the fact is this events took place over two years ago yeah at no point does it seem that Leon has informed any admin or MM of the potential issues that could be coming up but seems to have been happy to still earn money from subscribers and downloads for over two years and even on conviction Ware is had a legal obligation to inform even with his so-called high IQ failed to mention it again to anyone
The only reason he is participating in the conversation now is because of the fact there is now come to light had it I've not been published I would assume that this would've gone on for years and the models would've carried on being subject to whatever vile behaviour this guy was up to as it appears quite evident that this girl is just the tip of the iceberg with regard to buy practice innuendos and other abusive behaviour
As a woman who has also been through a different type of scenario many years ago I came out fighting and I'm the person I am now for that reason
When I was made admin of this site one of my first posts were directly to anyone who may need help be a friendly ear or to women and guys who am I really need some help but felt they could go nowhere
I have had the odd message here and there from people that I have then tried to help personally and will continue to do so as long as I remain on this site
Even today I have had a message from a very prominent person who will remain limbless thanking me for their help and support on a completely separate issue I would say to any of the girls that will work with Lisa if you do have a genuine profile on here you are more than welcome to come and discuss things with me in confidence especially if this is affecting you
So the basics are my personal opinion and I have told this to Leon in a reply to his personal message to me that I think it's time for him to go unfortunately yes this means that some great models are going to lose their jobs as well but if they are that good and they are genuinely still wanting to be in the industry I'm sure it's only a matter of time before they will continue to work for other great producers on this site believe me I would happily have some of the work for me if geographical restrictions wasn't an issue
As some of pointed out they are doing a job because they get paid that doesn't necessarily mean they completely enjoy the job they do but if it puts food on their plate it becomes a necessity but a necessity certainly shouldn't include the harassment or sexual abuse from any producer infect from anyone at all
Kisses
Chantelle
As most of you know I originally dealt with this or is it a first appeared on the forums yesterday so I've been with this from the start
I have been carefully reading through all the comments and Penny you are absolutely spot-on with your very detailed reply this evening and absolutely applaud the fact that you are still even doing what you do despite what has happened to you in the past
As I'm writing this I've just finished reading a very long email from Leon that was sent to me personally though some of it does have it sob story And other part so I'm not about to disclose I am still amazed by the fact that in most of it the blame still lies with everyone else but himself are now coming up with the fact that as well as all the other stuff he has said he has now told me that he is suffering from Asperger's and ADHD
As this may well be the case I'm still amazed that he seems to be trying to defend yourself here more than he did when he was in court because so far the excuses he has come up with should not been heard here in a court Ware he should've properly represent the self he told me he has a very like you a message but I can't understand why someone with a very high IQ would I not understand these are able to swap his legal team at a moments notice and be how are you would accept such poor advice from a legal team
There also seems to be a lot of confusion as to who has been replying to some of the messages regarding one off his original models leaving was it Lisa was it Leon this is something that the site looks against when there are too many people impersonating with multi user logins we all know where that went last time with Jesse
Then there is the fact is this events took place over two years ago yeah at no point does it seem that Leon has informed any admin or MM of the potential issues that could be coming up but seems to have been happy to still earn money from subscribers and downloads for over two years and even on conviction Ware is had a legal obligation to inform even with his so-called high IQ failed to mention it again to anyone
The only reason he is participating in the conversation now is because of the fact there is now come to light had it I've not been published I would assume that this would've gone on for years and the models would've carried on being subject to whatever vile behaviour this guy was up to as it appears quite evident that this girl is just the tip of the iceberg with regard to buy practice innuendos and other abusive behaviour
As a woman who has also been through a different type of scenario many years ago I came out fighting and I'm the person I am now for that reason
When I was made admin of this site one of my first posts were directly to anyone who may need help be a friendly ear or to women and guys who am I really need some help but felt they could go nowhere
I have had the odd message here and there from people that I have then tried to help personally and will continue to do so as long as I remain on this site
Even today I have had a message from a very prominent person who will remain limbless thanking me for their help and support on a completely separate issue I would say to any of the girls that will work with Lisa if you do have a genuine profile on here you are more than welcome to come and discuss things with me in confidence especially if this is affecting you
So the basics are my personal opinion and I have told this to Leon in a reply to his personal message to me that I think it's time for him to go unfortunately yes this means that some great models are going to lose their jobs as well but if they are that good and they are genuinely still wanting to be in the industry I'm sure it's only a matter of time before they will continue to work for other great producers on this site believe me I would happily have some of the work for me if geographical restrictions wasn't an issue
As some of pointed out they are doing a job because they get paid that doesn't necessarily mean they completely enjoy the job they do but if it puts food on their plate it becomes a necessity but a necessity certainly shouldn't include the harassment or sexual abuse from any producer infect from anyone at all
Kisses
Chantelle
I wanna be messy
I don't understand why my comments have been attacked.
I believe that I have put quite a balanced point of view across based on the four major points
- We will never know the full truth of what happened
- Leon pleaded guilty to a sex offence, and now he is a sex offender.
- Leon put his version of events forward for us that seem plausible...as we've already established thousands of people plead guilty to crimes they didn't commit whatever country you live in... Whether this is the case here or not WE WILL NEVER KNOW!
- We know this was a few years ago, we know that the mostwam team is a family, that they know one another and most of them of friends... they will know more information than we do, and they are continuing to shoot with mostwam to this day.
And based on all of that information I have made my decision and other people have also made a decision.
No one should be condemned here for their opinion based on those four key bits of information. NO ONE HERE IS ON TRIAL!
Anyway, thats probably it for me on the matter... I'm sure this community will thieve regardless of what happens to Mostwam.
I'm sure the right decision will be made
I believe that I have put quite a balanced point of view across based on the four major points
- We will never know the full truth of what happened
- Leon pleaded guilty to a sex offence, and now he is a sex offender.
- Leon put his version of events forward for us that seem plausible...as we've already established thousands of people plead guilty to crimes they didn't commit whatever country you live in... Whether this is the case here or not WE WILL NEVER KNOW!
- We know this was a few years ago, we know that the mostwam team is a family, that they know one another and most of them of friends... they will know more information than we do, and they are continuing to shoot with mostwam to this day.
And based on all of that information I have made my decision and other people have also made a decision.
No one should be condemned here for their opinion based on those four key bits of information. NO ONE HERE IS ON TRIAL!
Anyway, thats probably it for me on the matter... I'm sure this community will thieve regardless of what happens to Mostwam.
I'm sure the right decision will be made
Philippa Forrester Found
I just don't see how the community can have, and be comfortable with having, a registered sex offender working with girls through this site and making money from it. His story has morphed and changed several times through the history of this thread over the last day or so, so we know lies have been told here for starters
How can we know we've not sat and admired pictures or videos of girls who've felt the same way to the victim he was convicted for? I'm gutted, because I've enjoyed mostwam content myself over the years too. But I'm even more gutted for his victim(s).
I just want to say also that there's some very brave women here, who've posted some very important and well argued points. Credit to all of you, especially reading Penny's thoughts from someone who's suffered abuse herself. That's very brave and not at all an easy thing to put yourself through. I hope that in time UMD can be a community where you feel safe to enjoy your fetish again. Mostwam, sadly, and Leon simply can't contribute here if we want the right kind of safe space for everyone to enjoy the fetish.
Leon, if you had any shred of decency and credibility in the first place, you'd have been open about it and just done the decent thing. You can't be hiring young women for sex work and selling it here, thinking that's okay with everyone, when you've admitted guilt in a court of law for sexual assault. It really is that black and white, regardless of your changing stories about how it happened. Some things are a lot bigger than the aesthetic appeal of someone's gunge drop videos.
How can we know we've not sat and admired pictures or videos of girls who've felt the same way to the victim he was convicted for? I'm gutted, because I've enjoyed mostwam content myself over the years too. But I'm even more gutted for his victim(s).
I just want to say also that there's some very brave women here, who've posted some very important and well argued points. Credit to all of you, especially reading Penny's thoughts from someone who's suffered abuse herself. That's very brave and not at all an easy thing to put yourself through. I hope that in time UMD can be a community where you feel safe to enjoy your fetish again. Mostwam, sadly, and Leon simply can't contribute here if we want the right kind of safe space for everyone to enjoy the fetish.
Leon, if you had any shred of decency and credibility in the first place, you'd have been open about it and just done the decent thing. You can't be hiring young women for sex work and selling it here, thinking that's okay with everyone, when you've admitted guilt in a court of law for sexual assault. It really is that black and white, regardless of your changing stories about how it happened. Some things are a lot bigger than the aesthetic appeal of someone's gunge drop videos.
All is love 👌🏻
CalGungeFan said: NO ONE HERE IS ON TRIAL!
Correct. The trial was in March. Leon was convicted of sexual assault at it. He then hid that fact, and also now has lied about it as well as tried to justify it.
You can absolutely make the decision to continue giving him your money, and I think you absolutely should have the right to make that decision.
You also absolutely would be financially supporting a convicted sex offender who made great attempts at hiding his crime so that he could continue working with more models (aka potential victims) and has *thus far* shown an inability to take responsibility for his actions here (aka potentially doesn't think what he did was wrong).
Just wanna make sure you understand all of that. Cause if you do Cal, then you should also understand why your comments have been attacked by people here.
CalGungeFan said:
- We will never know the full truth of what happened
- We will never know the full truth of what happened
True. We can only trust what the victim, the court, and the criminal himself have said, which is that he made a mistake and sexually assaulted a model.
CalGungeFan said:
- Leon pleaded guilty to a sex offence, and now he is a sex offender.
- Leon pleaded guilty to a sex offence, and now he is a sex offender.
Can't argue with that!
CalGungeFan said:
- Leon put his version of events forward for us that seem plausible...as we've already established thousands of people plead guilty to crimes they didn't commit whatever country you live in...
- Leon put his version of events forward for us that seem plausible...as we've already established thousands of people plead guilty to crimes they didn't commit whatever country you live in...
He has made contradictory statements now regarding both the events and his innocence/guilt. For me, and I think many others, his response to all of this here has been more incriminating and concerning than the actual assault itself. Which is saying something, because the actual assault was indeed a crime and a very concerning one at that.
CalGungeFan said:
- We know this was a few years ago, we know that the mostwam team is a family, that they one another and most of them of friends... they will know more information than we do, and they are continuing to shoot with mostwam to this day.
- We know this was a few years ago, we know that the mostwam team is a family, that they one another and most of them of friends... they will know more information than we do, and they are continuing to shoot with mostwam to this day.
We also know that he hid this conviction from employees (he has admitted as much in the other thread), and thus, there is no reason to assume that the models who continue working there are aware of it. The mere fact that WE are now aware of it is solely because one of those models, who you deem to be "family" found out about the conviction and approached someone here.
CalGungeFan said:
I don't understand why my comments have been attacked.
I don't understand why my comments have been attacked.
Do you understand now?
Some of us remember when another producer actually jacked himself off over a model during a shoot without her knowing. He even sold the video of it until she realised what had happened.
To this day I'm amazed he was not banned from here despite unequivocal video evidence of what happened.
To this day I'm amazed he was not banned from here despite unequivocal video evidence of what happened.
I didn't really want to chime in because I can't say anything that other smarter people haven't said better, but this is just depressing. If you genuinely can't understand why this is an issue and anything less than Leon banned and Mostwam shut down until and unless they completely cut ties and disavow him (if that's even possible) isn't acceptable, please take the time to carefully read Penny Banks' post, it's been the most worthwhile contribution to this forum (thank you Penny, I can't imagine the stress and strength it takes to talk about these things, your input is greatly valued).
It's been stated countless times here that it's possible the rest of the team at Mostwam either didn't know about what happened, or if they did know they stayed because it is their job. For the sake of their income they have to suck it up and deal with shit no-one should have to deal with. Them still producing content after Leon's charge means literally nothing.
I get that mods and admins have to be unbiased and look at cold hard facts. Maybe I'm just an idiot or a 'radical feminist white knight' but I'm genuinely confused how anyone could think a fetish site run by a sex offender and a content creator who at best makes uncomfortable and crosses boundaries and at worst assaults his young employees is acceptable or has a home here. The fact that 'sex offenders shouldn't be allowed to create fetish material, maybe even be welcome on a fetish site to begin with' is considered debatable is kinda bleak.
If you're upset about the possibility of you losing content because of this then 1.) If you really cared about the people in your content then maybe show a bit of concern and care for them, and 2) just be honest and say your porn is more important than keeping people safe from sex offenders. Just then don't get upset or confused when people call you out on how vile that is.
This is all I'm contributing. I'm here because I get my rocks off being covered in green, pink and purple sludge. Not to be depressed at how shitty and pathetic people can be.
It's been stated countless times here that it's possible the rest of the team at Mostwam either didn't know about what happened, or if they did know they stayed because it is their job. For the sake of their income they have to suck it up and deal with shit no-one should have to deal with. Them still producing content after Leon's charge means literally nothing.
I get that mods and admins have to be unbiased and look at cold hard facts. Maybe I'm just an idiot or a 'radical feminist white knight' but I'm genuinely confused how anyone could think a fetish site run by a sex offender and a content creator who at best makes uncomfortable and crosses boundaries and at worst assaults his young employees is acceptable or has a home here. The fact that 'sex offenders shouldn't be allowed to create fetish material, maybe even be welcome on a fetish site to begin with' is considered debatable is kinda bleak.
If you're upset about the possibility of you losing content because of this then 1.) If you really cared about the people in your content then maybe show a bit of concern and care for them, and 2) just be honest and say your porn is more important than keeping people safe from sex offenders. Just then don't get upset or confused when people call you out on how vile that is.
This is all I'm contributing. I'm here because I get my rocks off being covered in green, pink and purple sludge. Not to be depressed at how shitty and pathetic people can be.
Turning shitty days into titty days since 1996.
erictheviking said: Some of us remember when another producer actually jacked himself off over a model during a shoot without her knowing. He even sold the video of it until she realised what had happened.
To this day I'm amazed he was not banned from here despite unequivocal video evidence of what happened.
To this day I'm amazed he was not banned from here despite unequivocal video evidence of what happened.
Jesus Christ, man. That's horrific. Who was that?
All is love 👌🏻
Observations:
1. Now cancel culture comes to UMD. I will hold off my political posts rant. Leon may have done something questionable (or maybe he did not), and now people want him cancelled. I say let the market decide, let people put their money where their mouth is.
2. The largest proponents (including mods) trying to cancel Leon have conflict of interest because they *are* competitors. Whether intentional or not, you're trying to take your competitor out. At least be honest about that.
3. UK legal system is a joke, not saying the US is better. Look up Johnny Depp vs Amber Heard. In US, Johnny was vindicated, in UK not so. It's trendy to "believe all women" now. Legal system should work on evidence and facts, not BS feelings and politics.
4. Leon, live to fight another day, but don't give up this fight. This was one of those "he said she said" situations, and you started off with a shitty deck of cards. In hindsight, you may have made some missteps (like pleading guilty). I don't know if you really did it, but I hope you can get your shit together, and get this overturned if you can. Don't let them win.
If I was on the jury, and if the conviction standard was "beyond reasonable doubt", I would vote not guilty.
5. The hypocrisy of all the posters about how Leon is a "convicted sex offender" and thus should be cancelled. I'll bet both my balls that half of those folks would release violent convicted felons for their political ideology when it suits them. My point is that a conviction *and* lack of conviction these days means... nothing much, since the legal system has been politicized like fuck. Violent criminals walk the street free because of politics, and innocent men get #metoo-ed all the time (also politics).
Disclaimer: I am a MostWam fan.
1. Now cancel culture comes to UMD. I will hold off my political posts rant. Leon may have done something questionable (or maybe he did not), and now people want him cancelled. I say let the market decide, let people put their money where their mouth is.
2. The largest proponents (including mods) trying to cancel Leon have conflict of interest because they *are* competitors. Whether intentional or not, you're trying to take your competitor out. At least be honest about that.
3. UK legal system is a joke, not saying the US is better. Look up Johnny Depp vs Amber Heard. In US, Johnny was vindicated, in UK not so. It's trendy to "believe all women" now. Legal system should work on evidence and facts, not BS feelings and politics.
4. Leon, live to fight another day, but don't give up this fight. This was one of those "he said she said" situations, and you started off with a shitty deck of cards. In hindsight, you may have made some missteps (like pleading guilty). I don't know if you really did it, but I hope you can get your shit together, and get this overturned if you can. Don't let them win.
If I was on the jury, and if the conviction standard was "beyond reasonable doubt", I would vote not guilty.
5. The hypocrisy of all the posters about how Leon is a "convicted sex offender" and thus should be cancelled. I'll bet both my balls that half of those folks would release violent convicted felons for their political ideology when it suits them. My point is that a conviction *and* lack of conviction these days means... nothing much, since the legal system has been politicized like fuck. Violent criminals walk the street free because of politics, and innocent men get #metoo-ed all the time (also politics).
Disclaimer: I am a MostWam fan.
Im probably a rare case in that ive been on both ends of what has been said to have happened here.
I have been touched inapropriately by somebody i trusted, from whom i didnt want that kind of thing. I said no, they apologised, we stopped having contact.
I can also relate to Leons experience ticking most of the same boxes, depression, loneliness, being at an all time low, seeking the comfort of a friend who really didnt like it, and now apparently being on the spectrum too.
The only differences are the awful timing (during a paid shoot) and the fact that Leon is almost a guarenteed payout.
I understand the court decision, just rolling with other peoples decisions etc but it that was me in court during the time when i was at my lowest id have said many unrepeatable things to the judge but none of them would have been "guilty". I know i wouldnt stand a chance being as weird as i am.
Hang in there Leon, it probably is time for you to take a break, work on yourself, at least until the wolves (most of whom seem to be your competition) have fed on the next guy.
I have been touched inapropriately by somebody i trusted, from whom i didnt want that kind of thing. I said no, they apologised, we stopped having contact.
I can also relate to Leons experience ticking most of the same boxes, depression, loneliness, being at an all time low, seeking the comfort of a friend who really didnt like it, and now apparently being on the spectrum too.
The only differences are the awful timing (during a paid shoot) and the fact that Leon is almost a guarenteed payout.
I understand the court decision, just rolling with other peoples decisions etc but it that was me in court during the time when i was at my lowest id have said many unrepeatable things to the judge but none of them would have been "guilty". I know i wouldnt stand a chance being as weird as i am.
Hang in there Leon, it probably is time for you to take a break, work on yourself, at least until the wolves (most of whom seem to be your competition) have fed on the next guy.
Hannah x
KelseyRose said: Ok I'm gonna try and make this really easy for Leon, because it's become evident that he's dealing with a lot and perhaps not in the best mental health headspace to be handling this properly (a task which I certainly do not envy).
So here's what you're gonna wanna do Leon;
You're going to followup in this thread and just say that you "made a mistake with how you handled this situation, and that it's become apparent to you that you need to take some time to work on yourself. You apologize to anyone you may have hurt by your actions, and you want to remind us that doing so was never your intention.
You came to this place to share your love of your fetish and share the content you produce based on that love. You realize now that your recent actions have hurt both the community that you love, and the content that you produce, and so you're going to be stepping away from Mostwam for a bit to get some help and work on becoming a better person.
In the meantime, Mostwam will continue operating, but with Lisa and/or Al taking charge, so that way everyone on UMD, from the most morally righteous, to the most perverted degenerate, can still enjoy jerking off to the wonderful content that Mostwam makes and not have to feel any sort of guilt while doing so.
You apologize again for the mistake you made with the model on that day, and for how you handled addressing it on here afterwards. you hope that as fellow human beings, we can understand how difficult of a situation this has been and why you struggled with how to best address and respond to it here. Nobody is perfect, we all make mistakes, and we all deserve the opportunity to earn forgiveness for those mistakes. And you hope to be able to earn ours very soon."
You can honestly probably just copy and paste the above text and then just not login to your LeonMoomin account for a few months and still carry on business as usual. It isn't like anyone from here is going to check in on the operation to make sure you're not secretly still running it while supposedly away to spend time working on yourself.
But please just take the L here and help move things along so that the lynch mob can put down their pitchforks and stop trying to destroy you/your business, and the superfans can stop twisting themselves into pretzels trying to defend you/your business, and we can ALL get back to jerking off.
So here's what you're gonna wanna do Leon;
You're going to followup in this thread and just say that you "made a mistake with how you handled this situation, and that it's become apparent to you that you need to take some time to work on yourself. You apologize to anyone you may have hurt by your actions, and you want to remind us that doing so was never your intention.
You came to this place to share your love of your fetish and share the content you produce based on that love. You realize now that your recent actions have hurt both the community that you love, and the content that you produce, and so you're going to be stepping away from Mostwam for a bit to get some help and work on becoming a better person.
In the meantime, Mostwam will continue operating, but with Lisa and/or Al taking charge, so that way everyone on UMD, from the most morally righteous, to the most perverted degenerate, can still enjoy jerking off to the wonderful content that Mostwam makes and not have to feel any sort of guilt while doing so.
You apologize again for the mistake you made with the model on that day, and for how you handled addressing it on here afterwards. you hope that as fellow human beings, we can understand how difficult of a situation this has been and why you struggled with how to best address and respond to it here. Nobody is perfect, we all make mistakes, and we all deserve the opportunity to earn forgiveness for those mistakes. And you hope to be able to earn ours very soon."
You can honestly probably just copy and paste the above text and then just not login to your LeonMoomin account for a few months and still carry on business as usual. It isn't like anyone from here is going to check in on the operation to make sure you're not secretly still running it while supposedly away to spend time working on yourself.
But please just take the L here and help move things along so that the lynch mob can put down their pitchforks and stop trying to destroy you/your business, and the superfans can stop twisting themselves into pretzels trying to defend you/your business, and we can ALL get back to jerking off.
Sorry, but this is a terrible idea for Leon, and I hope he's not stupid enough to do this. If Leon ever wants to get this overturned, doing this "confession post" will screw his chances.
Also, legal factors aside, I would caution Leon from apologizing to the mob [this is not directed at any one person, but "the mob" in general]. The cancel culture people are NOT interested in your confession. All they want is to DESTROY you. These people do not believe in forgiveness or redemption, they just want to see you suffer and die. If you are really innocent, do not bend the knee. Once you bend the knee, they will just capitalize on that and attack you even more.
lchris001 said: 1. Now cancel culture comes to UMD. I will hold off my political posts rant. Leon may have done something questionable (or maybe he did not), and now people want him cancelled. I say let the market decide, let people put their money where their mouth is.
There is no question about whether or not Leon did something questionable. He has since moved on from his initial innocence claim and admitted to groping the model, stating that it was a mistake and explaining why he was in the unfortunate mental state that led to that mistake. And no one here is trying to "cancel" Leon. People are genuinely concerned about enabling and supporting a sex offender's ability to commit future sexual assaults. Nobody here wants Mostwam shut down because of what Leon did. They are discussing it being shut down (or him needing to stap away) because of what he may do in the future based on this incident and his behavior related to it.
lchris001 said: 2. The largest proponents (including mods) trying to cancel Leon have conflict of interest because they *are* competitors. Whether intentional or not, you're trying to take your competitor out. At least be honest about that.
You could not have this more backwards. While I technically do have a UMD store and 5 videos for sale on it, I have spent well over $5,000 on Mostwam's content. Quite simply, they're my favorite producer. And as far as the mods having a competitive conflict of interest... do you know how much fucking money Mostwam makes for this site!? Like aside from the model that was sexually assaulted, the biggest victim here is the UMD. Leon has seriously fucked over this site by how he handled this entire situation. To claim that some of his biggest fans and the people who directly benefit the most from his continued success are "out to get him" is genuinely one of the dumbest things I have seen in a thread full of them. Nobody here *wants* to see Leon/Mostwam go. We're all grappling with how Mostwam/Leon could possibly stay given the information we have.
lchris001 said: 3. UK legal system is a joke, not saying the US is better. Look up Johnny Depp vs Amber Heard. In US, Johnny was vindicated, in UK not so. It's trendy to "believe all women" now. Legal system should work on evidence and facts, not BS feelings and politics.
Johnny Depp was vindicated of sexual assault *allegations*. Leon was not. He was convicted of sexual assault allegations. Because he committed sexual assault. Wanna know how I know that Chris? Because he fucking admitted to committing sexual assault. He admitted it once in court when he plead guilty, and then again earlier in this thread when he apologized for his handling of this situation.
lchris001 said: 4. Leon, live to fight another day, but don't give up this fight. This was one of those "he said she said" situations, and you started off with a shitty deck of cards. In hindsight, you may have made some missteps (like pleading guilty). I don't know if you really did it, but if I hope you can get your shit together, and get this overturned if you can. Don't let them win.
I do hope Leon lives to fight another day, although I hope that fight is within himself as part of his efforts to learn and grow from this. As I've stated elsewhere, people make mistakes, and people deserve forgiveness. I also really think you need to re-read this thread. Despite Leon's initial claims that he pleaded guilty but was actually innocent of sexually assaulting a model, he has since admitted to doing just that in his subsequent comments while letting us know it was a mistake made under extreme emotional duress. But that means this would be a case of "he said, she said" where they both are saying the same thing: that Leon made a mistake and committed sexual assault.
lchris001 said: Disclaimer: I am a MostWam fan.
Disclaimer: I am too! I'm also able to recognize when someone I'm a fan of fucks up. Those two things shouldn't be mutually exclusive.
lchris001 said: Now cancel culture comes to UMD. I will hold off my political posts rant. Leon may have done something questionable (or maybe he did not), and now people want him cancelled. I say let the market decide, let people put their money where their mouth is.
This is nothing to do with cancel culture. This is not some unrelated action or opinion, this was a criminal act directly with a model who stars in videos that people here purchase. I guess if you want to see politics in everything then I'm sure you can if you try hard enough.
MM has left things open for discussions and opinions, so I would say that UMD has set 2 previous precedents that seem to apply here.
1st is that Jessie and her sites were ultimately removed due to using accounts in other people's names. It looks likely, with what's been revealed, that Lisa did not make the forum posts from her account around the time of the trial and those posts were probably made by Leon. That seems odd when it was suggested that those posts concerned a model who had her videos all removed from mostwam sites all at the same time.
2nd is the decision to allow Anglefan to continue to post and promote his videos on UMD and the forums after actually doing something pretty awful (and likely illegal) on camera without the models knowledge. Not a great precedent to set with this one.
I'm sure many people enjoy mostwam's content, certainly I do myself. But I think the decision to not inform MM or other models working for mostwam for a while was not very smart. I don't think it is a good look for the UMD to be the place that knowingly sells whack-off porn from someone who sexually assaulted one of the models. But precedent 2 above seems to suggest that might be ok.
Wow
Lisa has posted as Lisa the whole time, although her and me have separated, she has continued to work for the company and do the administration.
Including working with a HR company to put new working practises into place, contracts and codes of conduct.
She can clearly be heard in the background of many of our newest videos.
I'm sure the person who brought this to the person posting here can confirm that Lisa still works for the company.
I don't have access to her UMD account.
I know which girl initially brought this here, it is funny that the same girl who did so, also wanted to continue to work for us up until a couple of weeks ago, when I made it clear she couldn't, due to her threatening to out me publicly, we have messages from this person saying exactly that, and all of this has arrived here now, a week or so later, but that girl was not treated with anything but kindness from me up until she threatened me with exposure.
I am currently seeing a probation officer every week and being guided by their advice on who I should and shouldn't tell about my conviction.
I have been told to be very careful about who I tell, due to obvious risks to me and my family.
It seems the initial strategy was to let me tell the girls who work for me once they got a chance to know me a little first. But that advice changed to tell everyone who works for me, as soon as they start, which is what I have done since I have received that advise.
I have never been in this position before and have no idea what to do or who I have to tell? The bulk of the feeling here is that I should tell everyone, which is completely against any advice given by my probation officer.
Please think, it can be VERY dangerous to be a sex offender in the UK.
It's not just a reputation thing, it's legitimate concerns for the safety of me and my family. Not telling people isn't just about pulling the wool over people's eyes or covering it up.
I am under no obligation to tell my neighbours and no obligation to tell my child's school. I did however make them aware out of concern for my child.
I am not banned from playgrounds or schools, as someone said here.
The offence I am convicted of has NOTHING to do with children.
That is a completely different level of reporting and offence.
The person involved was nearly 30 years of age, not a minor.
I am now having to annswer accusations of hard and harsh Wam materials being thrown at girls, that, I am not aware of, who they are from, or what those accusations even are?
As such I can't answer or defend myself from them, but that is kind of the job?
The work carried out with girls up until Lisa and I separated always seemed to be fun and congenial for all parties.
Many of the girls attended our wedding and did social activities with us. An environment of friendship was how I perceived it.
If they were only friends with Lisa, they never actually made me aware of that, they all treated me as a friend in my own right.
None of the girls ever made me personally aware of any uncomfortableness with my interactions with them.
I would have been mortified and apologetic to them if that was the case.
I could be a little pushy with them in regards to getting shoots done and would always be made aware by them that I was pushing too hard, but not of anything else.
I have always tried to do my best for the girls who work for me and have never ever meant any harm to any of them, if any of them feel I did, I wish I was made aware of it and can only apologise.
I am doing lots of things to improve my mental health, obviously, that is a major concern to me. I am out working hard to try to learn how to befriend men, as it is something I've always struggled with, I am aware that my difficulty bonding with men makes me open to seeking unhelpful friendships with girls who work for me, that being said I am very, very good friends with Two of the girls who have worked for me currently, one of whom works for me still, one of whom doesn't, their support over the last 12 months has been invaluable.
There is no smoke without fire is something I've heard here.
This is true, I am a producer of adult content, that's a fire that produces a lot of smoke.
And as such I should have been a lot more careful, in hindsight.
The scrutiny I am currently under, makes it truly unlikely that I would ever harm someone working for me, much more so than any other man here.
I have been charged and convicted of one offence.
One moment can really change your life.
And the incident in question happened 7 days after I received a severe emotional trauma.
But.
It seems mostWam and myself will have to leave the UMD.
I am very sorry for any distress this has caused to anyone here and apologise to everyone who has supported us over the years.
Lisa has posted as Lisa the whole time, although her and me have separated, she has continued to work for the company and do the administration.
Including working with a HR company to put new working practises into place, contracts and codes of conduct.
She can clearly be heard in the background of many of our newest videos.
I'm sure the person who brought this to the person posting here can confirm that Lisa still works for the company.
I don't have access to her UMD account.
I know which girl initially brought this here, it is funny that the same girl who did so, also wanted to continue to work for us up until a couple of weeks ago, when I made it clear she couldn't, due to her threatening to out me publicly, we have messages from this person saying exactly that, and all of this has arrived here now, a week or so later, but that girl was not treated with anything but kindness from me up until she threatened me with exposure.
I am currently seeing a probation officer every week and being guided by their advice on who I should and shouldn't tell about my conviction.
I have been told to be very careful about who I tell, due to obvious risks to me and my family.
It seems the initial strategy was to let me tell the girls who work for me once they got a chance to know me a little first. But that advice changed to tell everyone who works for me, as soon as they start, which is what I have done since I have received that advise.
I have never been in this position before and have no idea what to do or who I have to tell? The bulk of the feeling here is that I should tell everyone, which is completely against any advice given by my probation officer.
Please think, it can be VERY dangerous to be a sex offender in the UK.
It's not just a reputation thing, it's legitimate concerns for the safety of me and my family. Not telling people isn't just about pulling the wool over people's eyes or covering it up.
I am under no obligation to tell my neighbours and no obligation to tell my child's school. I did however make them aware out of concern for my child.
I am not banned from playgrounds or schools, as someone said here.
The offence I am convicted of has NOTHING to do with children.
That is a completely different level of reporting and offence.
The person involved was nearly 30 years of age, not a minor.
I am now having to annswer accusations of hard and harsh Wam materials being thrown at girls, that, I am not aware of, who they are from, or what those accusations even are?
As such I can't answer or defend myself from them, but that is kind of the job?
The work carried out with girls up until Lisa and I separated always seemed to be fun and congenial for all parties.
Many of the girls attended our wedding and did social activities with us. An environment of friendship was how I perceived it.
If they were only friends with Lisa, they never actually made me aware of that, they all treated me as a friend in my own right.
None of the girls ever made me personally aware of any uncomfortableness with my interactions with them.
I would have been mortified and apologetic to them if that was the case.
I could be a little pushy with them in regards to getting shoots done and would always be made aware by them that I was pushing too hard, but not of anything else.
I have always tried to do my best for the girls who work for me and have never ever meant any harm to any of them, if any of them feel I did, I wish I was made aware of it and can only apologise.
I am doing lots of things to improve my mental health, obviously, that is a major concern to me. I am out working hard to try to learn how to befriend men, as it is something I've always struggled with, I am aware that my difficulty bonding with men makes me open to seeking unhelpful friendships with girls who work for me, that being said I am very, very good friends with Two of the girls who have worked for me currently, one of whom works for me still, one of whom doesn't, their support over the last 12 months has been invaluable.
There is no smoke without fire is something I've heard here.
This is true, I am a producer of adult content, that's a fire that produces a lot of smoke.
And as such I should have been a lot more careful, in hindsight.
The scrutiny I am currently under, makes it truly unlikely that I would ever harm someone working for me, much more so than any other man here.
I have been charged and convicted of one offence.
One moment can really change your life.
And the incident in question happened 7 days after I received a severe emotional trauma.
But.
It seems mostWam and myself will have to leave the UMD.
I am very sorry for any distress this has caused to anyone here and apologise to everyone who has supported us over the years.
KelseyRose said:
There is no question about whether or not Leon did something questionable. He has since moved on from his initial innocence claim and admitted to groping the model, stating that it was a mistake and explaining why he was in the unfortunate mental state that led to that mistake. And no one here is trying to "cancel" Leon. People are genuinely concerned about enabling and supporting a sex offender's ability to commit future sexual assaults. Nobody here wants Mostwam shut down because of what Leon did. They want it shut down (or him to leave) because of what he may do in the future based on this incident and his behavior related to it.
There is no question about whether or not Leon did something questionable. He has since moved on from his initial innocence claim and admitted to groping the model, stating that it was a mistake and explaining why he was in the unfortunate mental state that led to that mistake. And no one here is trying to "cancel" Leon. People are genuinely concerned about enabling and supporting a sex offender's ability to commit future sexual assaults. Nobody here wants Mostwam shut down because of what Leon did. They want it shut down (or him to leave) because of what he may do in the future based on this incident and his behavior related to it.
Maybe not you in particular, but there's posts that wants Leon to be "deplatformed" from UMD. Actually, if you read the original news article, it stated Leon thought he had consent from the person before touching her, but she said she did not. It's one of those "he said she said" cases.
KelseyRose said:
You could not have this more backwards. While I technically do have a UMD store and 5 videos for sale on it, I have been a Mostwam.TV subscriber since it's inception, and have spent well over $5,000 on their content. Quite simply, they *were* my favorite producer. And as far as the mods having a competitive conflict of interest... do you know how much fucking money Mostwam makes for this site!? Like aside from the model that was sexually assaulted, the biggest victim here is the UMD. Leon has seriously fucked over this site by how he handled this entire situation. To claim that some of his biggest fans and the people who directly benefit the most from his continued success are "out to get him" is genuinely one of the dumbest things I have seen in a thread full of them.
You could not have this more backwards. While I technically do have a UMD store and 5 videos for sale on it, I have been a Mostwam.TV subscriber since it's inception, and have spent well over $5,000 on their content. Quite simply, they *were* my favorite producer. And as far as the mods having a competitive conflict of interest... do you know how much fucking money Mostwam makes for this site!? Like aside from the model that was sexually assaulted, the biggest victim here is the UMD. Leon has seriously fucked over this site by how he handled this entire situation. To claim that some of his biggest fans and the people who directly benefit the most from his continued success are "out to get him" is genuinely one of the dumbest things I have seen in a thread full of them.
Fair enough, since I do not know about your personal likes for MostWAM material. Still my point stands. Producers do have an active conflict of interest and should be declared.
In an unrelated incident (that I can't elaborate because it would put another producer at risk), this is not the first time we have had producers/mods conflict of interest in attacking other producers.
KelseyRose said:
Johnny Depp was vindicated of sexual assault *allegations*. Leon was not. He was convicted of sexual assault allegations. Because he committed sexual assault. Wanna know how I know that Chris? Because he fucking admitted to committing sexual assault. He admitted it once in court when he plead guilty, and then again earlier in this thread when he half-heartedly apologized for his handling of this situation.
Johnny Depp was vindicated of sexual assault *allegations*. Leon was not. He was convicted of sexual assault allegations. Because he committed sexual assault. Wanna know how I know that Chris? Because he fucking admitted to committing sexual assault. He admitted it once in court when he plead guilty, and then again earlier in this thread when he half-heartedly apologized for his handling of this situation.
My point is that I don't trust the legal system when it comes to cases like these.
KelseyRose said:
I do hope Leon lives to fight another day, although I hope that fight is within himself as part of his efforts to learn and grow from this. And I also really think you need to re-read this thread. Despite Leon's initial claims that he pleaded guilty but was actually innocent of sexually assaulting a model, he has since admitted to doing just that in his subsequent comments. So this would be a case of "he said, she said" where they both are saying the same thing: that Leon made a mistake and committed sexual assault.
I do hope Leon lives to fight another day, although I hope that fight is within himself as part of his efforts to learn and grow from this. And I also really think you need to re-read this thread. Despite Leon's initial claims that he pleaded guilty but was actually innocent of sexually assaulting a model, he has since admitted to doing just that in his subsequent comments. So this would be a case of "he said, she said" where they both are saying the same thing: that Leon made a mistake and committed sexual assault.
Uhm... my read was that his legal counsel told him to plead guilty, and also because of his other considerations at that time. Also, apologizing is not an admission of guilt.
CalGungeFan said: I don't understand why my comments have been attacked.
Think with your brain rather than your dick.
MMasia said:
This is nothing to do with cancel culture. This is not some unrelated action or opinion, this was a criminal act directly with a model who stars in videos that people here purchase. I guess if you want to see politics in everything then I'm sure you can if you try hard enough.
lchris001 said: Now cancel culture comes to UMD. I will hold off my political posts rant. Leon may have done something questionable (or maybe he did not), and now people want him cancelled. I say let the market decide, let people put their money where their mouth is.
This is nothing to do with cancel culture. This is not some unrelated action or opinion, this was a criminal act directly with a model who stars in videos that people here purchase. I guess if you want to see politics in everything then I'm sure you can if you try hard enough.
There are literally posts asking for Leon to be deplatformed. Let's not have pointless discussion about semantics. There are people calling for his cancellation.
Also since it is a "verified" criminal act, the punishment has been meted out. I do not recall the judge ruling a verdict that Leon has to be deplatformed from UMD, and his life screwed beyond the verdict he got.
niald88 said:
He's not being deplatformed. He and mostwam have another site which they can sell content on. No-one's saying he has to get rid of that. And you're also perfectly entitled to support him and his business if you so wish. Just don't be surprised if normal human beings with a moral conscience disagree with you.
lchris001 said:
There are literally posts asking for Leon to be deplatformed. Let's not have pointless discussion about semantics. There are people calling for his cancellation.
Also since it is a "verified" criminal act, the punishment has been meted out. I do not recall the judge ruling a verdict that Leon has to be deplatformed from UMD, and his life screwed beyond the verdict he got.
MMasia said:
This is nothing to do with cancel culture. This is not some unrelated action or opinion, this was a criminal act directly with a model who stars in videos that people here purchase. I guess if you want to see politics in everything then I'm sure you can if you try hard enough.
lchris001 said: Now cancel culture comes to UMD. I will hold off my political posts rant. Leon may have done something questionable (or maybe he did not), and now people want him cancelled. I say let the market decide, let people put their money where their mouth is.
This is nothing to do with cancel culture. This is not some unrelated action or opinion, this was a criminal act directly with a model who stars in videos that people here purchase. I guess if you want to see politics in everything then I'm sure you can if you try hard enough.
There are literally posts asking for Leon to be deplatformed. Let's not have pointless discussion about semantics. There are people calling for his cancellation.
Also since it is a "verified" criminal act, the punishment has been meted out. I do not recall the judge ruling a verdict that Leon has to be deplatformed from UMD, and his life screwed beyond the verdict he got.
He's not being deplatformed. He and mostwam have another site which they can sell content on. No-one's saying he has to get rid of that. And you're also perfectly entitled to support him and his business if you so wish. Just don't be surprised if normal human beings with a moral conscience disagree with you.
Maybe you have a reading comprehension problem or you just like to twist people's word of out of context. "deplatformed from ***UMD***", jesus fucking christ, you even quoted me!
Oh yes, here comes the "moral argument" and your holier than thou attitude. I spend my money how I like, you spend your money how you like. You keep your quasi-religious moral superiority BS to yourself and stop telling others how to act and we will be cool.
TheSlopScribe said:
Seeing this, and reading such defences for the convicted, I have to seriously consider if I will stay here or not.
Seeing this, and reading such defences for the convicted, I have to seriously consider if I will stay here or not.
Then leave. Virtue signalers are the ones who make the most noise and spend the least money anyway.
FYI, a convicted person does not means he is guilty. And a person who walks free can be guilty.
lchris001 said:
There are literally posts asking for Leon to be deplatformed. Let's not have pointless discussion about semantics. There are people calling for his cancellation.
Also since it is a "verified" criminal act, the punishment has been meted out. I do not recall the judge ruling a verdict that Leon has to be deplatformed from UMD, and his life screwed beyond the verdict he got.
MMasia said:
This is nothing to do with cancel culture. This is not some unrelated action or opinion, this was a criminal act directly with a model who stars in videos that people here purchase. I guess if you want to see politics in everything then I'm sure you can if you try hard enough.
lchris001 said: Now cancel culture comes to UMD. I will hold off my political posts rant. Leon may have done something questionable (or maybe he did not), and now people want him cancelled. I say let the market decide, let people put their money where their mouth is.
This is nothing to do with cancel culture. This is not some unrelated action or opinion, this was a criminal act directly with a model who stars in videos that people here purchase. I guess if you want to see politics in everything then I'm sure you can if you try hard enough.
There are literally posts asking for Leon to be deplatformed. Let's not have pointless discussion about semantics. There are people calling for his cancellation.
Also since it is a "verified" criminal act, the punishment has been meted out. I do not recall the judge ruling a verdict that Leon has to be deplatformed from UMD, and his life screwed beyond the verdict he got.
He'd have probably gotten more sympathy had he been upfront from the off. The story within this last day or so from his end has changed and twisted as he's gone. He's a liar and a sex offender. It went from a misunderstanding to something a lot more sinister in the space of a few posts. That doesn't promote trust.
People who're outraged are outraged because they want this to be a safe space for all involved to explore their kink.
Outsiders of the fetish would already cast incorrect aspersions towards us wammers, without us sitting here and saying it's okay for a lying sex offender to lurk around in our community and cherry pick his next victim. And who's to say he won't? He says he's put measures in place, but are we to believe him? He's been lying to us all throughout this debate. So, he's not at all to be trusted is he?
What if he's allowed to carry on and we all decide it's fine, "it was a mistake" and then it happens again, and he found his model on here? We're all complicit then in our inaction.
I can't see any remorse here. He's just been telling lies upon lies, based on the way the story keeps changing and he's only addressed it because he's been outed by someone else.
I'm sad. I've watched and enjoyed mostwam content. Have I watched a victim? I fucking hope not! But this goes beyond what gunge tank content I like to wank over with the wife. This is serious. A young woman was sexually assaulted. I wonder how she is? I hope she's okay.
All is love 👌🏻
BoRnSloppy said:
He'd have probably gotten more sympathy had he been upfront from the off. The story within this last day or so from his end has changed and twisted as he's gone. He's a liar and a sex offender. It went from a misunderstanding to something a lot more sinister in the space of a few posts. That doesn't promote trust.
He'd have probably gotten more sympathy had he been upfront from the off. The story within this last day or so from his end has changed and twisted as he's gone. He's a liar and a sex offender. It went from a misunderstanding to something a lot more sinister in the space of a few posts. That doesn't promote trust.
Alright, since so many of you are intent on doing this, can you quote the specific lines from Leon that proves your assertion that he is a liar? Because it's not clear to me, and I would like to see where you all are forming this conclusion from.
leonmoomin said: Wow
Lisa has posted as Lisa the whole time, although her and me have separated, she has continued to work for the company and do the administration.
Including working with a HR company to put new working practises into place, contracts and codes of conduct.
She can clearly be heard in the background of many of our newest videos.
I'm sure the person who brought this to the person posting here can confirm that Lisa still works for the company.
I don't have access to her UMD account.
I know which girl initially brought this here, it is funny that the same girl who did so, also wanted to continue to work for us up until a couple of weeks ago, when I made it clear she couldn't, due to her threatening to out me publicly, we have messages from this person saying exactly that, and all of this has arrived here now, a week or so later, but that girl was not treated with anything but kindness from me up until she threatened me with exposure.
I am currently seeing a probation officer every week and being guided by their advice on who I should and shouldn't tell about my conviction.
I have been told to be very careful about who I tell, due to obvious risks to me and my family.
It seems the initial strategy was to let me tell the girls who work for me once they got a chance to know me a little first. But that advice changed to tell everyone who works for me, as soon as they start, which is what I have done since I have received that advise.
I have never been in this position before and have no idea what to do or who I have to tell? The bulk of the feeling here is that I should tell everyone, which is completely against any advice given by my probation officer.
Please think, it can be VERY dangerous to be a sex offender in the UK.
It's not just a reputation thing, it's legitimate concerns for the safety of me and my family. Not telling people isn't just about pulling the wool over people's eyes or covering it up.
I am under no obligation to tell my neighbours and no obligation to tell my child's school. I did however make them aware out of concern for my child.
I am not banned from playgrounds or schools, as someone said here.
The offence I am convicted of has NOTHING to do with children.
That is a completely different level of reporting and offence.
The person involved was nearly 30 years of age, not a minor.
I am now having to annswer accusations of hard and harsh Wam materials being thrown at girls, that, I am not aware of, who they are from, or what those accusations even are?
As such I can't answer or defend myself from them, but that is kind of the job?
The work carried out with girls up until Lisa and I separated always seemed to be fun and congenial for all parties.
Many of the girls attended our wedding and did social activities with us. An environment of friendship was how I perceived it.
If they were only friends with Lisa, they never actually made me aware of that, they all treated me as a friend in my own right.
None of the girls ever made me personally aware of any uncomfortableness with my interactions with them.
I would have been mortified and apologetic to them if that was the case.
I could be a little pushy with them in regards to getting shoots done and would always be made aware by them that I was pushing too hard, but not of anything else.
I have always tried to do my best for the girls who work for me and have never ever meant any harm to any of them, if any of them feel I did, I wish I was made aware of it and can only apologise.
I am doing lots of things to improve my mental health, obviously, that is a major concern to me. I am out working hard to try to learn how to befriend men, as it is something I've always struggled with, I am aware that my difficulty bonding with men makes me open to seeking unhelpful friendships with girls who work for me, that being said I am very, very good friends with Two of the girls who have worked for me currently, one of whom works for me still, one of whom doesn't, their support over the last 12 months has been invaluable.
There is no smoke without fire is something I've heard here.
This is true, I am a producer of adult content, that's a fire that produces a lot of smoke.
And as such I should have been a lot more careful, in hindsight.
The scrutiny I am currently under, makes it truly unlikely that I would ever harm someone working for me, much more so than any other man here.
I have been charged and convicted of one offence.
One moment can really change your life.
And the incident in question happened 7 days after I received a severe emotional trauma.
But.
It seems mostWam and myself will have to leave the UMD.
I am very sorry for any distress this has caused to anyone here and apologise to everyone who has supported us over the years.
Lisa has posted as Lisa the whole time, although her and me have separated, she has continued to work for the company and do the administration.
Including working with a HR company to put new working practises into place, contracts and codes of conduct.
She can clearly be heard in the background of many of our newest videos.
I'm sure the person who brought this to the person posting here can confirm that Lisa still works for the company.
I don't have access to her UMD account.
I know which girl initially brought this here, it is funny that the same girl who did so, also wanted to continue to work for us up until a couple of weeks ago, when I made it clear she couldn't, due to her threatening to out me publicly, we have messages from this person saying exactly that, and all of this has arrived here now, a week or so later, but that girl was not treated with anything but kindness from me up until she threatened me with exposure.
I am currently seeing a probation officer every week and being guided by their advice on who I should and shouldn't tell about my conviction.
I have been told to be very careful about who I tell, due to obvious risks to me and my family.
It seems the initial strategy was to let me tell the girls who work for me once they got a chance to know me a little first. But that advice changed to tell everyone who works for me, as soon as they start, which is what I have done since I have received that advise.
I have never been in this position before and have no idea what to do or who I have to tell? The bulk of the feeling here is that I should tell everyone, which is completely against any advice given by my probation officer.
Please think, it can be VERY dangerous to be a sex offender in the UK.
It's not just a reputation thing, it's legitimate concerns for the safety of me and my family. Not telling people isn't just about pulling the wool over people's eyes or covering it up.
I am under no obligation to tell my neighbours and no obligation to tell my child's school. I did however make them aware out of concern for my child.
I am not banned from playgrounds or schools, as someone said here.
The offence I am convicted of has NOTHING to do with children.
That is a completely different level of reporting and offence.
The person involved was nearly 30 years of age, not a minor.
I am now having to annswer accusations of hard and harsh Wam materials being thrown at girls, that, I am not aware of, who they are from, or what those accusations even are?
As such I can't answer or defend myself from them, but that is kind of the job?
The work carried out with girls up until Lisa and I separated always seemed to be fun and congenial for all parties.
Many of the girls attended our wedding and did social activities with us. An environment of friendship was how I perceived it.
If they were only friends with Lisa, they never actually made me aware of that, they all treated me as a friend in my own right.
None of the girls ever made me personally aware of any uncomfortableness with my interactions with them.
I would have been mortified and apologetic to them if that was the case.
I could be a little pushy with them in regards to getting shoots done and would always be made aware by them that I was pushing too hard, but not of anything else.
I have always tried to do my best for the girls who work for me and have never ever meant any harm to any of them, if any of them feel I did, I wish I was made aware of it and can only apologise.
I am doing lots of things to improve my mental health, obviously, that is a major concern to me. I am out working hard to try to learn how to befriend men, as it is something I've always struggled with, I am aware that my difficulty bonding with men makes me open to seeking unhelpful friendships with girls who work for me, that being said I am very, very good friends with Two of the girls who have worked for me currently, one of whom works for me still, one of whom doesn't, their support over the last 12 months has been invaluable.
There is no smoke without fire is something I've heard here.
This is true, I am a producer of adult content, that's a fire that produces a lot of smoke.
And as such I should have been a lot more careful, in hindsight.
The scrutiny I am currently under, makes it truly unlikely that I would ever harm someone working for me, much more so than any other man here.
I have been charged and convicted of one offence.
One moment can really change your life.
And the incident in question happened 7 days after I received a severe emotional trauma.
But.
It seems mostWam and myself will have to leave the UMD.
I am very sorry for any distress this has caused to anyone here and apologise to everyone who has supported us over the years.
You haven't got anything to say "wow" over, Leon.
You're first and foremost a convicted sex offender.
Secondly, you hid that and have only been upfront about it since someone outed you.
Thirdly, since then your story has changed several times and there's no real actual remorse been shown. You're not sorry for your victim here. You're sorry for yourself. You're sorry that you're getting heat from the platform that supported you and allowed you to have a fantastic time, making a viable business from your sexual kink. What I life to have, eh? And you've abused it. YOU ruined it. Nobody else.
Maybe if you don't like to hear what people really think of sexual predators, you shouldn't have sexually assaulted someone. And then after that, if you really did want to be a better man and learn from it, you could have started by being honest with yourself and with everyone else, instead of distorting the truth to the point nobody with any sense actually knows what to believe anymore.
It's impossible to accept it as a genuine error of judgement when you were in a bad place though. And that's purely because you've been telling lies throughout. And using your mental health as an excuse through those lies is an insult to all of us who battle with our mental health daily, without sexually assaulting people at work.
All is love 👌🏻
lchris001 said:
Alright, since so many of you are intent on doing this, can you quote the specific lines from Leon that proves your assertion that he is a liar?
BoRnSloppy said:
He'd have probably gotten more sympathy had he been upfront from the off. The story within this last day or so from his end has changed and twisted as he's gone. He's a liar and a sex offender. It went from a misunderstanding to something a lot more sinister in the space of a few posts. That doesn't promote trust.
People who're outraged are outraged because they want this to be a safe space for all involved to explore their kink.
Outsiders of the fetish would already cast incorrect aspersions towards us wammers, without us sitting here and saying it's okay for a lying sex offender to lurk around in our community and cherry pick his next victim. And who's to say he won't? He says he's put measures in place, but are we to believe him? He's been lying to us all throughout this debate. So, he's not at all to be trusted is he?
What if he's allowed to carry on and we all decide it's fine, "it was a mistake" and then it happens again, and he found his model on here? We're all complicit then in our inaction.
I can't see any remorse here. He's just been telling lies upon lies, based on the way the story keeps changing and he's only addressed it because he's been outed by someone else.
I'm sad. I've watched and enjoyed mostwam content. Have I watched a victim? I fucking hope not! But this goes beyond what gunge tank content I like to wank over with the wife. This is serious. A young woman was sexually assaulted. I wonder how she is? I hope she's okay.
He'd have probably gotten more sympathy had he been upfront from the off. The story within this last day or so from his end has changed and twisted as he's gone. He's a liar and a sex offender. It went from a misunderstanding to something a lot more sinister in the space of a few posts. That doesn't promote trust.
People who're outraged are outraged because they want this to be a safe space for all involved to explore their kink.
Outsiders of the fetish would already cast incorrect aspersions towards us wammers, without us sitting here and saying it's okay for a lying sex offender to lurk around in our community and cherry pick his next victim. And who's to say he won't? He says he's put measures in place, but are we to believe him? He's been lying to us all throughout this debate. So, he's not at all to be trusted is he?
What if he's allowed to carry on and we all decide it's fine, "it was a mistake" and then it happens again, and he found his model on here? We're all complicit then in our inaction.
I can't see any remorse here. He's just been telling lies upon lies, based on the way the story keeps changing and he's only addressed it because he's been outed by someone else.
I'm sad. I've watched and enjoyed mostwam content. Have I watched a victim? I fucking hope not! But this goes beyond what gunge tank content I like to wank over with the wife. This is serious. A young woman was sexually assaulted. I wonder how she is? I hope she's okay.
Alright, since so many of you are intent on doing this, can you quote the specific lines from Leon that proves your assertion that he is a liar?
You can read it all yourself through the course of this thread. I'm not here to do your reading and thinking for you.
All is love 👌🏻
CalGungeFan said: I don't understand why my comments have been attacked.
I believe that I have put quite a balanced point of view across based on the four major points
- We will never know the full truth of what happened
Chantelle: Absolutely true and couldn't agree more with you.
- Leon pleaded guilty to a sex offence, and now he is a sex offender.
Chantelle: Absolutely true again for this time the site does not agree with convicted sex offenders and most people feel that they certainly show me producing the sort of material they are we vulnerable young women.
- Leon put his version of events forward for us that seem plausible...as we've already established thousands of people plead guilty to crimes they didn't commit whatever country you live in... Whether this is the case here or not WE WILL NEVER KNOW!
Chantelle: plausible but not fact, as I stated yes you can feel guilty to something like burglary or shoplifting put a slap on the wrist put something as serious as a sex offence you should defend it all the way if you are innocent because pleading guilty still means you're a sex offender and all that comes with it, unfortunately for Leon his version of events keeps changing with more more blame the import on other people every time he seems to say something even in a message sent to me he then started to say he now has a spurges and ADHD which is another new reason why apparently this happened or at least he pleaded the way you did in court, The longer he is here and commenting the more blame he puts on others or introduces new symptoms and reasons as to why he pleaded guilty in the first place which to me just sounds like he's changing your story and if he's like that on here we only have what he says as evidence as to what actually go into any court as we are not privy to the transcripts so who knows how many times the story changed.
- We know this was a few years ago, we know that the mostwam team is a family, that they know one another and most of them of friends... they will know more information than we do, and they are continuing to shoot with mostwam to this day.
Chantelle: this was 2 1/2 years ago and it went to court this year, Leon had an obligation from the time he was charged to at least let MM know what was going on and upon conviction certainly should've not only been telling the girls he was shooting with anyone else associated with his work but should've also then let MM no again for the dangers it brings to risking comebacks on this site.
Unfortunately he chose none of those options and chose his own greed and hopes that no one would figure out what's going on.
I believe for that reason this is why your comments are being attacked as you are one of the only people that seem to be defending him which okay everyone is entitled to defence but this guy has already pleaded guilty regardless of what could've happened what might of happened it's about the fact that what has happened in the past he choose to take in a court of law..
And based on all of that information I have made my decision and other people have also made a decision.
No one should be condemned here for their opinion based on those four key bits of information. NO ONE HERE IS ON TRIAL!
Anyway, thats probably it for me on the matter... I'm sure this community will thieve regardless of what happens to Mostwam.
I'm sure the right decision will be made
I believe that I have put quite a balanced point of view across based on the four major points
- We will never know the full truth of what happened
Chantelle: Absolutely true and couldn't agree more with you.
- Leon pleaded guilty to a sex offence, and now he is a sex offender.
Chantelle: Absolutely true again for this time the site does not agree with convicted sex offenders and most people feel that they certainly show me producing the sort of material they are we vulnerable young women.
- Leon put his version of events forward for us that seem plausible...as we've already established thousands of people plead guilty to crimes they didn't commit whatever country you live in... Whether this is the case here or not WE WILL NEVER KNOW!
Chantelle: plausible but not fact, as I stated yes you can feel guilty to something like burglary or shoplifting put a slap on the wrist put something as serious as a sex offence you should defend it all the way if you are innocent because pleading guilty still means you're a sex offender and all that comes with it, unfortunately for Leon his version of events keeps changing with more more blame the import on other people every time he seems to say something even in a message sent to me he then started to say he now has a spurges and ADHD which is another new reason why apparently this happened or at least he pleaded the way you did in court, The longer he is here and commenting the more blame he puts on others or introduces new symptoms and reasons as to why he pleaded guilty in the first place which to me just sounds like he's changing your story and if he's like that on here we only have what he says as evidence as to what actually go into any court as we are not privy to the transcripts so who knows how many times the story changed.
- We know this was a few years ago, we know that the mostwam team is a family, that they know one another and most of them of friends... they will know more information than we do, and they are continuing to shoot with mostwam to this day.
Chantelle: this was 2 1/2 years ago and it went to court this year, Leon had an obligation from the time he was charged to at least let MM know what was going on and upon conviction certainly should've not only been telling the girls he was shooting with anyone else associated with his work but should've also then let MM no again for the dangers it brings to risking comebacks on this site.
Unfortunately he chose none of those options and chose his own greed and hopes that no one would figure out what's going on.
I believe for that reason this is why your comments are being attacked as you are one of the only people that seem to be defending him which okay everyone is entitled to defence but this guy has already pleaded guilty regardless of what could've happened what might of happened it's about the fact that what has happened in the past he choose to take in a court of law..
And based on all of that information I have made my decision and other people have also made a decision.
No one should be condemned here for their opinion based on those four key bits of information. NO ONE HERE IS ON TRIAL!
Anyway, thats probably it for me on the matter... I'm sure this community will thieve regardless of what happens to Mostwam.
I'm sure the right decision will be made
Above I've answered each one of your questions with a fair and reasonable comment
I wanna be messy
lchris001 said:
Also, legal factors aside, I would caution Leon from apologizing to the mob [this is not directed at any one person, but "the mob" in general]. The cancel culture people are NOT interested in your confession. All they want is to DESTROY you. These people do not believe in forgiveness or redemption, they just want to see you suffer and die. If you are really innocent, do not bend the knee. Once you bend the knee, they will just capitalize on that and attack you even more.
Also, legal factors aside, I would caution Leon from apologizing to the mob [this is not directed at any one person, but "the mob" in general]. The cancel culture people are NOT interested in your confession. All they want is to DESTROY you. These people do not believe in forgiveness or redemption, they just want to see you suffer and die. If you are really innocent, do not bend the knee. Once you bend the knee, they will just capitalize on that and attack you even more.
BoRnSloppy said:
You haven't got anything to say "wow" over, Leon.
You're first and foremost a convicted sex offender.
Secondly, you hid that and have only been upfront about it since someone outed you.
Thirdly, since then your story has changed several times and there's no real actual remorse been shown. You're not sorry for your victim here. You're sorry for yourself. You're sorry that you're getting heat from the platform that supported you and allowed you to have a fantastic time, making a viable business from your sexual kink. What I life to have, eh? And you've abused it. YOU ruined it. Nobody else.
Maybe if you don't like to hear what people really think of sexual predators, you shouldn't have sexually assaulted someone. And then after that, if you really did want to be a better man and learn from it, you could have started by being honest with yourself and with everyone else, instead of distorting the truth to the point nobody with any sense actually knows what to believe anymore.
It's impossible to accept it as a genuine error of judgement when you were in a bad place though. And that's purely because you've been telling lies throughout. And using your mental health as an excuse through those lies is an insult to all of us who battle with our mental health daily, without sexually assaulting people at work.
You haven't got anything to say "wow" over, Leon.
You're first and foremost a convicted sex offender.
Secondly, you hid that and have only been upfront about it since someone outed you.
Thirdly, since then your story has changed several times and there's no real actual remorse been shown. You're not sorry for your victim here. You're sorry for yourself. You're sorry that you're getting heat from the platform that supported you and allowed you to have a fantastic time, making a viable business from your sexual kink. What I life to have, eh? And you've abused it. YOU ruined it. Nobody else.
Maybe if you don't like to hear what people really think of sexual predators, you shouldn't have sexually assaulted someone. And then after that, if you really did want to be a better man and learn from it, you could have started by being honest with yourself and with everyone else, instead of distorting the truth to the point nobody with any sense actually knows what to believe anymore.
It's impossible to accept it as a genuine error of judgement when you were in a bad place though. And that's purely because you've been telling lies throughout. And using your mental health as an excuse through those lies is an insult to all of us who battle with our mental health daily, without sexually assaulting people at work.
This is both sad and funny at the same time. Within 1 hr of my post, Leon did his apology post, and the post above me just went in for the next kill. Thanks BoRnSloppy for proving my point. You can never win with these cancel culture folks. The best solution is double down on your resolve, move on and fight the good fight.
lchris001 said:Oh yes, here comes the "moral argument" and your holier than thou attitude. I spend my money how I like, you spend your money how you like. You keep your quasi-religious moral superiority BS to yourself and stop telling others how to act and we will be cool.
Being against the idea of a convicted sex offender who pleaded guilty doing business on UMD is not some quasi-religious moral superiority BS, lots of people would say there shouldn't even be a question about whether or not it's appropriate for things to continue as if nothing happened.
The only way for Leon to fix it involves clearing his name and that's the blunt truth of it.
This was always going to happen, ignoring it and hoping that the situation will just go away doesn't work and never will.
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