Long time lurker here (10+ years), hopefully it belongs here.

Had signs that I was into this stuff since I was 7 or so (weird fascination with quicksand and mud scenes on TV) on top of having absolutely no interest in naked women, I'm 26 and never got off to intercourse porn or someone being naked nor did I have any interest in it. If anything it's the opposite, once the clothes come off I lose interest. On top of that I also have a hair fetish (WAM or not), so it's either head coverage or clothes on, anything else is zero interest for me. Sex WAM doesn't do it for me either.

Meanwhile all the articles you read online seem to imply that a "fetish" is something on top of a "vanilla" life, not a total replacement which probably ends up being a complete deal breaker which is why I've never even tried to have a relationship.

What is it like for most people here, is WAM more of a kink on top being into vanilla or a total replacement for anything sexual? And how much of an impact did it have on your dating life?

Firstly, welcome. I hope you don't throwaway the account. Also, I think this is an ok thread for here. It does have to do with mess, and also asks more broad questions like what people consider a fetish. Well, as far as definitions go

fetish
/fediSH/
Learn to pronounce
noun
1. a form of sexual desire in which gratification is linked to an abnormal degree to a particular object, item of clothing, part of the body, etc.
"Victorian men developed fetishes focusing on feet, shoes, and boots"
synonyms: fixation, sexual fixation, obsession, compulsion, mania;

However, you will find people use it interchangeably with words like 'kink'. Personally for me, if cake is like sex; than WAM is like icing. If I have them together it's even better. That said neither are something I "need" in life. I won't die or kill myself if I don't have sex, I'll just be really depressed (which isn't really that unnatural for sexually charged people). So I guess it's not really a fetish for me so much as something of an enhancer.

Using the same illustration, you will find there are a lot of people who aren't interested in cake; only icing, or something completely different. There ARE also people out there that simply cannot get off with regular traditional sexual contact, but are not asexual people. I hope that they will chime in, and also that the thread stays.

There are a lot of threads in the "Relationships" group that have long since been deleted by the various OPs for a variety of reasons. Sadly, this means they're not around for others to gain insight later. Given your choice of handle name here, I can only hope this doesn't join them.

I'm hoping you can find the insight and answers you are seeking.

The difference between a fetish and a sexual orientation is a question of semantics. As you say, the way fetish and kink are discussed in the mainstream makes them sound like optional extras to spice up sex with, 50-Shades-style. But in reality, a fetish can be core to someone's sexual identity, or even constitute their primary sexual orientation. It's a question of how exclusive the paraphilia is. Some people are turned on by vanilla sex in addition to their kink, some people are turned on by their kink and nothing else (so aren't that interested in sex or nudity), some people have a range of turn-ons. For some wammers and other types of fetishist, their primary erotic target is themselves and they aren't especially attracted to other people at all. A lot of guys in the asexual community are only "asexual" because their primary erotic focus is something other than penetrative sex.

For those of us for whom our fetish is our main orientation, I think it's useful to try and broaden your range of turn-ons, just as a way of connecting with other people. I'm a gay guy, but I've never been aroused by porn or interested in male genitalia (let alone anal sex), but over the years I've been able to broaden the range of activities I'm comfortable with, and have discovered things I like along the way. I'm still a wammer first and foremost, and that will never change, but working to broaden my boundaries has made me more flexible, experienced and better able to connect with people than I used to be. (It's something I'd advise asexuals generally - sex is a learning curve and, with time and with the right person, can be enjoyable and sensual even if you're never gonna be super-into it.)

If you've lurked for 10 years and temporarily created a new account just to ask this question, I think you might have issues with internalised shame about not being "normal". Trust me, the internet (and world) are full of people into way worse things than women getting muddy and their hair getting messy. That's totally benign and cute, and if you make a good emotional/romantic connection with a woman, is something a cool potential girlfriend would hopefully be up for if you sell it to her the right way. Compared to the things lots of men want their wives to do for them, it's mild.

Firstly...welcome!

Alright, I am a huge hair fan as well. Messy or not (but mostly messy). I really REALLY like super long hair, and on the thicker side.

(And I deeply appreciate the models on here that deal with the day to day of taking care of long hair AND that are willing to mess it up!)

My main fetish is WAM; Slime above all else, but also love pies and chocolate syrup. I feel like I have spent a small fortune trashing my wife. HOWEVER my fetishes also include long white socks that look super dirty on the bottoms. And another kink of mine is that I really like giving facials.

I am lucky enough to have a wife (old high school fling that came back into my life) that is super awesome about my fetishes. She has super long and thick hair. She has fun with WAM and all, but we made an agreement that I would pay for colorings, shampoo, and conditioner since she would be using extra of all of these because of me, lol.

POINT BEING...that I had two serious relationships before her. One for 2.5 years where she really didn't have that much fun with WAM but also didn't hate it; we did it on occasion. And another before her of 3.5 years who definitely hated WAM, and I could only get her to do it like three times a year.

Basically, as I got older (I'm 34 now) I became more confident and grew into myself mentally...I realized as I went through these relationships that you shouldn't settle. Find someone who can make you happy. It may not be 100% EXACTLY what you want (I would love to see my wife in WAM scenes with other woman getting messy with her, but that's never going to happen!)

I came to realize that sex and my fetishes were a big part of who I am. I am a very sexual person and I didn't want to have to hide that or my kinks/desires from who I am with.

Oh, and as for the socks, provided I buy them, she will purposely get all the pairs dirty on the bottoms and wear them every day of the week. As long as she can have it however hot or cold in the house she wants (she controls the thermostat.)

A relationship is a give and take. Decide whats important to you and don't settle for someone or a situation that you aren't happy with like I almost did. I know that I could NOT be in a relationship without WAM. It's who I am. I don't need it for day to day sexual gratification, but I DO need it in my life. I NEED to WAM my partner and WAM in general. I usually jerk off to facial compilations and/or WAM vids of videos I purchased or vidoes my wife and I made...but I ALWAYS cum to a women being slimed. 100%. WAM is a part of my identity for sure.

It's like....I may never get that girl on girl WAM scene that I really, really want....and I may never convince my wife to have her friend jerk me off onto my wife's face or vice-versa...but this Saturday I will see her in a schoolgirl outfit (complete with big slouchy white socks of course) on her knees, wearing a leash and collar. As I walk her around the kitchen and jam her head into buckets of slime and pies while I fuck her from behind...provided our 14 month old isn't being an ass at the grandmas!

My last piece of advice is to definitely tell a new person you are dating about your kinks/fetishes/desires within a month or so of the relationship. For sure.

That's fucking HOT!

Oh yeah...back on topic to reiterate what piecub said as well about "normal". People misuse that term all the time. Remember normal is a math term. It's a standard, the top of the bell curve etc. But it in of it self has nothing to do with morality/right and wrong (unless you're talking about normal being not a murder for instance).

If you're not harming someone or infringing on their liberties, than don't worry about "normal". Embrace who you are, it might take time, but man you will feel a lot better about yourself and life in general.

I never done WAM before with someone so all I can say is what I'm curious about. Getting messy with food to tease and tempt someone appeals to me. Because I like feet, wam syncs up nicely in that regard. As far as the dating life, it's been a curse. I haven't found a local lady that would like to indulge me with messy feet, dirty, or the clean aspects of my fetish. I'm resigned I'm too kinky for many women.

Well put.

I'm 39 now, and I have been on this page since I was 18. That sounds kind of fucking crazy now that I have typed it out and read it. I can honestly tell you my sexuality has changed(evolved?), since I've been here.

I've been actively been getting pied by women since my teens fairly frequently. I didn't have sex with a woman until I was 25, and I didn't really like it. I just wanted to get messy. That feeling changed a few years later, so don't let it throw you off from pursuing a relationship. Also consider that you might nt purely be into women.

All I'm saying is don't write yourself off as strictly a pie guy quite yet.

I'm like you. WAM is a bit of fun for me. I don't really do it for sexual kick, although I do understand why it turns some people on. I prefer to keep my sex life separate from my wam life.
Saying that though, as a gay man, I only really like getting pied by other men. I don't feel like I would enjoy it as much if I was getting pied by a woman. I know that's a weird thing, but, everyone is weird in their own way.

It has been my honour and privilege to have met with Scotspieman many times for flan flinging and custard pie fun, and I was the first ever to pie and gunge him back in the 200's... I totally agree - pie fun doesn't have to be sexual at all, and I have some great mates who do it for a laugh, for fun, and he has pied me many times. Top blokey, and I hope I can continue to pie him in the future. His profile pic is a sample of what I have done to him - he is Great!!!!

i know that when i started dating before, i told this person about what i do, i told this person that i enjoyed it but they did not have to participate at all. I asked how they felt. They said that as far as what i "do" they thought it was really cool and they had no problem with it. I never pushed my fetishes onto them at all. I would happily await a custom request and then get to have my fun. They were totally cool with it....

but.....if ANYTHING EVER came to rise....an argument or anythign....THEY ALWAYS USED MY KINK AGAINST ME. always.

"you roll in food for a living, wow, you certainly are a winner" "you want to pie me in the face? is this making you mad, you wanna pie me??" and laughing at me mockingly.

dont tell your fetish to someone unless this is wifey material or husband material (which i thought they were) but yeah. ANYONE who really gives a shit about you wont rub what you like or do in your face like that. its silly. i never said anything about him liking to fuck me with giant dildos. ever. you just dont do that. so, if you tell someone. find it to be someone you trust. trust comes with time

Wow...I hope you pied him in the face...really hard.

Everybody has a different situation of course. I'm probably a little older than many here and I've been married for almost 30 years without my wife knowing what really works for me. I've had my interests since I was born but didn't know that was okay until the internet era opened a new door to my life. For many reasons I think I'm one of the luckiest guys on earth. Kind of like Clark Kent I am the most sedate plain vanilla dork you ever met in real life. I grew up like that and had a "normal" sexual development and typical experiences growing up. "Normal" stuff works fine for me. Bring out the mud/qs stuff or any of my other interests and I turn into a different guy - Superman instead of Clark Kent. I've traveled all over doing what i do. It's been great. But nobody in my "real" life knows about it. I didn't know it was okay to have these interests until Feb '95. Now I find myself well versed in my fetish and in the plain vanilla world. I greatly enjoy both.

I would greatly caution against being too quick to share your interest with anyone. It's not something to be casually discussed because many just won't get it. Never will. It's like you are speaking another language so don't expect them too. They aren't bad people they just lack the wiring. You can love them anyway.

That's really shitty that they had to use your fetish against you like that. I've told a few people I can trust about WAM and I can trust them to not say anything.

Also Jayce, you sound like you are wifey material!

Other than clothed WAM, I'm completely asexual, as soon as the clothes come off I lose all erotic interest and have never had any desire to actually have sex with anyone. I can look at a nude person or a well taken nude photo and admire the aesthetics, but there is absolutely nothing erotic there at all. However, an attractive woman dressed in clothes I like the look of, willingly getting wet or messy, can drive me utterly wild - but in a solo way.

I've had a few relationships, some were good, some were less so, but all ended because basically most women, quite reasonably, want and expect a sexual relationship with their partner, so what they want I can't give. Been single now for over a decade and don't really expect to have another relationship, instead I have some awesome friends who I get to travel with and go on adventures with, a cat for cuddles and company, and a vast range of WAM material, both my own productions and bought downloads from others, for turn on. What I do know is my personal solo sex life was always best when I was living on my own.

I guess I'm one of the lucky ones I've been into this for many years as you will know and I'm sure many videos I have told people in the past and it hasn't really gone down well but I think I'm weird so imagine my surprise when one day On a vanilla London splosh mate I'm at a guy at the time was in a relationship the same as me at the time we all became friends and thought no more of it five years later we were both separated for different reasons and happen to bump into each other after about four years being out of contact we got chatting and very quickly he asked me if I fancied going for a drink
That night I think we both talked about everything but the fetish we both had but then realised it was first introduced us to each other it was at this point I can honestly say admit the guy that I finally think I deserved
We have now been together for almost 2 years and he is the one I trust morning thing not only does he help run my page shoot my videos get everything ready and clean up most of it as well but I also get to cuddle up with this guy the end of an evening watch the TV or go for a nice meal together
If I'm honest I never fought I would meet someone that was into this like me but DazUk has really opened my eyes to things now we have the best of both worlds the fetish we both share in and The best relationship I could've ever dreamt of
And the fact that he even lets me do personal meets with some of my friends without any issues it's an absolute bonus
Obviously he is always there but generally he is happy to just film what goes on day today the lucky thing for me is what happens off the camera after he's put the camera down when he finally gets to join me then the fun really begins unfortunately those videos of our pleasure only LOL
I have had my fetish for many years from a lot of people but I can truly say if you don't bring it up mention it in the early stages of a relationship then it will just become harder and harder every day to hide things and your feelings for what you want to do so hopefully this will inspire some of you to take the Nextep and have a bloody good messy time

Kisses

XX Chantelle XX

It's hard to be really into anything and find "normal" as much fun. As i've got older I think i've managed to enjoy "normal" and then really enjoy WAM. I broached WAM as a fun thing and started with sweet and fun experiences which were great fun and really sexy. I moved towards my love of mud and am fortunate that i can enjoy this with my wife on a few occasions a year. I've not managed outdoor/esturary which is my ultimate turn on. However it's a halfway house, so I still get to enjoy that on my own very occasionally. Go steady and someone you are close to would most likely try somthing fun. Keep hardcore things for your private times until you think someone would be ok with the idea. Don't push it, if not keep it your thing

First of all, Jayce, I'm really sorry you experienced that, it hurt my heart reading it. That's truly cruel and awful and no one should ever make you feel that way, especially not someone you trust and have allowed yourself to be vulnerable with.

As for the topic at hand, I went through periods where I was obsessed with WAM (both watching it and doing it) and a few times when I disconnected from it and thought it didn't interest me at all. I sometimes convinced myself that I didn't need to see or think about WAM to be aroused or to enjoy sex, probably to a large extent because of shame and fear of judgement. While I sometimes shared more mainstream sexual interests like BDSM or liking to be spanked with partners, I rarely admitted to having a WAM fetish, honestly because I thought it was deeply embarrassing and I didn't think anyone would understand. Once a boyfriend found a UMD window open on my computer; he wasn't actually judgmental, more like "???", but I was so mortified that I refused to discuss it and we never spoke about it. I also had a few very kink-friendly partners who probably would have thought nothing of trying WAM with me, but I never could bring myself to talk about it. I had long accepted it was something deeply private and suppressed that I'd never share, much less experience with anyone.

I certainly enjoyed and had both robust and vanilla sexual experiences in my life that didn't involve WAM. But over time and as I grew older, I got a lot more sure and confident and honest about myself and my preferences, in my life in general and certainly surrounding my sexuality.

I used to believe that while I loved sex, it was not the most important thing in a relationship. I believed that an otherwise good relationship that wasn't completely sexually fulfilling could and "should" be sustained. But when I was deeply real with myself, I knew for me that wasn't actually the case. Accepting and owning that WAM was not only my core fetish, but a key part of my sexual identity that I wanted to have engaged was a turning point in my life.

Many people will tell you it's not possible to have everything you want in life or from a romantic partner, and it's easy to believe that. I think allowing yourself to feel that you are deserving of both great love and complete and total sexual satisfaction is a big step for a lot of people. It certainly was for me. But I have to say the results have been worth it

This.

Long story (personally speaking); but so well said, and so, so true.

I couldn't agree with Kittenish more. Unfortunately Jayce, it sounds to me as if the person in particular was an A-Hole to begin with, and sooner or later their true colors come out regardless.
For me personally, I may be a little different. Fetishes, I have them obviously, and they're great, a, lot of fun and exciting. However, Life, famil, friends and people always come first . Also,I'm very different with Fetishes I've been told as for example, one of my fetishes,I have a huge foot, heel and leg fetish However, I do not get turned on by just anyones feet or legs....I need to be into the person first or the fetish loses its luster. If i see a cool pair of heels, it only becomes sexy if i'm picturing them on someone I'm into. If the other person has a nasty personality, isn't nice or not attractive to me, the fetish is gone.

As another aside, half of my fetishes or likes were developed by playing and experimenting with other girlfiriends & women I engage in fetish play with in trying it just to satisfy them or because they were into it. Fetishes can be extended foreplay, Wam in particular, its a cool, fun & creative way to prolong and intense heat racing foreplay making the conclusion so much more explosive and repetitive. Doing it with a partner that turns you on or that you are into in a much deeper way, makes it that much better.
People who are judgemental and uptight are typical not accepting of many things and not only fetishes. In my experience theyre not people you'll ever enjoy your fetishes with or enjoy a relationship with.
At that same token, fetishes are just fetishes, and they're fun, but shouldn't define who you are when it comes to relationships. Just my 2 cents....

One thing to keep in mind in relationships/fetishes is that nobody chooses which fetish turns them on. It's impossible to change. If, for instance, I thought that I would like to learn to be exceptionally aroused by corsets, I couldn't choose to do it. Likewise, WAM can't be driven out of me.

Learn to accept what you are then go and enjoy life.

-RSR