This question pertains to the videos that you love and have watched lots of times.

When you are watching, do you say things to yourself like, "Oh this pie makes it look like she has a beard, so I am going to fast forward to the next pie hit." Or "This one left her forehead too clean, so lets move it along to the next one." Stuff like that.

As an example, when I watch this Cadence video, I hate the part where she has a big blob hanging off the side of her face. I dunno - it bugs me. So I fast forward to the part where she has wiped it away.

Am I alone in my anal-ness?

Well, Cadence Lux looks great in everything she does. Huge blob of pie or not, she's still freakin hot!

Quite fussy, to the point where I'm even annoying myself, let alone a possible producer if I were to ever order a custom.

Most of my fussiness is answered by looking at preview pics/vids prior to buying, or in this case, not buying. If I don't like how a model looks or what they're wearing, I obviously won't buy.

I tend to buy if I like the models looks and their clothes and if there is something particular that I think might happen (clothes might fill up with mess, or there might be a nip slip, or she's positioned a certain way for a sliming, or how the slime looks). Sometimes it's one particular thing, some times it's a few, and sometimes I can't tell if it does happen in the video or not based on the preview pics.

But then I'll get fussy if those things don't happen, (maybe the model was leaning forward when being slimed). I don't get too mad because I obviously liked the model or models and the concept of the video. I'm way more of a picky buyer than a picky watcher.

Moderately fussy. I tend to get fussy when the hits just aren't good coverage. Take time and make sure the pies WORK as intended first. Like that Xena Warrior Princess pie fight where they made the pies out of mashed potatoes so the coverage was crap.

Any person in 2020 saying they're "not fussy at all" is almost definitely lying.

There's more WAM videos being released in a week in 2020 than came out in an entire YEAR in, say, 1997. And with that kind of choice and sheer numbers of scenes, it both means that producers are doing "niche of a niche of a niche," and customers can basically eliminate scenes if even ONE element isn't to their liking.

By comparison, there might've been 10 producer pie scenes released in 1997, TOTAL. If none of the 10 suited me completely (and they often didn't), I either got one that was "close enough," or I didn't buy anything.

Think about the fact that before Neil and Phoebe (and then Messygirl and Robby), you basically had NO producer pie scenes where the model didn't get naked at some point. "Clothed WAM" basically didn't exist unless you turned off the scene after the first couple minutes! Now you could buy 20 clothed WAM scenes a day on the UMD and never run out. (Of scenes, not money.) Unless you have millions to spend on WAM and unlimited hours to watch everything, you're bound to start being fussy.

And just on a personal level, not only do I barely EVER buy other producer stuff, but even my own stuff.... with models I love and scenes shot to my own specs.... has moments that bug me. Sometimes just a bad hit or whatever. Sometimes an entire scene that just didn't work like I wanted it to, for whatever reason. The kid from the early 90s who was thrilled to get even semi-messy scenes from TV wouldn't recognize this fussy old guy now.

Its a Brave New World...

Ooooh--let me make a sub-question:
Does your level of fussiness change depending on whether it's a random internet find (youtube, facebook, gameshow, etc) or if it's from a producer?

I'm very fussy about camera work, especially in deliberately produced WAM material.

With a mainstream show or movie you know they weren't trying to show WAM and probably don't even know WAM is a thing, but when an actual WAM producer misses the money shots due to idiotic camera angles, HULKSMASH!!!

It's such an apples-and-oranges comparison tho. Two huge differences:
1) Aside from the WAM aspects, the level of almost EVERYTHING else--production, sets, lighting, cameras, and of course the "fame" of the target--is vastly higher. Like, on a "no producer can compete with this" level. So I find myself seeking out good mainstream scenes simply because there's a professionalism level that us producers can't pull off. (Obviously, the trade-off is you don't get the level or quality of mess across the board.)
2) Mainstream scenes are basically FREE. They just require some work to find, but there's no monetary downside to, say, watching 50 episodes of some weird foreign gameshow to find a few good messy moments.

I suspect that if mainstream clips cost money (like, if we had to pay $10 to watch a new PoR episode every week), then the fussiness level would be off the charts. As it is, I assume most of the folks who obsess over and complain about the failings of mainstream clips (like, again, PoR) are not really the same audience buying producer clips. Just a different frame of mind altogether.

I know. Her body is just perfect. Face too!

I feel like most of the answers here don't answer Bozo1's question. My answer is yes, watching a favorite vid, I'll fast forward to parts I like. I prefer thrown pies to 'delivered' pies so I'll forward to them sometimes. I'll fast forward past guys getting hit, as in the Great Race.

If I've watched a video enough, I know where the good stuff (for me) is and I can go right to it.

You are right. Most people didn't really address the specific thing I was asking. So thank you! (But I don't watch men no matter what. )

Well, that was kinda my point. Maybe it got lost. I tend to go to the specific moments of my OWN videos, rather than watch the whole thing. And some I just don't watch at all.

I guess we turned it into a broader point about being fussy when it comes to BUYING vids.

I honestly just assumed everyone did this, always. Maybe back in the VCR days I watched entire scenes, but now I think everyone goes straight to the "good part" (whatever that might be) on repeated viewings. I mean, there's a reason all the WAM-centric YT channels focusing on mainstream clips just show 30 seconds of an hour-long show.

Really interesting analysis here. I sometimes get annoyed when a producer posts some pics from a new scene and someone will, passive-aggressively, ask whether the producer ever thought of: doing a scene with that model topless, showing the model barefoot, why don't you do one where the slime comes before the pie, why don't you do one where the pie comes before the slime, etc. The reality is that the customer can afford to be picky because the number of scenes out there is large-- at least compared to the 1990s. However, our little part of the fetishverse isn't alone in this. I wonder sometimes if the sheer quantity, quality and ubiquitous nature of porn today will warp people's sexuality into something we might not necessarily find beneficial.

BOZO1:

"How fussy...?" Seriously? Have you seen the umd?

It breaks my heart when there's a model with the most perfect butt, and a pie doesn't go anywhere near it, ever, even in multiple shoots, but apart from that, I'm not really fussy

I'm fussy enough where almost nothing for sale remotely gets my attention. I only like f/f and the more the better. Cannot be nudity and the girl throwing the pie needs to be mean, the girl getting hit needs to be embarrassed.

Crust coverage is key, but not rubbing it all over their hair. I don't even bother with paid clips and produce my own content.

How there are "80" pie producers and every one of the gets is wrong stuns me (joking)

You only read my title and not my post. I think I offer an original question.

i'm going to break my answer into two parts, one to answer the specific wording of the thread title and one to answer the "spirit" of the thread title (in that order).

1. When it comes to watching videos specifically, the only real things that makes me fussy are:
- the surprise presence of guys getting messy (this mostly relates to super amateur stuff found everywhere).

- focus only on the head and shoulders. It drives me bonkers when there's complete and utter messing but all that's shown is the head and shoulders. Like 'what's the point' unless they're aiming for face/head fetishists. I prefer to see full body view because then you get the 'full' wam feeling.

=========================
2. On the spirit of the question: Well, most of my fussiness comes out when selecting video in the first place.

The ugly reality is....most pie producers here have zero imagination. The scenes are boring and have stayed the same since I joined here when UMD first stated (on my second profile.)

Nothing changes. When I see a new pie vid there's a 95% chance it's a solo girl, sitting in a chair (or maybe even standing!) getting hit with a pie from the "mystery hand" or self-pieing.

It is boring as all living hell. Stop it....please....stop it.

For pie producers - you're counting on news sales from the same tired scenes only based on having a new model.

I run a different fetish business and I'll tell you right now, if I treated that as pie producers treat this one, I'd be out of business. Same shit...different girl? That's just played out. I'd get the bare minimum sales, not maximum.

It's all just so boring.

Shit, get creative. Buy a prize wheel: https://www.amazon.com/WinSpin-Fortune-Folding-Carnival-Spinnig/dp/B00OZH6JO0/ref=sr_1_43?dchild=1&keywords=prize+wheel&qid=1587554404&sr=8-43 and mark it with different messy things that will happen to her.

But for the love of god, start getting innovate.

One great thing that one can do when one purchases & downloads a video is that one can re-edit it for one's liking. That's what I do all the time.

Cut out the parts I don't want using Avidemux free video editor, concatenate them in any order,
as many times as one wants.

I used to throw away the originals and keep just my edited parts.
But, for historical reasons, I don't do that any more: I keep the originals I purchased.

Also, to follow up on johnnypie's comment: I actually DON'T want producers getting creative.
My imagination IS pretty simple. But, I have to admit it, and there's no nice way to put it: producers are simply NOT imagining it EXACTLY the way I wish it. OBVIOUSLY not the producer's "fault" or responsibility or obligation. Many of them get so so VERY VERY close to how I would direct a shoot, but there's always some element that they miss:
e.g. not holding long enough on a post-hit shot,
e.g. going straight to topless and/or nude rather than remaining in underwear throughout.

One of the videos that I recently bought that was just 99.99% of the way there
was Anglefan's "Ladonna".

I see many excellent pics from the much smaller less profitable (is that the best word to use?) producers in the Download Stores sections.

Part of the excitement of buying a new wam video is seeing how close they'll get to my preferred imagination. In essence, part of me doesn't want to have an absolute 100% perfect wam video, because I always want the thrill, the challenge, to be still ahead of me
to fulfill, like a rapidly converging function that never reaches its limit.

Not that I will ever have enough money to justify buying a custom, but, I know I'd have to spend a LOT of money for one element that I feel uncomfortable discussing but that IS an important issue for me. My directions to the models would, from my pov at least, be simple: I would not ask them to say anything. But, I would hope the producers would consider it the way *I* consider it: an interesting & important technological challenge that even if failed would be worth the effort.

I've said this before but it's worth repeating. I'm into a fair amount of fetishes and members of those communities.

I have never seen anyone more picky about content than the WAM community. Its just crazy. I do applaud WAM producers because they put up with a lot.

"Wow....great preview pics. Man...I'd buy that but she'd need to be wearing a lime green button down shirt and a black knee-length skirt. I also only buys vids where girl is in a poneytail, and her hair was down. I also only like colored pies, but only blue and green."

Yeah....screw that.

It's stunning to me that adding more girls does not produce more sales but I've seen the metrics here, and it doesn't.

The WAM community does not really seem to support 2, 3, 4 girl shoots.

That 3-girl very short video I shared? I'd have taken a HUGE bath on that had I turned it into an actual production. At $10, I'm guessing that maybe....maybe I'd have sold 50. That would never even have covered modeling expenses, not to mention pie costs and my time.

For a good 3-girl shoot, one scene I'd have to pay at minimum $200 per model = $600. Add $100 in pie/crust costs (shaving cream) and I'm at $700.

I don't get out of bed doing this unless I can make a fair profit. At $10 I'd need to sell 70 and I'd have to sell 100 to minimally make it worth my time. That's laughable. I'd never sell 100.

Kody got 5 custom requests from that. She did 1....1 of them. The other 4 wanted to pay her $50 to do a pie custom. You all got some broke-ass members in this fetish - lol.

In the mean time, she does about 10 customs a week for other fetishes where their members have no money issues.

I will, however, put up another freebie since I get my personal kicks having them do private scenes...but the only way I can pull that off financially is they're already at my shoot, being paid. I just have to throw them a bit extra.

So watch for a free 4-girl pie scene coming up that I'll share for free.

Trust me, I'd like nothing better than to jump into the WAM producing game. I've done the math a hundred different ways and none of it plays out for me.

The best I could do is start a Patreon and put the pie scenes in there. The issue with that? Not sure I'd get more than maybe 10 members.

My tastes seem to be the polar opposite of what everyone here likes - which is comedy. For me, it has to be an angry girl hitting another girl with a pie - hard, and that girl is all pissed off and goes for revenge.

But that, somehow, seems to be too dark for this crowd.

What ARE the absolute & % breakdowns of cost for making a WAM video?
Any producers want to chime in?

I can't speak for others, but I pay my models $100/hr with normally a three hour minimum. This is for non-nude and nothing sexually explicit.

So if I did a 3-girl pie shoot, 3 hours, the modeling cost would be $900. I use Hilton points, so I can rent a large place like Homewood Suites, so no costs there. I know a lot of producers use their homes.

If I did pies with shaving cream and crusts, I think crusts are cheap - like $2. So if we wanted 20 pies that's another $40 - shaving cream cost is nominal.

So a 3-girl shoot dedicated to pies would be $1,000.

But what I'd do is break that down into like 4 or 5 sell-able scenes. But now that gets a lot more complicated since if I wanted each scene to be independent, all three girls would have to shower and blow dry their hair.

If I did get 4 scenes out of it, I'd need to net (not gross) $250 per scene sold. At $10 that's 25 orders per scene, and I doubt I'd get that.

Johnnypie you seem to have the same level of interest as me. I'd most definitely watch your produced works. Clothed wam humiliation is the best.

Biting my tongue, not going to use lots of nasty words for you after your comment.

What an ass.

We have done public scripted pies, we have done PiekemonGo, we have done restaurant tit 4 tat, we have done pie the stand up comedienne, we have done pie games and lots of random scenes, we have even done the "spin the wheel" mess thing you rather un-originally mentioned. We have also done LOADS of multi girl pie scenes.
We have done ycdtoti.com, with a pie scene in an aeroplane cockpit.
We have done so many original methods of a girl getting hit in the face with a pie (which in effect is in itself an incredibly repetitive subject matter).

Not just us but many other producers have great ideas and concepts, now for whatever reason you didn't buy them or enjoy them, or even remember them?

It could be that you don't like how our girls were dressed, it could be that you don't like our pie mix, it could be that you just don't like British people? Or you simply don't like our girls full stop?
That is down to your tastes, more than our creativity.

It makes me fucking mad when a jack ass like you claiming to have vast experience in some other unmentioned fetish comes in here and makes a sweeping statements attacking and insulting all the pie producers.

Do it, use your vast fetish producing experience and shoot a fucking amazing, original pie scene, that will blow us all away with you superior creativity and imagination.

Don't be surprised though, if you create your masterpiece and launch it full of pride, only for it to sell really badly, due to you not covering enough niches within niches, then get forgotten about by some jack ass who doesn't share your EXACT tastes for what he wants, the pie, the girl, the clothes, the setting and scenario, even the girl's hair colour, or excess or lack of tattoos.
Who then comes here and says he has never seen anyone be creative making pie scenes.

https://mostwam-store.umd.net/download_info/messmas-countdown-day-8-amber-lucy-gtg
https://mostwam-store.umd.net/downloads/i/all/genre/restaurant
https://mostwam-store.umd.net/downloads/i/all/genre/pies
https://customwam-store.umd.net/downloads/i/all/genre/Pies
https://ycdtoti.umd.net

Yikes!

There ARE a lot of unimaginative, repetitive pie videos like the ones you describe, Johnnypie, but there are plenty of exceptions too. I was about to speak up for MostWam, MessyGirl, RevSlymsford, Ariel & Jayce ... but Leon beat me to the punch on his own behalf. He's certainly right to defend himself and some other producers on that score. (Please note that the producers I listed were the ones who sprang immediately to mind as offering a wide variety of different setups and settings for pie videos AND frequent use of two or more models in those videos. I'm sure I've left some other very worthy folks out here.)

Johnnypie, my main interest in pie videos has always been comedy, but I honestly absolutely LOVED the three videos you posted earlier this year, and I would eagerly buy full-length pie videos you made with these models. And probably pie videos you made with other models too, if you had ones that were as expressive as Kody and Macy. (Kody's sister London is attractive, but not nearly in the same class in terms of expressiveness, at least not based only on what we see of her in those short videos. If she were the third model in a video with Kody and Nicole, though, I would buy it in a heartbeat.)

I also chat with a lot of members here who, like me, are into pies in particular, and honestly, they all loved what they saw. Seriously loved them. Sure many of these folks probably still wouldn't buy your (hypothetical) full-length pie videos for one reason or another. I'm not arguing you'd do financially well with the pie videos you dream of making, this is clearly the toughest of fetish markets.

I'm just saying that I really don't think the two interests (comedy/humiliation) are nearly as mutually exclusive as you seem to think. I mean, even in comedy, the pie is supposed to be humiliating, and I think we all get that the models are mostly ACTING in pie videos, whether they are based in comedy or not. All of the producers I mentioned above (MostWam, MessyGirl, RevSlymsford, Ariel, Jayce) have a fair percentage of scenes where I would say the pies are more "humilating" than "comedic." (Lots of videos where a boss messes up an errant employee, for example. Or where a frustrated employee takes revenge on a mean boss. Or where a customer pisses off a waitress and ends up wearing the dessert cart. Or where one girl is upset with a friend for stealing her boyfriend or ruining a borrowed item of clothing. Or where a caterer messes up a big dessert order and pays a messy price from the angry customer. I could go on...)

I guess most of these producers just don't float your boat -- whether because they have nudity or break one of your other rules, or you just haven't given them a fair chance -- but it's pretty clear a lot of pie fans in general actually LIKE humilation in pie videos, otherwise these producers would presumably stop making these sorts of videos.