I was wondering......... has any producer ever had a relationship with a model? Or maybe just a one-nighter?

You would think so. Because a lot of producers hire the models that they do because they find them attractive. If the model is (ideally) single and happens to find them just as attractive, it could happen. Right?

I'm sure there have been opportunities for fornication.

My 2nd Wife was a Fetish Model, actually it was she who introduced me to playing in Mud. My current permanent partner is also a Model.


Phil

I got lucky once on one of Lenny's shoots in Florida.
Forgot the models name. Maybe Lenny can fill in the blank. lol

Got along very well with Asia Carrera. We hit it off when we picked her up at the airport. I remember we all went to dinner and someone who spent a LOT of money on customs grabbed the seat next to Asia. I figured I was just happy to be there so I went to grab another seat and Asia said, Oh no you are sitting next to me !

Nothing happened but still that was such a cool moment in my life

Hey Stop go

Could been anyone probably Renee or Toni. Got lucky myself several times but a very low percentage. Most of the models had boyfriends and I was never one who butted in unless I got a good vibe from the model. They were there to shoot and I just wanted to make things as pleasant for the models as could be

Stop go please e mail or private mess age have not talked to you in a longgggg time

Lenny

Wow...I mean that was sort of a dick thing to say as he was already nervous about how his posts were being received.

I guess it's possible they said no!

If it's just the models wanting to "get revenge" on me? Sure. That's fun for everyone, and it doesn't cross any lines. I know people THINK something happened with me & Heather during that one shoot, but sorry guys... She had a BF and that's just her normal personality. Definitely an instigator and more than a little crazy!

Having sex with the person you hired to do a job is DEEPLY unprofessional, which doesn't mean it doesn't happen. I guess if it's mutual (meaning SHE instigated the flirting, not the producer in the position of power), there might not be any lasting harm to one's career.... But I've heard enough stories from models to know that plenty of producers/photographers think something is "mutual" when it's anything but from the woman's perspective. (And believe me, models spread the word FAST.)

One of my former models told me stories about a well-known producer's (unsuccessful) attempts to hook up with her, multiple times, over the course of one shoot.... and it's enough to make your toes curl. Needless to say, she never worked with him again (and even blocked the footage from release) and warned her friends as well.

So, even if you don't give a shit about professionalism, think about what will happen when/if everything goes sideways.... and ask if it's really worth the risk?

Its happened a couple of times. The model has to bring it up though. Its okay to be unprofessional, but its not okay to be a creep.

Rob Blaine once told me that he hired models for "private" WAM work between themselves. Not sure if that included extras.

Agree with Rich. Hitting on a model is creepy and risky and unprofessional.

I suppose if she clearly hits on you, your in the clear, but its doubtful that will happen unless shes super crazy pants.

Leila Hazlett? You lucky bastard!

Were Rob and Daizy boning? I kinda got that vibe from some ancient forum posts and asides in the videos.

See now that's a good tip. If I ever win the lottery and start shooting wam, I'm going to put that in the ad. "Wanted: Models. Super crazy pants ONLY."

There's a difference between evolving a relationship outside of work and sleazily hitting on models. Like any job or business.

Other than that... no comment.

Curious sidebar.Do any of our models enjoy wam away from work for their own pleasure ?

The eternal question! I often wonder this, although suppose the world is firmly divided into wammers and models. We know all about the genuine wammers, such as Jayce, Ariel, Leila and so on, because they're on here and say so. Other than that we have to assume the models are just that and don't get anything out of it.

However, one of the fascinations of MG Amy for me is that I've always wondered if she might really be into it, given how enthusiastic she is in her scenes...

In my situation, most of my models are friends of mine to begin with. Oddly enough, the majority of them find themselves turned on during the shoot. Whether it's the getting messy itself, or the idea that they are doing something that turns us on. But yes...I've "hooked up" with the majority of my models. Quite a few on film. I've tossed around the idea of adding it as "bonus footage" to the end of their scenes. They've all given me permission to do so. Just wasn't sure if I should since the content usually isn't wam related at that point.

I get it on with Leon, but I'm pretty sure that's not what you mean

As for other girls..

Of the 100's that have worked for us, I only know of one who took it home and tried it with her man. Secret life of a call girl had just done their splosh scene too, so I think she thought let's see what this is all about

My hen do ended in a paint party and one of the girls who'd worked for us for years really got into it. Saying the mixture of music, drinking and the paint she really enjoyed. Never realised how erotic wam could be.

They all have a laugh, some obviously just do it for the money, some for the social aspects too. I don't believe any of them do it because they are secretly getting off on it though..

Yes

That's the beauty of religion and, in particular, the Bible. You can interpret in any way you want to justify or condemn just about anything.

Interesting you say that. Does that include Holly too? I'm sure I remember a post a couple of years ago where you mentioned she'd said she often orgasms during a shoot, so I interpreted that as her getting something out if it...

The model that he went to Woodstock with - there was some allusion that they might have had relations.That was the later one, the second of the new ones, I think in 99'? Just a side note, if you can recall the news at the time about the debacle of that festival - they both committed their memories to paper on the plane ride back to preserve the facts about the event. I wish that Rob and the model would have released that.

I would never have guessed that.

typically the male models i have in my scenes have wanted to get it on after wetlook or messy scenes....the messy scenes they want to clean off first and they have never told me WHY they want to get it on with me, i guess seeing me in action in front of a camera while they lay there helpless getting their faces rode or gettting a messy lapdance...but they say they arent into the mess. the wetlook scenes.....basically....once i start griding on them they are like BLAMMO. fully clothed and so all the scenes have been like "well you wanna keep going" and YES THEY DO... even more happens after that!

so i wouldnt say i "TAKE ADVANTAGE" of these male models.....ideas start flying and i feel the vibe, ask them if that is what they want since they are clearly bulging up against me and there we go! it also helps that i know them. lol and have known the two males i have worked with sexually on my site for long periods of time. one helped create my spawn so we know eachother pretty well. if some dude just showed up though??? for a wetlook scene or something and got a boner....okay......you start looking my way and you are there getting paid for a shoot and i have told you what is going to go down and nothing more....I WOULD get offended as a producer. (if they started to make comments to me that were uncomfortable about their "bulge" or if they were very forthcoming to me....bc i dont KNOW THEM.) its different when you work with ppl you have known a long time and have been sexually active with them before...
anyone new to come in and work and i WOULD be highly offended as i would feel like people are not taking me, as a producer...very serious at all and being behind a camera and doing lighting and all of that, as a woman...being taken serious is part of the game. Otherwise you are gonna have men hitting you up all the time to come over and shoot wetlook or messy for you so they can "show you their stuff" and thats a thing. hey, get aroused. thats fine. we are shooting fetish porn but PLEASE keep it to yourself. so, my answer. HIRED MODELS I DONT KNOW...BIG NO NO....SOMEONE I HAVE KNOWN A LONG TIME AND HAD RELATIONS WITH BEFORE? HEY, LET IT FLOW!

So you're saying we should bone BEFORE you hire me to be in a video? Well ... if you insist.

First off, to lay some myths: Yes, there genuinely are women out there who are into WAM as a fetish and get just as turned on by pouring beans and custard down their own jeans as us guys do. I've known several. Some who did it solo for their own pleasure, others who like to play messy with partners. Some of them have appeared in Saturation Hall shoots. I've also known women who are into very kinky sex but not WAM who have helped me out behind the scenes, running cameras, etc, on shoots. Including one who happily went waist deep, fully dressed, in our river to shoot video.

So don't believe anyone who says models are only ever into it for non-sexual laughs or just to get paid. Many are, and in my experience it's mainly the fun aspect rather than the money that appeals - I've even had people tell me they felt should be paying me for the opportunity to go completely crazy in the mud - but there are also women who genuinely do share our fetish. They are rare but do exist. Plus as is often commented in relationship threads, often if people care about each other they'll be more than willing to indulge each other's desires, especially if it's a mutual thing and the other person/people is/are willing to indulge back.

Personally I'm asexual so I've never got it on with anyone in the conventional sense, but I have had a couple of personal sessions with some of the girls who model for me over the years. In each case the sessions were carefully planned in advance, with full consent including acknowledgement of the power imbalance inherent in the situation, as well as the arousal element. I'd never want to exploit anyone so negotiating a session like that has to be done exactly right. But it is possible.

Very interesting insights from Jayce on the same thing from a female producer / male model point of view upthread.

Like Dm, I really loved hearing Jayce's point of view!

This is what's great about the umd. Honest opinions and conversations that make you stop and think.

Big love xx

Jayce, can I suggest running a contest based on this post? Like, a free video for the first person who successfully guesses how many guys PMed you offering to be in one of your videos, immediately after reading the first paragraph of your post above (and not reading the first)?

I'm guessing at least 215.

i sincerely could not even begin to count how many emails i am responding to....that i think are customs when the conversation completely switches to "well i will come and model for you" urm.....and i LOVE IT when they EVEN GO AS FAR as to ask me how much i will pay them for it when i have not even responded to it. lol. if i cant even hardly afford to produce my own content...what in gods green earth makes you think im gonna have a stranger come over, and me do a messy video with them (that is typically very sexual in nature) the first time i meet them? i thought we were talking about a custom you wanted! lol. but alas, i dont get mad...i just say, "hey, yeah, if you want to do a session, i am totally down for that, you pay your own way, you pay us, you want us to film it and keep it to sell? okie dokie, ill give you a small discount but um....yeah we dont do the sex or rub on your pee pee and you dont do that to us either....soooooo all that talk about me masturbating is out the window"

and the thing is, i live in a college town. i have been in contact with TONS of HOT college dudes about wetlook videos. it is concerning though...for a few reasons....the main ones being that A. even if they sign a non disclosure agreement, that doesnt matter for shit when these college frat boys get drunk B. i am a woman who is filming, producing, editing and doing all my own content. I have seen men that are "not into" wam or wetlook get very much aroused doing it with me...so, if i were to do a video WITH said model....okay, arousal may happen but boundaries are very important and here is the other thing...im typically alone shooting this stuff. that makes for me to feel very uncomfortable. I hate to feel that way. i want to feel like an empowered woman who runs this shit and you are getting paid and then off you go....
but alas, it is a concern. One that I feel like is going to be a touch and go situation. C. for me to bring in someone while i film this stuff, so that i can feel safe, i can be professional and not have any accusations brought against ME means MORE PEOPLE who are invited into my lifestyle. it just piles up. more agreements signed that could be broken....and yes, i have had one of my male models break the non disclosure agreement here recently and i just dropped a fucking retainer fee for this shit. its no joke.
and us ladies, i am including ariel on this, do this on our own. we have had a few boyfriends in the past to help us film but typically we arent happy with their work. I have about 2 camera guys i have hired where i am very happy with their camera work. I am insanely picky. i hate tripods but i have to use them sometimes and i am so picky about the way they look.
Being women running our own stuff, it is concerning, even though i have this BEAUTIFUL PICK of endless college guys who are just DYING to wear their suits and jeans and stuff in a shower for pay....but, I have to find a way to be cool enough where they feel comfortable but not too cool where they think im giving them a "vibe" bc as beautiful as they are, i am a professional, man. when it comes to someone i dont know. working with someone i have had relations with in the past, and i know very well and i am sexually comfortable with? its a different story. I feel like if i bring these men in, unless i work with one that comes in a lot, shows that they CAN be professional, we get to know eachother and i feel comfortable enough, i could possibly do a fully clothed, non sexual, just erotic hairwashing maybe a little erotic touching of stuff above the waist, you know? but i would have to really gain trust and have someone there to witness on my behalf that i did not cross any boundaries and neither did they.
otherwise, i feel like if i take this route, all men are doing solo videos and i am behind the camera to start. That still leaves me with "should i have another person here while i film or just pepper spray and keep the camera rolling the entire time they are here for my own personal protection?" like i said, touch and go. i would def. fire someone, on the spot if any gross comments were made towards me before, during or after filming.
This is why i have not started this venture YET because there is SO MUCH to consider. The main thing...as a woman, am i going to be taken SERIOUSLY by these guys to where they will respect me, my wishes and do the job they are asked to do? What do I NEED TO DO to make sure they are comfortable with ME and that I am not putting off any sort of vibe whatsoever to make them uncomfortable without looking like a frigid bitch? its a tough gig but one that i would really like to get off the ground!
you getting paid doesnt mean you are getting laid.

and regis, GOD, you always know the way to a womans heart. lol XD

and yall, please let me reiterate what i said above. i can barely pay for my own productions and sales do not pay the bills so, if you are wanting to be a model in a video for us, that would be 'you getting a session and we would give you a small discount to let us film it and sell it'

i also dont think that guys think this through that they have to sign a paper that gives us full rights to the video adn even if they paid us to take it down...i cant help if it gets all over the internet. im not gonna share it everywhere but other people might bc other people are dicks. so, welcome to my life if you wanna go that route!

wow that was entirely too long...i just saw my lawyer this morning so im kinda just like whoaaaaa. i think i just typed a lot in some kind of businessy haze bc i have been talking business with her all morning. bluhhhhhhh.....