So I've been going back and forth on writing this thread for awhile. I posted about this once before, but lately it's started to really get to me. Since my last post, I've made my way around. I've had some rough experiences, but I find it difficult to meet women who are into WAM. I've been really working on myself, I've lost 20 pounds and I'm getting in really good shape. I thought that might open my opportunities for meeting people a bit, but it hasn't.

The one woman I met that was genuinely into WAM was a domme (which is perfect for me), but things sorta fizzled out because I'm still kinda broken. Especially when it comes to being dommed. I won't go through the whole story, but basically I went to a dungeon party and didn't know what aftercare was. I let this lady beat the hell out of me with whips and floggers just because it had been so long since I had any human contact. Then she ditched me. I felt fine for a few hours, but then I spiraled. I found myself drinking heavier than I ever had and not being able to sleep properly...

Enough about that. My question to the people of UMD is how do you cope with not being able to find anyone? I mean even the times I've had someone kinda hanging around that could have been a potential relationship partner, when it comes time to divulge my interest she's either totally not into it, or willing to try it but it's not her thing and it maybe happens once. It's not fair of me to expect someone I want to have a relationship with to indulge me if she doesn't want to.

Sorry if this is in the wrong thread, but I just had to get it out there. I'm sure lots of you understand. I just don't have anyone in my life I can really talk to so I'm here..

Thanks for listening.

My advice and I think a lot of people on here will agree, you can't focus on the wam, You have to start at the relationship, and slowly work the wam into it. Get to know each other trust each other then explore each other.

Hey don't beat yourself up - you've been through a learning process and we all tend to do that via a few mistakes along the way - plus it was her mistake too to dish out physical stuff without aftercare.

As always I'd recommend actively dating within the fetish scene just because that makes it a little easier to be sure of finding an open minded partner. Go to local munches and meet ups, and don't try to hurry it. keep learning about and looking after yourself. Maybe date within the vanilla scene too if someone seems the caring and open minded sort.

Don't stress. I met someone once who was sort of semi into WAM - see my last post in the first WAM experience thread, but no one since.

After that I went down the escort agency route and made certain that the agency I used was a well established one from the upper end of that market. I saw a girl from there who was fun and enthusiastically enacted many WAM sessions with me.

Shes now left the agency so I am now WAM less. I cope by distractions, occupying time, as Samuel Beckett put it in Waiting for Godot!

dis-attach yourself entirely with any domme stuff. It must be roleplay, become someone else in your head or it can cause conflict with reality and fantasy.

When you meet someone you like, be open about your wam fetish. Don't be afraid of it or ashamed of it, you are what you are, and if someone likes you they'll accept that part as well, everyone has something about them!

When telling a partner about it, be honest and lighthearted about it. Try not to be shy or embarrassed because if you are, it subconsciously implies it is wrong or strange. It doesn't have to be and it shouldn't be.

Be open and show them it isn't and is just fine. Make it more about fun to begin with rather than sexual, but don't hold back that it is also a fetish.

Most importantly, don't be put off when it doesn't work the first, second or even third time. Remember people have to sometimes go through several partners before they meet the right life partner. I was lucky in this respect but don't take it too seriously and have fun finding the right person, make it an enjoyable process.

and finally, remember, the whole wam thing is only embarrassing to you because you have it, other people will see girls getting messy as just comedy and fun. Be glad you're not into something really dark lol.

When I was first talked into it, I was definitely up for giving it a go, that was 10 years ago when I was 19, now I work for a messy production website getting gunged every month or so and enjoy it lol.

I used to cringe and be terrified watching get your own back on tv btw! Never thought I'd do this!

Maybe I am not the right one to give advice because, from a WAM perspective, I am more of a voyeur than an active participant. However, I have been married to the same woman for 25 years and we have been together about 30.

You might get the wrong impression from this website that there are a lot of wammers out there. There are not. Not only that, those that are out there are split among various subsets (pie, wet, mud, etc.). Even worse, studies show that women are less kinky overall than men. There are less -- a lot less -- women into WAM than men. Of course, some women are geniunely into WAM (Messygirl comes immediately to mind) but they are few and far between.

So, I would suggest working on a new relationship one step at a time. Take it slow. Get to know a woman first, find out her interests -- tell her yours. If it were me, I would keep the WAM stuff underwraps until you have a good relationship established. You have been dating a while and legitmately care for each other. In short, find a nice girl who you love first and then worry about the WAM part later. If she loves you too she will probably indulge your fetish -- not every time, but enough to satisfy you. If you go searching for a woman who is into WAM, you will likely have to leave Tulsa and likely have to settle for someone who doesn't match with you in any way other than you both like to WAM. That would be fun for a little while, but I don't know if it is enough to sustain a long-term relationship.

My .02 cents

Thanks for all the replies everyone. I should add a few things though. I don't want "one night stands" or anything like that because I'm not like that. Secondly, the reason I don't go to munches or anything like that anymore is because that experience at the dungeon wrecked my psyche.

I started two studios on here, and I'm Facebook friends with a few prominent figures in the community, but under my real name. Frank is an alias. The first studio straight up flopped because I had no idea what I was doing. The second one went really well, but made me more depressed because I was still lonely and while I had fun with the two ladies I worked with, I wasn't dating either one (probably a good idea though). That studio stopped because they both got in committed relationships with partners who didn't want them doing videos anymore.

You know what I really want? I know it might sound pathetic, but at the moment I just wanna be held. I still want the aftercare I never had because I've been stuck in this weird purgatory since what happened. On a personal level, my grandmother (who took care of me most of my life) is dying. All I can do is watch. I'm not really close to anyone anymore, and as I sit at work I'm just thinking of it all as I feel the stabbing pains coming from the area around my liver from the night before.

I had people reach out, tell me they'd let me talk to them, but they all disappear eventually. It's beyond WAM for me. Yes I want to have a messy session with someone, and I wish I could leave my office and work like some of the more prominent figures I know and travel to England and couch surf while I work and do scenes, but I can't.

The worst part is, it's a self-defeating cycle. Nobody (especially most dommes I've met) want a broken sub or partner. Despite me working on improving myself physically and "getting ripped", I'm still sore mentally and emotionally. I'm tired. I've been in places and had dark thoughts. I won't spam my life story here, but it's come down to me sitting literally between two exits. As I sat in my chair writing this I thought about the door in front of me and where it would go if I followed it. I could go for a drive (though that wouldn't have been a real bright idea with the amount I'd had to drink). I could go work on my bus (I'm turning an old school bus into an "off the grid" tiny home). Or..... I had one more exit. A .40 cal exit sitting on top of the refrigerator. I'd thought about it before, but I have a sticky note that says "not today" and has a picture of my sister and my nieces.

I'm sorry if I'm rambling, but as I said I don't have anyone else to talk to really. For those who might be concerned, no I'm not suicidal. I'm just in that state of mind where I'm not really afraid to die either if that makes any sense? Again, this isn't all because I can't find anyone. This issue is just a huge thorn in my side.

Thanks for listening.

Keep strong, don't go there with those thoughts either - a permanent solution to a temporary problem. Work on your bus - I like old buses too, another of my non WAM interests. I lose myself in books and music when I am fed up. There is a great world out there, don't get down.

Remember, there is something far, far worse than being on you own and that is being trapped in a dead marriage or relationship with someone you don't like and don't get on with. I speak from experience here and its just awful.

Hey Man...you have unloaded here a great deal and you have clearly described the problem and your mental condition....

...not finding someone into wam is NORMAL for this fetish....and most people (with a few random exceptions) never find someone who is equally into their own fetish...the best bet is to cultivate a close, intimate relationship with someone you like (first, no fetishism involved) and then slowly, gently, introduce the fetishism...

however, it is apparent that you are emotionally frail (not ready for a relationship)...I'm guessing you are pretty young...I wish that all these desperate young guys (who post here looking for a solution to their problem) could just learn to chill out and relax...there's no rush (that's just your hormones talking)...it's not the end of the world, really.

BUT, you have gone on to mention a gun, etc.....this is a mostly public forum, so, one can only interpret that as a plea for help (to whomever)...but the help you need is beyond anyone here -- you need professional help learning to cope with your emotional states and fears of abandonment (brought on by your grandma's failing health)...a professional therapist with experience in treating people who were raised in "alternative" family situations, like yourself...shop around, ask questions, keep looking until you've found the right therapist or psychiatrist....mental health treatment is also covered by most insurance plans...

Don't wait on this or waste anymore time here. You owe it to yourself to do this. Good luck and know that there is a light at the end of this tunnel.

That's a mistake, IMO. It's one I made when I was younger. A "one night stand" or similar can sometimes turn into something more. Plus, for reasons I've never fully understood, women seem to be more attracted to guys who bed a lot of other women.

Dating is to a large extent a numbers game and you need as many people through the door as possible, from the WAM pool, fetish pool, vanilla pool, work pool....whatever.

I usually like to avoid these threads because theres smarter people than I that can offer better advice. I'm probably more direct in my opinions and I'd be more blunt.. But I'm willing to give it a shot if I think it will help.

I'll flat out put it out on the table, first thing is stop thinking about yourself. Yeah, you're lonely but so is a good part of the world. The flip side is, theres plenty of unhappy couples out there too. You don't want to end up in either category. And you can't force this thing called a relationship. You have to work at it, and give of yourself for it, for it to be successful and you live a happy life with your significant other. That means you have to be willing to coexist with another human being which contains the same type of feelings and frailties that we all come with.

Do you have the social skills needed to meet and date woman? You don't need to answer that. Let me ask a more important question. Do you have the right frame of mind? Look, most people have the social skills to make friends. We meet a total stranger, and make conversation, discover similar interests, and go from there. Every time we spend time with that new friend, we reenforce the friendship and over time, they become good friends. Some friendships become so strong that they become like family. It's the same thing when you're looking for a mate. You can't go in with the wrong frame of mind, or you'll just end up crashing and burning, and pass from one failed relationship to the next.

Imagine if you tried making a friend and immediately expected things from that friendship. You probably won't have a friend for very long. That also applies when you're seeking a relationship. The rules are basically the same. You start by getting to know the person of interest and let nature take it's course, and remember, you're dealing with a person, another human being who has desires and needs too. But above all else, respect that person at all costs, like you would with any of your best friends and members of your own family.

As for WAM, don't let it rule you. It is a nice little fetish that you can enjoy, but don't allow it to dictate to you your relationship needs or become the main focus of your relationship. Because if you do, that love of your life will quickly realize that the fetish is more important to you than she is, and she will be turned off quickly from it and probably leave you. And she will find some guy who will place her on a pedestal. So start with the right frame of mind. Plan to put whomever you find on the pedestal. Make her the number one thing in your life. As for the WAM interest, if the relationship gets that far and the trust is as solid as a rock, eventually sexual conversations will come up, and you'll get to tell her what your interests are and let her decide on her own if she wants to partake in it. And should she, it will be because she loves you and wants to please you.

Oh, and go find a nice range to shoot that .40 at. I often find that shooting is very relaxing and relieves that primal urge for loud noises.

Good luck
EdR

this may be in how i was raised, right here in the bible belt, but, when i deal with a man...and i find a kink that he has....i mean, if i think its "weird" of course, ill go to my bestie and be like "oh my god, this is so strange" BUUUUUUUT, here is the deal....if i care enough about someone and we have established a meaningful and healthy relationship, i am willing to try just about damn near anything with them...i mean, i had NEVER used wam in my sex life until just a few years ago and we did it as a CUSTOM and then started doing it regularly....when i say regularly, lol, since we have a child, regular sex means like every couple of weeks. lol XD

but i do know this on MY END being a woman. im not gonna do anything that makes me feel insanely degraded. if they want something that makes me feel like that, i am open minded enough to ask, "is that really how you see me or is this just what gets you off? this fantasy? can you keep your fantasy and your reality in check?" i lost a meaningful relationship bc for a long time they could not separate fantasy from reality for a while. you gotta have a healthy balance and learn to be able to "get there" with or without the wam with someone you are introducing to it bc if she wants to just have some vanilla sex and you are not as "aroused" during that time, it will make her feel like the fetish is taking over your relationship. i have been there and it doesnt feel good. i think its great you brought it up and i am SO SORRY you had to go through that traumatic experience. we dont use any substances of any kind during wamming. ive done a few whip its with cool whip cans. LOL!! but, we dont drink or use drugs. maybe that would help too?

It seems like the bigger problem is how you view yourself and the lack of help you have received after the trauma you experienced. You are not broken. Having experienced trauma does not mean you cannot have a healthy and fulfilling relationship in the future. I'd suggest focusing more on improving your self esteem and finding a way to work through the trauma you experienced. There are people out there who are willing to be patient and supportive and can look past the things you perceive as negative.