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"UK General Election called for 4th July"
Gooeyandsticky said: Great, so you vote for one of the outsiders / unknowns and then watch as they crash 'n' burn because they have absolutely no idea what they are doing 
Politics cannot be run by rich twats with no real links to society - and that includes Labour. It needs at minimum a reasonable collection of normal, working class folk who actually have a grasp of what living in this country is all about.
Labour will probably get in, and within weeks the first scandal will hit. It's the same every time.
Just got my council tax bill through.... 51% spent on 'Vunerable adults'
Of which a whole pile of that percentage will be workshy, benefit claiming, lazy, system dwellers
'Wah... I have to use food banks they whine, while texting on their iphone 15' 
Politics cannot be run by rich twats with no real links to society - and that includes Labour. It needs at minimum a reasonable collection of normal, working class folk who actually have a grasp of what living in this country is all about.
Labour will probably get in, and within weeks the first scandal will hit. It's the same every time.
Just got my council tax bill through.... 51% spent on 'Vunerable adults'
Of which a whole pile of that percentage will be workshy, benefit claiming, lazy, system dwellers
'Wah... I have to use food banks they whine, while texting on their iphone 15' The "vulnerable adults" bill is social care for the elderly and those with disabilities, not benefits. It costs the council a bloody fortune because they do it through private companies which charge a lot, pay their staff sod all and run like shit. As someone with experience in the sector it's an absolute travesty how much we spend on it given how poor the care is in a lot of cases.
The Tories are out... they have given up and want to drop this disaster like a hot potato, hence I expect the early election.
It's just a shame that nothing will change. It can't change. Labour are as crooked as the next party.
You cannot fix the NHS... it's too far gone and too deeply damaged. Same goes for the trains and the high street.
All this crap about reviving the high street. IT WILL NEVER HAPPEN. Amazon and the internet have ended the high street. Shops will never compete with online sales, especially with the mentally high shop rates.
The high street needs a re-think and if we are short of housing.... then covert the high streets. Better than boarded up shops.
The Woke push has been badly implemented, it's made people who basically didn't really care about other peoples choices offended and bored with the subject.
My town have painted all the park benches rainbow. FFS... What a waste of my council tax. Want to help vulnerable adults? Stop pissing my hard earned tax away on 10 tins of paint.
Where I live has never looked so shit.... weeds everywhere, broken windows, pot-holed roads, 70% dead high street, bin collections missed all the time, local tip only open 2 days a week (and they wonder why fly tipping has increased 100%)..... it goes on.
Oh, and really... how hard is it to stop boats crossing the channel. I stopped my donations to the RNLI (and I am an ex - yacht engineer). Sorry, the RNLI is to save lives at sea, not pick-up channel boats full of refugees.
We are too far down the broken road to recover from this I am afraid.
I need to stop.... this conversation can only end badly.
As I said early.... back to gooey titties
It's just a shame that nothing will change. It can't change. Labour are as crooked as the next party.
You cannot fix the NHS... it's too far gone and too deeply damaged. Same goes for the trains and the high street.
All this crap about reviving the high street. IT WILL NEVER HAPPEN. Amazon and the internet have ended the high street. Shops will never compete with online sales, especially with the mentally high shop rates.
The high street needs a re-think and if we are short of housing.... then covert the high streets. Better than boarded up shops.
The Woke push has been badly implemented, it's made people who basically didn't really care about other peoples choices offended and bored with the subject.
My town have painted all the park benches rainbow. FFS... What a waste of my council tax. Want to help vulnerable adults? Stop pissing my hard earned tax away on 10 tins of paint.
Where I live has never looked so shit.... weeds everywhere, broken windows, pot-holed roads, 70% dead high street, bin collections missed all the time, local tip only open 2 days a week (and they wonder why fly tipping has increased 100%)..... it goes on.
Oh, and really... how hard is it to stop boats crossing the channel. I stopped my donations to the RNLI (and I am an ex - yacht engineer). Sorry, the RNLI is to save lives at sea, not pick-up channel boats full of refugees.
We are too far down the broken road to recover from this I am afraid.
I need to stop.... this conversation can only end badly.
As I said early.... back to gooey titties
cisgender bloke
FFS.... that is what I am on about. Fine, you are a cisgender bloke and that is your choice.
But don't start asking me to identify as cis. I am a straight man... I don't need 3 extra letters attached to my title by the minority to make them feel better
And yes... I filled out a form for a job position only the other day and there was no man/woman option. Only cis male or female. Why take away the option that actually describes me (and not what others think I should be called).
I am fine as I am. If I have to accept you as a rubber lamp-post or whatever (which is fine by me), then accept me as a man. You only need 3 letters
It's as maybe that we are using the word Woke in the wrong context, but that is the fault of the media then pushing it out in the wrong context then.
To everybody I know and discuss this topic with, Woke means anything to do with what people identify as or their sexuality.
That maybe wrong (and probably is), but that Word has got attached to this subject now rightly or wrongly.
Personally, I never ever thought about it or cared about anyone else's sexuality. It wasn't my business and they could lead the life they wanted.
Now.... sick of hearing it. It IS having the opposite effect. It is making people who didn't care before, bored of the subject and therefore ignorant and to a degree, intolerant of it.
I can never win this argument, as everyone has their own opinion. I think I should draw a line here (to which I am sure then people will moan that I have drawn a line :miserable
FFS.... that is what I am on about. Fine, you are a cisgender bloke and that is your choice.
But don't start asking me to identify as cis. I am a straight man... I don't need 3 extra letters attached to my title by the minority to make them feel better
And yes... I filled out a form for a job position only the other day and there was no man/woman option. Only cis male or female. Why take away the option that actually describes me (and not what others think I should be called).
I am fine as I am. If I have to accept you as a rubber lamp-post or whatever (which is fine by me), then accept me as a man. You only need 3 letters
It's as maybe that we are using the word Woke in the wrong context, but that is the fault of the media then pushing it out in the wrong context then.
To everybody I know and discuss this topic with, Woke means anything to do with what people identify as or their sexuality.
That maybe wrong (and probably is), but that Word has got attached to this subject now rightly or wrongly.
Personally, I never ever thought about it or cared about anyone else's sexuality. It wasn't my business and they could lead the life they wanted.
Now.... sick of hearing it. It IS having the opposite effect. It is making people who didn't care before, bored of the subject and therefore ignorant and to a degree, intolerant of it.
I can never win this argument, as everyone has their own opinion. I think I should draw a line here (to which I am sure then people will moan that I have drawn a line :miserable
Gooeyandsticky said: cisgender bloke
FFS.... that is what I am on about. Fine, you are a cisgender bloke and that is your choice.
But don't start asking me to identify as cis. I am a straight man... I don't need 3 extra letters attached to my title by the minority to make them feel better
And yes... I filled out a form for a job position only the other day and there was no man/woman option. Only cis male or female. Why take away the option that actually describes me (and not what others think I should be called).
I am fine as I am. If I have to accept you as a rubber lamp-post or whatever (which is fine by me), then accept me as a man. You only need 3 letters
It's as maybe that we are using the word Woke in the wrong context, but that is the fault of the media then pushing it out in the wrong context then.
To everybody I know and discuss this topic with, Woke means anything to do with what people identify as or their sexuality.
That maybe wrong (and probably is), but that Word has got attached to this subject now rightly or wrongly.
Personally, I never ever thought about it or cared about anyone else's sexuality. It wasn't my business and they could lead the life they wanted.
Now.... sick of hearing it. It IS having the opposite effect. It is making people who didn't care before, bored of the subject and therefore ignorant and to a degree, intolerant of it.
I can never win this argument, as everyone has their own opinion. I think I should draw a line here (to which I am sure then people will moan that I have drawn a line :miserable
FFS.... that is what I am on about. Fine, you are a cisgender bloke and that is your choice.
But don't start asking me to identify as cis. I am a straight man... I don't need 3 extra letters attached to my title by the minority to make them feel better
And yes... I filled out a form for a job position only the other day and there was no man/woman option. Only cis male or female. Why take away the option that actually describes me (and not what others think I should be called).
I am fine as I am. If I have to accept you as a rubber lamp-post or whatever (which is fine by me), then accept me as a man. You only need 3 letters
It's as maybe that we are using the word Woke in the wrong context, but that is the fault of the media then pushing it out in the wrong context then.
To everybody I know and discuss this topic with, Woke means anything to do with what people identify as or their sexuality.
That maybe wrong (and probably is), but that Word has got attached to this subject now rightly or wrongly.
Personally, I never ever thought about it or cared about anyone else's sexuality. It wasn't my business and they could lead the life they wanted.
Now.... sick of hearing it. It IS having the opposite effect. It is making people who didn't care before, bored of the subject and therefore ignorant and to a degree, intolerant of it.
I can never win this argument, as everyone has their own opinion. I think I should draw a line here (to which I am sure then people will moan that I have drawn a line :miserable
you don't need to self identify as cis but presumably you are cis. i've never understood why people get so weird about the term, it'd be like losing your mind at being called straight or heterosexual.
Gooeyandsticky said: It's as maybe that we are using the word Woke in the wrong context, but that is the fault of the media then pushing it out in the wrong context then.
I respectfully disagree. It is not the fault of the media pushing the wrong definition. It is the fault of people that continue to use the word incorrectly. Just like how ignorant does not mean rude.
Well, out of interest I asked 3 people in my office this morning what they thought Woke meant.
All of them answered in one way or another 'It's about sexuality and sexual preferences and what you identify as'.
So, I think the message has got lost then.
Ian our stock room controller.... he said 'Woke means indulging the minority'.
All a bit of a mess
All of them answered in one way or another 'It's about sexuality and sexual preferences and what you identify as'.
So, I think the message has got lost then.
Ian our stock room controller.... he said 'Woke means indulging the minority'.
All a bit of a mess
I really don't know who I'm going to vote for in this election. it won't be the Tories and it certainly won't be labour.
Keir starmer is one of the most dangerous politicians out there, he's a pathological liar, with zero credibility that will turn on anyone to remain in power and feed his megalomania ego... what he has done to the labour youth and to the labour left has quite frankly been a national persecution and genocide, that he should severely be prosecuted and punished for.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-XkPwXIJBMc
Keir starmer is one of the most dangerous politicians out there, he's a pathological liar, with zero credibility that will turn on anyone to remain in power and feed his megalomania ego... what he has done to the labour youth and to the labour left has quite frankly been a national persecution and genocide, that he should severely be prosecuted and punished for.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-XkPwXIJBMc
Philippa Forrester Found
At the end of the day..... who cares? Nothing anyone says or does changes anything.
My opinion is exactly that... my opinion, and it's entirely my right to hold it. As is everyone else's right to hold their opinion.
This thread can never be resolved, so I am drawing my line here. Otherwise it will just get shitty
Gooeyandsticky said:
At the end of the day..... who cares? Nothing anyone says or does changes anything.
My opinion is exactly that... my opinion, and it's entirely my right to hold it. As is everyone else's right to hold their opinion.
This thread can never be resolved, so I am drawing my line here. Otherwise it will just get shitty
At the end of the day..... who cares? Nothing anyone says or does changes anything.
My opinion is exactly that... my opinion, and it's entirely my right to hold it. As is everyone else's right to hold their opinion.
This thread can never be resolved, so I am drawing my line here. Otherwise it will just get shitty
I thought you drew your line a few days ago.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Saturation Hall, Langstonedale
Lord of the Pies
Getting back to actual political issues: Labour has rather shot itself in the foot with the Diane Abbott row, that could have easily been avoided. Hopefully early enough in the campaign that it'll be history come polling day, but an embarassing ballsup none the less.
At least the tax issues re the shadow chancellor's house are now dead and burried, police no longer investigating.
At least the tax issues re the shadow chancellor's house are now dead and burried, police no longer investigating.
Saturation Hall - Forth! The Gungemaidens!
We desperately need a change of government. I'm struggling with Labour though. Starmer has purged the party of lefties and anyone critical of Israel (that aged well) while rolling out the welcome mat for defecting Tories who don't have a socialist bone in their body. His stance on Brexit doesn't make any sense either, as he was one of the biggest pushers for a second referendum (which was basically why Labour tanked in the last election) but now doesn't want to touch it with a barge pole. Fair enough, he has to win back some of the voters Labour lost and attract a few disillusioned Tories, but he seems to have no principals, so what's the point in him?
As for the whole "woke" thing that's been dragged up, to me it just seems like a rebrand of "political correctness" and whatever you think about it, it's nothing new and it's the same debate we've been having for decades, but amplified and toxified in the social media era. It probably does go too far sometimes but I'd rather show tolerance and try and learn about other people's struggles than just oppose it and throw a tantrum about not being able to call myself a "man" or some crap like that.
As for the whole "woke" thing that's been dragged up, to me it just seems like a rebrand of "political correctness" and whatever you think about it, it's nothing new and it's the same debate we've been having for decades, but amplified and toxified in the social media era. It probably does go too far sometimes but I'd rather show tolerance and try and learn about other people's struggles than just oppose it and throw a tantrum about not being able to call myself a "man" or some crap like that.
Saturation Hall, Langstonedale
Lord of the Pies
Pie Punk said: We desperately need a change of government. I'm struggling with Labour though. Starmer has purged the party of lefties and anyone critical of Israel (that aged well) while rolling out the welcome mat for defecting Tories who don't have a socialist bone in their body. His stance on Brexit doesn't make any sense either, as he was one of the biggest pushers for a second referendum (which was basically why Labour tanked in the last election) but now doesn't want to touch it with a barge pole. Fair enough, he has to win back some of the voters Labour lost and attract a few disillusioned Tories, but he seems to have no principals, so what's the point in him?
I think Starmer is bascially recognising that the electorare at large is now a long way right of where it used to be. So an old-school socialist platform is just going to tank, again. While Brexit certainly was a factor, fact is both times Labour ran with a full-left leader, they bombed completeley. Michael Foot in 1983 - at the time their biggest defeat in history - and then Jeremy Corbyn in 2019, with their worst loss ever, even worse than 83. Starmer is basically swinging back towards Blair-style policies. Which are still a vast improvement on anything the Tories are now spouiting, with all the hate-stirring against queer folk and outright racist demonisation of assylum seekers. The BBC had a headline that summed it up perfectly yesterday, the Tories wittering on about making life harder for trans people while Starmer was talking perfectly sensibly about defence and the military. Which given we're probably going to be at war with Russia within the next ten years, is rather more important than culture war bullshit.
Pie Punk said: As for the whole "woke" thing that's been dragged up, to me it just seems like a rebrand of "political correctness" and whatever you think about it, it's nothing new and it's the same debate we've been having for decades, but amplified and toxified in the social media era. It probably does go too far sometimes but I'd rather show tolerance and try and learn about other people's struggles than just oppose it and throw a tantrum about not being able to call myself a "man" or some crap like that.
Indeed. It's all a manufactured hate campaign against marginalised people, intended to get the kind of people who think the 1950s was some golden age of perfection, on-side. And yeah, "woke" has replaced "PC" as the demonisation word of choice. But that is totally inappropriate to use it that way here, as MM had stated.
Saturation Hall - Forth! The Gungemaidens!
DungeonMasterOne said:
I think Starmer is bascially recognising that the electorare at large is now a long way right of where it used to be. So an old-school socialist platform is just going to tank, again. While Brexit certainly was a factor, fact is both times Labour ran with a full-left leader, they bombed completeley. Michael Foot in 1983 - at the time their biggest defeat in history - and then Jeremy Corbyn in 2019, with their worst loss ever, even worse than 83. Starmer is basically swinging back towards Blair-style policies. Which are still a vast improvement on anything the Tories are now spouiting, with all the hate-stirring against queer folk and outright racist demonisation of assylum seekers. The BBC had a headline that summed it up perfectly yesterday, the Tories wittering on about making life harder for trans people while Starmer was talking perfectly sensibly about defence and the military. Which given we're probably going to be at war with Russia within the next ten years, is rather more important than culture war bullshit.
Indeed. It's all a manufactured hate campaign against marginalised people, intended to get the kind of people who think the 1950s was some golden age of perfection, on-side. And yeah, "woke" has replaced "PC" as the demonisation word of choice. But that is totally inappropriate to use it that way here, as MM had stated.
Pie Punk said: We desperately need a change of government. I'm struggling with Labour though. Starmer has purged the party of lefties and anyone critical of Israel (that aged well) while rolling out the welcome mat for defecting Tories who don't have a socialist bone in their body. His stance on Brexit doesn't make any sense either, as he was one of the biggest pushers for a second referendum (which was basically why Labour tanked in the last election) but now doesn't want to touch it with a barge pole. Fair enough, he has to win back some of the voters Labour lost and attract a few disillusioned Tories, but he seems to have no principals, so what's the point in him?
I think Starmer is bascially recognising that the electorare at large is now a long way right of where it used to be. So an old-school socialist platform is just going to tank, again. While Brexit certainly was a factor, fact is both times Labour ran with a full-left leader, they bombed completeley. Michael Foot in 1983 - at the time their biggest defeat in history - and then Jeremy Corbyn in 2019, with their worst loss ever, even worse than 83. Starmer is basically swinging back towards Blair-style policies. Which are still a vast improvement on anything the Tories are now spouiting, with all the hate-stirring against queer folk and outright racist demonisation of assylum seekers. The BBC had a headline that summed it up perfectly yesterday, the Tories wittering on about making life harder for trans people while Starmer was talking perfectly sensibly about defence and the military. Which given we're probably going to be at war with Russia within the next ten years, is rather more important than culture war bullshit.
Pie Punk said: As for the whole "woke" thing that's been dragged up, to me it just seems like a rebrand of "political correctness" and whatever you think about it, it's nothing new and it's the same debate we've been having for decades, but amplified and toxified in the social media era. It probably does go too far sometimes but I'd rather show tolerance and try and learn about other people's struggles than just oppose it and throw a tantrum about not being able to call myself a "man" or some crap like that.
Indeed. It's all a manufactured hate campaign against marginalised people, intended to get the kind of people who think the 1950s was some golden age of perfection, on-side. And yeah, "woke" has replaced "PC" as the demonisation word of choice. But that is totally inappropriate to use it that way here, as MM had stated.
Fair points, although I would point out that Labour didn't bomb in 2017 under Corbyn, they performed better than expected. They bombed in 2019 when the main difference was a shift in Brexit policy driven by the likes of Starmer, although the strange cult attraction Boris Johnson seemed to hold among some weird Brits was also a factor.
Pie Punk said:
Fair points, although I would point out that Labour didn't bomb in 2017 under Corbyn, they performed better than expected. They bombed in 2019 when the main difference was a shift in Brexit policy driven by the likes of Starmer, although the strange cult attraction Boris Johnson seemed to hold among some weird Brits was also a factor.
DungeonMasterOne said:
I think Starmer is bascially recognising that the electorare at large is now a long way right of where it used to be. So an old-school socialist platform is just going to tank, again. While Brexit certainly was a factor, fact is both times Labour ran with a full-left leader, they bombed completeley. Michael Foot in 1983 - at the time their biggest defeat in history - and then Jeremy Corbyn in 2019, with their worst loss ever, even worse than 83. Starmer is basically swinging back towards Blair-style policies. Which are still a vast improvement on anything the Tories are now spouiting, with all the hate-stirring against queer folk and outright racist demonisation of assylum seekers. The BBC had a headline that summed it up perfectly yesterday, the Tories wittering on about making life harder for trans people while Starmer was talking perfectly sensibly about defence and the military. Which given we're probably going to be at war with Russia within the next ten years, is rather more important than culture war bullshit.
Indeed. It's all a manufactured hate campaign against marginalised people, intended to get the kind of people who think the 1950s was some golden age of perfection, on-side. And yeah, "woke" has replaced "PC" as the demonisation word of choice. But that is totally inappropriate to use it that way here, as MM had stated.
Pie Punk said: We desperately need a change of government. I'm struggling with Labour though. Starmer has purged the party of lefties and anyone critical of Israel (that aged well) while rolling out the welcome mat for defecting Tories who don't have a socialist bone in their body. His stance on Brexit doesn't make any sense either, as he was one of the biggest pushers for a second referendum (which was basically why Labour tanked in the last election) but now doesn't want to touch it with a barge pole. Fair enough, he has to win back some of the voters Labour lost and attract a few disillusioned Tories, but he seems to have no principals, so what's the point in him?
I think Starmer is bascially recognising that the electorare at large is now a long way right of where it used to be. So an old-school socialist platform is just going to tank, again. While Brexit certainly was a factor, fact is both times Labour ran with a full-left leader, they bombed completeley. Michael Foot in 1983 - at the time their biggest defeat in history - and then Jeremy Corbyn in 2019, with their worst loss ever, even worse than 83. Starmer is basically swinging back towards Blair-style policies. Which are still a vast improvement on anything the Tories are now spouiting, with all the hate-stirring against queer folk and outright racist demonisation of assylum seekers. The BBC had a headline that summed it up perfectly yesterday, the Tories wittering on about making life harder for trans people while Starmer was talking perfectly sensibly about defence and the military. Which given we're probably going to be at war with Russia within the next ten years, is rather more important than culture war bullshit.
Pie Punk said: As for the whole "woke" thing that's been dragged up, to me it just seems like a rebrand of "political correctness" and whatever you think about it, it's nothing new and it's the same debate we've been having for decades, but amplified and toxified in the social media era. It probably does go too far sometimes but I'd rather show tolerance and try and learn about other people's struggles than just oppose it and throw a tantrum about not being able to call myself a "man" or some crap like that.
Indeed. It's all a manufactured hate campaign against marginalised people, intended to get the kind of people who think the 1950s was some golden age of perfection, on-side. And yeah, "woke" has replaced "PC" as the demonisation word of choice. But that is totally inappropriate to use it that way here, as MM had stated.
Fair points, although I would point out that Labour didn't bomb in 2017 under Corbyn, they performed better than expected. They bombed in 2019 when the main difference was a shift in Brexit policy driven by the likes of Starmer, although the strange cult attraction Boris Johnson seemed to hold among some weird Brits was also a factor.
Labour would have bombed far harder in 2017 if Theresa May hadn't been crucified for actually trying to give a solution to the social care crisis (the "dementia tax") rather than hand waving it away like every other politician. I don't like her and I don't like the Tories, but this is exactly why the country is crumbling - the solutions to our problems aren't all nice and cuddly, so nobody will touch it.
Saturation Hall, Langstonedale
Lord of the Pies
Pie Punk said: Fair points, although I would point out that Labour didn't bomb in 2017 under Corbyn, they performed better than expected. They bombed in 2019 when the main difference was a shift in Brexit policy driven by the likes of Starmer, although the strange cult attraction Boris Johnson seemed to hold among some weird Brits was also a factor.
True, but they should have won a resounding victory, and would have done if someone more centre-left had been in charge. Corbyn absolutely lit up the left, but the electorate (in England - the only bit of the UK that actually matters, electorally) aren't left, they're centre-right.
And yes, 2019 was an utter disaster for Labour in every possible way, including the Cult of Boris and the gammon desperately wanting Brexit doing.
zimmerman23 said: Labour would have bombed far harder in 2017 if Theresa May hadn't been crucified for actually trying to give a solution to the social care crisis (the "dementia tax") rather than hand waving it away like every other politician. I don't like her and I don't like the Tories, but this is exactly why the country is crumbling - the solutions to our problems aren't all nice and cuddly, so nobody will touch it.
Indeed. And if we think it's bad now, wait till the true effects of climate change really start to kick in. Lies about the ecconomy can be fudged and fiddled. Those techniques won't work when there's a 250mph hurricane bearing down.
Saturation Hall - Forth! The Gungemaidens!
Climate change.... one of the parties has as it's pledge (can't remember who).... to learn to deal with the effects of climate change.
Yep.... learn to live with it and deal with it's consequences.
You are some kind of house brick if you think us poor Brits aiming for all this net zero bollocks is going to make the SLIGHTEST difference to the world climate.
China etc have no intention of net zero. Get ready for it, its coming (well, it's already here)
Yep.... learn to live with it and deal with it's consequences.
You are some kind of house brick if you think us poor Brits aiming for all this net zero bollocks is going to make the SLIGHTEST difference to the world climate.
China etc have no intention of net zero. Get ready for it, its coming (well, it's already here)
Gooeyandsticky said: Climate change.... one of the parties has as it's pledge (can't remember who).... to learn to deal with the effects of climate change.
Yep.... learn to live with it and deal with it's consequences.
You are some kind of house brick if you think us poor Brits aiming for all this net zero bollocks is going to make the SLIGHTEST difference to the world climate.
China etc have no intention of net zero. Get ready for it, its coming (well, it's already here)
Yep.... learn to live with it and deal with it's consequences.
You are some kind of house brick if you think us poor Brits aiming for all this net zero bollocks is going to make the SLIGHTEST difference to the world climate.
China etc have no intention of net zero. Get ready for it, its coming (well, it's already here)
You're probably right that it's irreversible, but the problem is everyone thinks "well, they're not doing anything about it so why should we?" rather than anyone taking the lead.
You can't criticise China's record on emissions while at the same time we send all our manufacturing work there. Also, China will always create the most emissions because it has the most people. We're worse than them per person, and the US is far worse still. Imagine if Luxembourg starting having a go at the UK for creating far more emissions than them, it would be laughed at. You've got to look at it on a per-capita basis, and ours is well above average there.
Well, they haven't got it right yet.
2 years ago I thought.... OK, I will go EV (even though I don't think its the future at all).
Been nothing but a pain in the bum and a massive cash loss.... the EV has depreciated horrifically to the point that after 3 years I am simply handing it back.
I have always had new cars, but I have taken a kicking on this one.
Add to that no incentives.... at all to actually own one (apart from helping polar bears).
EV insurance has trebled, awful EV charging network, and its more expensive to charge an EV than a tank of Diesel now on a forecourt.
Home charging? Nearly all the electric suppliers have revoked their cheap EV tariffs., or increased the day rate to compensate for the cheap night rate. So you are actually no better off.
Over 50% of EV drivers go back to fossil fuel apparently, and I will be one of them. I love my EV, but the inconvenience far outweighs the piddle good I am doing for the planet.
If indeed I am doing any good for the planet. Fairly sure the environmental damage from making my EV and the associated electricity generation kills off any gain.
2 years ago I thought.... OK, I will go EV (even though I don't think its the future at all).
Been nothing but a pain in the bum and a massive cash loss.... the EV has depreciated horrifically to the point that after 3 years I am simply handing it back.
I have always had new cars, but I have taken a kicking on this one.
Add to that no incentives.... at all to actually own one (apart from helping polar bears).
EV insurance has trebled, awful EV charging network, and its more expensive to charge an EV than a tank of Diesel now on a forecourt.
Home charging? Nearly all the electric suppliers have revoked their cheap EV tariffs., or increased the day rate to compensate for the cheap night rate. So you are actually no better off.
Over 50% of EV drivers go back to fossil fuel apparently, and I will be one of them. I love my EV, but the inconvenience far outweighs the piddle good I am doing for the planet.
If indeed I am doing any good for the planet. Fairly sure the environmental damage from making my EV and the associated electricity generation kills off any gain.
Gooeyandsticky said: Well, they haven't got it right yet.
2 years ago I thought.... OK, I will go EV (even though I don't think its the future at all).
Been nothing but a pain in the bum and a massive cash loss.... the EV has depreciated horrifically to the point that after 3 years I am simply handing it back.
I have always had new cars, but I have taken a kicking on this one.
Add to that no incentives.... at all to actually own one (apart from helping polar bears).
EV insurance has trebled, awful EV charging network, and its more expensive to charge an EV than a tank of Diesel now on a forecourt.
Home charging? Nearly all the electric suppliers have revoked their cheap EV tariffs., or increased the day rate to compensate for the cheap night rate. So you are actually no better off.
Over 50% of EV drivers go back to fossil fuel apparently, and I will be one of them. I love my EV, but the inconvenience far outweighs the piddle good I am doing for the planet.
If indeed I am doing any good for the planet. Fairly sure the environmental damage from making my EV and the associated electricity generation kills off any gain.
2 years ago I thought.... OK, I will go EV (even though I don't think its the future at all).
Been nothing but a pain in the bum and a massive cash loss.... the EV has depreciated horrifically to the point that after 3 years I am simply handing it back.
I have always had new cars, but I have taken a kicking on this one.
Add to that no incentives.... at all to actually own one (apart from helping polar bears).
EV insurance has trebled, awful EV charging network, and its more expensive to charge an EV than a tank of Diesel now on a forecourt.
Home charging? Nearly all the electric suppliers have revoked their cheap EV tariffs., or increased the day rate to compensate for the cheap night rate. So you are actually no better off.
Over 50% of EV drivers go back to fossil fuel apparently, and I will be one of them. I love my EV, but the inconvenience far outweighs the piddle good I am doing for the planet.
If indeed I am doing any good for the planet. Fairly sure the environmental damage from making my EV and the associated electricity generation kills off any gain.
I'd never go back to an ICE car. I'm now on my second EV and think both of them are up there with the best cars I've ever had. It costs me £4 to fully charge at home, on which I can cover 250 miles. And on the road, I can charge back to full for £20. I've done 15,000 miles in the last year, and barely notice the cost of charging in a monthly budget.
And wow, what a pleasure they are to drive. Until you've driven one, you don't realise how much contribution engine noise and vibration make to driving fatigue. I can easily drive eight hours in a day and not feel exhausted.
So yes...SploshNGo sessions are environmentally friendly!
Make a mess, create memories!
It costs me £4 to fully charge at home, on which I can cover 250 miles. And on the road, I can charge back to full for £20. I've done 15,000 miles in the last year, and barely notice the cost of charging in a monthly budget.
OK....
a) What car is that? I have a Cupra Born 77kw and it sure as hell isn't £20 to charge out on the road.
b) What tariff/supplier do you have at home? We have EON and they have nothing for the EV driver (who only tops up once/twice a week). Their 'Drive' tariff is cheaper Midnight to 7am, but the day Kwh charge is significantly higher and the we both work from home, so that actually costs us more.
c) Do you have solar? Yes, I can see the benefit of home charging if you have some free juice, but our house faces entirely the wrong direction for solar. Plus, spending 15k on solar panels is [term removed] to charge a car.
7/16/24, 2:27pm: Edited post to remove word "retarded." The user obviously did not mean it as an ableist slur against physically challenged people, and word itself is still not banned outright. It was removed here because modern usage of the word has generally become recognized as a sort of hate speech even when thrown about casually, and in this context it has no redeeming qualities like ironically reclaiming past slurs.
Saturation Hall, Langstonedale
Lord of the Pies
The last two weeks can probably be summed up as:
"Just how badly can a Tory PM humiliate his own party - A Field Guide by Rishi Sunak."
First there was the D-Day fiasco. Above all else, one thing that unites the Conservative movement in the UK is respect for veterans, the military, and the major events of WW2. That is sacred beyond all else. And this year, on the 6th of June, was the 80th anniversary of the D-Day landings. The last one at which there will be a significant number of veterans who fought on those beaches present, given they are all now in their late 90s or early 100s. And it fell during Sunak's tenure.
The King and Queen were there.
The President of the United States Of America was there.
The presidents of France and Germany were there.
Presisident Zelenski of Ukraine was there.
Hundreds of decorated veterans of WW2 were there.
D-Day, the first great victory in the liberation of Europe and the ultimate defeat of the Nazis.
The Leader of the Opposition was there, and Labour had agreed to suspend all election activity that day, as a mark of respect - Parliament united in support.
Quite possibly the single most important event, in terms of history and western liberal consensus that any PM could be at.
So what did Sunak do?
Attended one event and then fucked off back to London to do an election interview with ITV.
How to piss off the military, and the entire conservative voter base, all in one move.
And that was last week. Surely he couldn't make any more screwups after that? (hollow laugh)
"Oh yes, I had a deprived childhood. We had to do without Sky TV so mummy and daddy could afford my school fees."
And then it comes out that one of his closes aides had placed a hunderd quid bet on there being a July election, three days before Sunak announced it.
If someone had gone to a TV production company with that as the script for a political drama, it would have been laughed out of the building as so preposterous as to be completey impossible. And yet here we are.
Attached - the BBC's "Poll of Polls" election tracker that averages multiple opinion polls to give a better overview of how things stand. Labour is holding steady in the 40s and barring something disasterous happening, looks set for a landslide. The Tory support is doing a good impersonation of a sinking ship, while the hard-right Reform party led by Nigel Farage may well overtake the Tories if current trends continue.
One bright spot, the creator of the "Men Behaving Dadly" Facebook group, who seems to be a thoroughly well grounded and intelligent chap, started a joke fundraiser "Rishi Sunak's Sky TV Fund", with proceeds going to The Trussell Trust food-bank charity (food banks being a direct consequence of Tory austerity policies that have plunged tens of thousands of families into destitution). He set a modest target of £156. So far it's raised almost seven grand in three days.
https://www.justgiving.com/page/rishi-sky-tv
"Just how badly can a Tory PM humiliate his own party - A Field Guide by Rishi Sunak."
First there was the D-Day fiasco. Above all else, one thing that unites the Conservative movement in the UK is respect for veterans, the military, and the major events of WW2. That is sacred beyond all else. And this year, on the 6th of June, was the 80th anniversary of the D-Day landings. The last one at which there will be a significant number of veterans who fought on those beaches present, given they are all now in their late 90s or early 100s. And it fell during Sunak's tenure.
The King and Queen were there. The President of the United States Of America was there. The presidents of France and Germany were there. Presisident Zelenski of Ukraine was there. Hundreds of decorated veterans of WW2 were there. D-Day, the first great victory in the liberation of Europe and the ultimate defeat of the Nazis. The Leader of the Opposition was there, and Labour had agreed to suspend all election activity that day, as a mark of respect - Parliament united in support. Quite possibly the single most important event, in terms of history and western liberal consensus that any PM could be at. So what did Sunak do?
Attended one event and then fucked off back to London to do an election interview with ITV. How to piss off the military, and the entire conservative voter base, all in one move.
And that was last week. Surely he couldn't make any more screwups after that? (hollow laugh)
"Oh yes, I had a deprived childhood. We had to do without Sky TV so mummy and daddy could afford my school fees."
And then it comes out that one of his closes aides had placed a hunderd quid bet on there being a July election, three days before Sunak announced it.
If someone had gone to a TV production company with that as the script for a political drama, it would have been laughed out of the building as so preposterous as to be completey impossible. And yet here we are.
Attached - the BBC's "Poll of Polls" election tracker that averages multiple opinion polls to give a better overview of how things stand. Labour is holding steady in the 40s and barring something disasterous happening, looks set for a landslide. The Tory support is doing a good impersonation of a sinking ship, while the hard-right Reform party led by Nigel Farage may well overtake the Tories if current trends continue.
One bright spot, the creator of the "Men Behaving Dadly" Facebook group, who seems to be a thoroughly well grounded and intelligent chap, started a joke fundraiser "Rishi Sunak's Sky TV Fund", with proceeds going to The Trussell Trust food-bank charity (food banks being a direct consequence of Tory austerity policies that have plunged tens of thousands of families into destitution). He set a modest target of £156. So far it's raised almost seven grand in three days.
https://www.justgiving.com/page/rishi-sky-tv
Saturation Hall - Forth! The Gungemaidens!
 Love you, too |
Blair's record was leagues ahead of anyone
Oh yea, Captain Iraq
Saturation Hall, Langstonedale
Lord of the Pies
Gooeyandsticky said:
Oh yea, Captain Iraq
Blair's record was leagues ahead of anyone
Oh yea, Captain Iraq
He monumentally fucked that up. TBH I think he thought we were entering a new age of imperialism with the US invading and occupying countries, and that if he went along with it then UK businesses would benefit from some of the work and trade that would come out of that.
But, overall, his administration left the country in a much better place than when he started. Which 14 years of Tory incompetence have now totally FUBARed.
We desperately need change.
Saturation Hall - Forth! The Gungemaidens!
Gooeyandsticky said:
OK....
a) What car is that?
b) What tariff/supplier do you have at home?
c) Do you have solar?
It costs me £4 to fully charge at home, on which I can cover 250 miles. And on the road, I can charge back to full for £20. I've done 15,000 miles in the last year, and barely notice the cost of charging in a monthly budget.
OK....
a) What car is that?
b) What tariff/supplier do you have at home?
c) Do you have solar?
Tesla Model Y with a 59kW battery: Tesla charger at £0.37/kWh.
Octopus Intelligent Go, 7.5pkWh off-peak, 27pkWh peak.
No solar.
Make a mess, create memories!
DungeonMasterOne said: The last two weeks can probably be summed up as:
"Just how badly can a Tory PM humiliate his own party - A Field Guide by Rishi Sunak."
First there was the D-Day fiasco. Above all else, one thing that unites the Conservative movement in the UK is respect for veterans, the military, and the major events of WW2. That is sacred beyond all else. And this year, on the 6th of June, was the 80th anniversary of the D-Day landings. The last one at which there will be a significant number of veterans who fought on those beaches present, given they are all now in their late 90s or early 100s. And it fell during Sunak's tenure.
The King and Queen were there.
The President of the United States Of America was there.
The presidents of France and Germany were there.
Presisident Zelenski of Ukraine was there.
Hundreds of decorated veterans of WW2 were there.
D-Day, the first great victory in the liberation of Europe and the ultimate defeat of the Nazis.
The Leader of the Opposition was there, and Labour had agreed to suspend all election activity that day, as a mark of respect - Parliament united in support.
Quite possibly the single most important event, in terms of history and western liberal consensus that any PM could be at.
So what did Sunak do?
Attended one event and then fucked off back to London to do an election interview with ITV.
How to piss off the military, and the entire conservative voter base, all in one move.
And that was last week. Surely he couldn't make any more screwups after that? (hollow laugh)
"Oh yes, I had a deprived childhood. We had to do without Sky TV so mummy and daddy could afford my school fees."
And then it comes out that one of his closes aides had placed a hunderd quid bet on there being a July election, three days before Sunak announced it.
If someone had gone to a TV production company with that as the script for a political drama, it would have been laughed out of the building as so preposterous as to be completey impossible. And yet here we are.
Attached - the BBC's "Poll of Polls" election tracker that averages multiple opinion polls to give a better overview of how things stand. Labour is holding steady in the 40s and barring something disasterous happening, looks set for a landslide. The Tory support is doing a good impersonation of a sinking ship, while the hard-right Reform party led by Nigel Farage may well overtake the Tories if current trends continue.
One bright spot, the creator of the "Men Behaving Dadly" Facebook group, who seems to be a thoroughly well grounded and intelligent chap, started a joke fundraiser "Rishi Sunak's Sky TV Fund", with proceeds going to The Trussell Trust food-bank charity (food banks being a direct consequence of Tory austerity policies that have plunged tens of thousands of families into destitution). He set a modest target of £156. So far it's raised almost seven grand in three days.
https://www.justgiving.com/page/rishi-sky-tv
"Just how badly can a Tory PM humiliate his own party - A Field Guide by Rishi Sunak."
First there was the D-Day fiasco. Above all else, one thing that unites the Conservative movement in the UK is respect for veterans, the military, and the major events of WW2. That is sacred beyond all else. And this year, on the 6th of June, was the 80th anniversary of the D-Day landings. The last one at which there will be a significant number of veterans who fought on those beaches present, given they are all now in their late 90s or early 100s. And it fell during Sunak's tenure.
The King and Queen were there. The President of the United States Of America was there. The presidents of France and Germany were there. Presisident Zelenski of Ukraine was there. Hundreds of decorated veterans of WW2 were there. D-Day, the first great victory in the liberation of Europe and the ultimate defeat of the Nazis. The Leader of the Opposition was there, and Labour had agreed to suspend all election activity that day, as a mark of respect - Parliament united in support. Quite possibly the single most important event, in terms of history and western liberal consensus that any PM could be at. So what did Sunak do?
Attended one event and then fucked off back to London to do an election interview with ITV. How to piss off the military, and the entire conservative voter base, all in one move.
And that was last week. Surely he couldn't make any more screwups after that? (hollow laugh)
"Oh yes, I had a deprived childhood. We had to do without Sky TV so mummy and daddy could afford my school fees."
And then it comes out that one of his closes aides had placed a hunderd quid bet on there being a July election, three days before Sunak announced it.
If someone had gone to a TV production company with that as the script for a political drama, it would have been laughed out of the building as so preposterous as to be completey impossible. And yet here we are.
Attached - the BBC's "Poll of Polls" election tracker that averages multiple opinion polls to give a better overview of how things stand. Labour is holding steady in the 40s and barring something disasterous happening, looks set for a landslide. The Tory support is doing a good impersonation of a sinking ship, while the hard-right Reform party led by Nigel Farage may well overtake the Tories if current trends continue.
One bright spot, the creator of the "Men Behaving Dadly" Facebook group, who seems to be a thoroughly well grounded and intelligent chap, started a joke fundraiser "Rishi Sunak's Sky TV Fund", with proceeds going to The Trussell Trust food-bank charity (food banks being a direct consequence of Tory austerity policies that have plunged tens of thousands of families into destitution). He set a modest target of £156. So far it's raised almost seven grand in three days.
https://www.justgiving.com/page/rishi-sky-tv
There's so much backstabbing in that party it wouldn't surprise me if someone's misadvising him on purpose.
Saturation Hall, Langstonedale
Lord of the Pies
Boundspike said: Surely I am not alone in getting fed up with the wall to wall coverage of general election news, I'm just sick of the lies being told from either side - For a laugh Id like to see the country just vote for someone else like Green or the Independents and wipe the smug smiles of some peoples faces.
Unfortunately unless and until we upgrade to a modern proportional voting system, that won't happen. At least it's into the final week though. Last night's debate really took the biscuit, Starmer was mostly being sane and reasonable, Sunak was desperately trying to appeal to the far right and throwing everyone, particularly trans women and assylum seekers, under the bus in the process. Vile, vile man, destroyed any residual respect I previously had for him.
Saturation Hall - Forth! The Gungemaidens!
8/16/24, 10:47pm: This post won't bump the thread to the top.
I really feel there should be an option of: 'I'd like to exercise my democratic right to vote in this election, but I don't like any of the available options' on the actual ballot paper...
Not just in this particular election, but every time.
It's all very well saying: "spoil your ballot paper" but this just means the voter was unable to mark their paper in the correct manner to be recognised, including such things as making their mark bigger than the box or missing their intended box completely, as can happen with less able voters. (If your X goes outside the box margins thats counted as 'spoilt' even if it's clear which candidate was the intentional vote).
Not just in this particular election, but every time.
It's all very well saying: "spoil your ballot paper" but this just means the voter was unable to mark their paper in the correct manner to be recognised, including such things as making their mark bigger than the box or missing their intended box completely, as can happen with less able voters. (If your X goes outside the box margins thats counted as 'spoilt' even if it's clear which candidate was the intentional vote).
I'm up all night to get muckkkyyyy
Saturation Hall, Langstonedale
Lord of the Pies
adidas said: I really feel there should be an option of: 'I'd like to exercise my democratic right to vote in this election, but I don't like any of the available options' on the actual ballot paper...
Not just in this particular election, but every time.
Not just in this particular election, but every time.
That's been proposed a few times, either a "None of the above" or "Re-open nominations" (usually referred to as RON). Never been taken up in the UK though.
adidas said: It's all very well saying: "spoil your ballot paper" but this just means the voter was unable to mark their paper in the correct manner to be recognised, including such things as making their mark bigger than the box or missing their intended box completely, as can happen with less able voters. (If your X goes outside the box margins thats counted as 'spoilt' even if it's clear which candidate was the intentional vote).
That's not correct. The official guidance is that the only valid reasons to reject a ballot paper are:
No official mark [1] Voting for more than one candidate. Writing that could identify the voter (like if they've signed the ballot) No vote at all, or uncertainty about which box they meant to mark. You can read the full rules and guidance here (pdf link):
https://www.electoralcommission.org.uk/sites/default/files/pdf_file/UKPE-doubtfuls-booklet.pdf
Bascially, as long as the voting intention is clear, they'll count it. You could draw Pikachu in the box and it'd count, even if his antennae stuck out the top.
[1] When they give you a ballot at a polling station they stamp it first with an official mark. One without the mark would suggest someone tried to add an extra to the ballot box, hence invalid.
Saturation Hall - Forth! The Gungemaidens!
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