When photographing/filming messy sessions, I've noticed an increase in the numbers of men turning up and expecting to touch and rub mess into the female's boobs and bum. I'm not talking about a carefully aimed pie on a paper plate but actual, for want of a better word, groping. Obviously, most women offering sessions don't want to do this, and I know a couple who've been put off by it, but how widespread a development is it?

where are you filming these sessions?

it's something to be either agreed between the model and the client before the session takes place. I offered sessions for 12 years and everyone was keen to check if any level of touch was ok and everyone keen not to offend me in anyway. Most of the time I allowed pies to boobs and bum and a little rubbing in. In the kind of tit for tat sessions that were my fave, I liked being a little relaxed and allowing some level of 'saucy' rather than overtly sexual.

I also wouldn't say 'most' women offering sessions don't want this. A good many on sploshsessions.com allow some level of touch or much more. All depends on the individual and their own rules and boundaries. Of course some don't allow it all and that's fine too but I just wouldn't say 'most'

There were also many clients in my run of sessions that specifically requested no touch or no nudity, so plenty of men out there are not interested in groping or pushing boundaries

Yeah, I don't think you speak for "most". Just like Candy said, everyone has got their own limits. This kind of thing is always negotiated up front.

What Candy and Potatoman said is spot on.

If you offer enough $$$, you may get to touch, but I'm sure no model wants to be touched by a stranger or even an acquaintance without a $$$ reason to. I'm sure this won't be an issue if the model and producer are married I don't think.

I should have been clearer I was referring to men turning up and wanting to push boundaries despite having limits explained to them beforehand. And if they're told again when the pies are about to be used that they can aim a pie at a boob but not touch breasts or rub it in... but they then repeatedly make "jokes" about how much better it would be if they could rub it in, it suggests they think they're entitled.

And there was one guy who turned up and helped himself to a good old feel when he took two handfuls of mess and applied them directly to the female's breasts!

I realise there are "anything goes" sessions even including messy sex but my post was not about those. I don't know anyone who offers them, and I don't think I'd feel comfortable to film that anyway.

I've only photographed and filmed sessions in the UK with a small number of women but I have to respect the privacy of everyone involved by not saying exactly where.

I didn't realise there was a website listing models' levels for sessions. I'll take a look over the weekend.

I don't really understand the situation here... models who do messy sessions with clients are allowing you to be there to film, and you are noticing that they are increasingly being sexually assaulted?

Have you said anything to these men?

Does this establishment have any security? Is it legit? I mean I operated independently but your description sounds more like some kind of organised place

Basically it is sexual assault if pre agreed 'no touching' and then someone proceeds to grab breasts. The women involved could report this to police... and they have you as a witness

Just to echo what other people have said, consent is key. I've done a couple of sessions, and I made sure to establish ground rules at the start.

If you pie people in the face, that mess will tend to travel downwards, so some people might prefer "nothing below the neck" or "nothing in the swimsuit area". Similarly, although I'm happy to be pied anywhere, the person I'm with might prefer to avoid certain areas. Even then, we both double-checked before we did things, e.g. "I'll go for a bum pie, if that's ok?"

It's disappointing that some people behave badly, but I can't comment on how widespread it is. If they overstep the mark like that, I'd expect the session to come to an immediate halt. And Candy is right: if you witnessed it (and certainly if you have video evidence), I'd encourage you to offer your asstance.

I don't turn up to film and photograph for my benefit. It's because some of the women's clients like to have photos or recordings as a keepsake and pay extra for this.

I've noticed men increasingly dropping hints about wanting to touch breasts, but there was only one guy who actually did it, as I described above. His session was cut short, he was blacklisted by the woman, and as a result he is now blacklisted by every other woman she knows offering sessions.

I don't think he was reported to the police. I felt he should have been but it wasn't my decision to make. I don't think he was "all there" tbh.

That's why I'm heartened by the website you told me about. I think it's good to have clear lists online of who offers what. It's another layer of protection for women offering sessions.

What Candy said.

There's no general rule. It's case by case. We're fortunately a small community and I gather on the whole very respectful towards each other. Our ethics are governed by reciprocity.

Sexual fetish role play is intimate by implication and bound to throw up issues of mixed messages and potential misunderstandings.

Communicate
Negotiate

Clients: Ask about boundaries. Agree to them and abide by them and don't push it! Ask questions if you're unsure.

Models: Assert your boundaries, be specific, using examples, and tailor your rules to your level of comfort, if necessary, each time, with each client.

Good points by candy and Richard. My only splosh partners were with people where pretty much anything was OK, one was a girl from an escort agency and the other was a girlfriend. If it had been with a model or another kind of person offering sessions, the ground rules would have been discussed first and strictly adhered to.

One of my other fetishes is spanking and bdsm, and I have had a few session with spankees who have confirmed no sexual contact, and safe words, and I always strictly keep to these.

Discuss first and follow simple boundaries and have fun. Always be respectful to your partner in a session.

It all boils down to consent. Consent talk is HUGE right now in pretty much all the fetish communities. It is extremely important to discuss Consent before any messy session is to take place, any main stream producer will tell you that. There are TONS of things to discuss before any session, Safety , consent, dress, etiquette, mess, all must be addressed ahead of time.