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"The most niche subdivision of WAM? Are you unique?"
Love you, too
SStuff said:
At least half of the session time is spent on the model showering, cleaning up, and redoing hair & makeup. And that's also the most draining part (according to all the models I work with).
So if you shoot 3 scenes involving 20 pies, each running about half an hour, that'll take 3 1/2 hours. (40 min per scene for model to cleanup & get ready.) If you shoot 3 scenes involving 3 pies, each running 5 min, you're only saving an hour or so. But you can sell all 3 of those 20-pie scenes individually.... whereas you'll probably need to combine the 3 "short" scenes into one bigger clip to get any sales.
Doing what you describe CAN be done... but it takes a lot more time (and usually money) to get enough content to sell. PiesNextDoor did scenes just like you described... and he stopped because he was losing money.
I've done it on a handful of occasions, but usually just with models I know really well who can get cleaned up in a hurry. Toshia did this for the SS100 scene.... I *think* there were four different outfits where she got pied, and for the first 3 she just washed up briefly rather than redoing hair & makeup. It still wound up taking over 2 hours just to shoot that one clip tho (as opposed to 30-45 min for a regular one), so it's not the kind of thing I can do with today's models who want to be paid hourly and freak out if they take more than 3 showers in one session.
johnnypie said:
I have no idea why pie producers use "20 pies." I'd rather take that same session time and just do a lot different scenarios.
I have no idea why pie producers use "20 pies." I'd rather take that same session time and just do a lot different scenarios.
At least half of the session time is spent on the model showering, cleaning up, and redoing hair & makeup. And that's also the most draining part (according to all the models I work with).
So if you shoot 3 scenes involving 20 pies, each running about half an hour, that'll take 3 1/2 hours. (40 min per scene for model to cleanup & get ready.) If you shoot 3 scenes involving 3 pies, each running 5 min, you're only saving an hour or so. But you can sell all 3 of those 20-pie scenes individually.... whereas you'll probably need to combine the 3 "short" scenes into one bigger clip to get any sales.
Doing what you describe CAN be done... but it takes a lot more time (and usually money) to get enough content to sell. PiesNextDoor did scenes just like you described... and he stopped because he was losing money.
I've done it on a handful of occasions, but usually just with models I know really well who can get cleaned up in a hurry. Toshia did this for the SS100 scene.... I *think* there were four different outfits where she got pied, and for the first 3 she just washed up briefly rather than redoing hair & makeup. It still wound up taking over 2 hours just to shoot that one clip tho (as opposed to 30-45 min for a regular one), so it's not the kind of thing I can do with today's models who want to be paid hourly and freak out if they take more than 3 showers in one session.
Well this why is you're the pro and I'm not. Yep, there's no real way to shoot 3 or 4 brand new scenes and make it look real in a reasonable amount of time since they'd have to shower after each scene.
I do indeed give it to you guys - it's a massive amount of work for these shoots.
And I'm right there with ya - I also have to pay models their hourly rate, on top of travel depending on the distance. If it goes over "X" amount of time then I'm paying a day rate.
So I try to cram as many scenes into a few hours as possible so I have a lot of content out of a single session. Not really possible with what you're doing.
Richard Trouso said:
I like to see different parts of a woman's body pied and messed up. Armpits, for instance. After doing this once on Ginger D I had a message from a fan who said they particularly loved this. I've tried to squeeze some under arm action into almost every scene since.
On the subject of pied boobs. This is very much a must - especially in a topless scene. So many missed opportunities in other people's pie videos where the model is topless with a big, thick cream pie in each hand and they then shove them into...their own face 
I like to see different parts of a woman's body pied and messed up. Armpits, for instance. After doing this once on Ginger D I had a message from a fan who said they particularly loved this. I've tried to squeeze some under arm action into almost every scene since.
On the subject of pied boobs. This is very much a must - especially in a topless scene. So many missed opportunities in other people's pie videos where the model is topless with a big, thick cream pie in each hand and they then shove them into...their own face
Too often I notice the same formula, even when pie-ing boobs. It's always the face first. I'd like to see someone really change it up, like the girl is expecting a pie in the face, but it goes between her boobs and head, on the upper chest. She is surprised to have a clean face, then perhaps the next one goes to the face or two to the boobs. I also agree that pie after pie to the face is too predictable. I'd much rather see them hitting the girl all over, with face hits interspersed when she doesn't know they're coming. That also means having the camera showing all of her, not just from the shoulders up. And I'm not even into pies! LOL
johnnypie said:
And I'm right there with ya - I also have to pay models their hourly rate, on top of travel depending on the distance. If it goes over "X" amount of time then I'm paying a day rate.
So I try to cram as many scenes into a few hours as possible so I have a lot of content out of a single session. Not really possible with what you're doing.
And I'm right there with ya - I also have to pay models their hourly rate, on top of travel depending on the distance. If it goes over "X" amount of time then I'm paying a day rate.
So I try to cram as many scenes into a few hours as possible so I have a lot of content out of a single session. Not really possible with what you're doing.
It took me a lot of years (and shoots), but eventually I figured out that it's worth it to take the time, and even shoot less scenes... but make them all look good... rather than trying to cram in as many as I can. Cuz you wind up with at least 1-2 scenes where the model looks exhausted, her hair is wet & stringy, barely any makeup, etc. Better for her to take the extra time and really look amazing. (And also not be wiped from shower after shower.) And that said, there's still models who tell me their hair needs hours to dry properly... so invariably their hair is the "giveaway" even when the rest of them looks great.
Also, I try with local models to do a set rate for 2, or 3 scenes, and then we're not watching the clock. If someone's flying in, ideally you shoot two half-days of 4 hours or so. SOME models can shoot all day with a couple breaks, but most get wiped after the third or fourth shower.
Trouso, now see what you have started! 
SStuff said:
Pretty sure half of all volumes we released in the last six months had at least one stockings/hose scene.
Lapwingboy said: It sometimes feels like I'm the only person with a stockings fetish nowadays, increasingly rare sight...
Pretty sure half of all volumes we released in the last six months had at least one stockings/hose scene.
Also, like 90% of MostWAM stuff, and a significant amount of Ariel and Jayce's stuff as they both actually LIKE wearing hosiery.
There's really no shortage of it, probably more than ever, but maybe other things that are not to your liking in them I guess.
He's more potato now than man. Twisted and evil.
One top specific thing which is quite rare, and I know is off-limits here on UMD, is involving watersports (golden showers, wetting, etc) with WAM. That's a perfect confluence of my two favorite fetishes, and would be my ideal perfect sub-genre.
I'll toss in some other personal preferences:
Like:
- Must be clothed for at least some of the messy play. Happy to have them naked for part of it, but start clothed and work towards being naked, though nudity isn't necessary.
- Savory preferred, but all is good.
- The girls having fun with it and enjoying it. That includes keeping their face and reactions visible as much as possible.
- I love reactions from true amateurs and first-timers.
- Sexual play as part of it (masturbation, blowjob, full-on sex, etc). Not a requirement, just a plus.
Dislike:
- Acting, in ANY way. The worst of which is a producer feeding lines to the model for her to say.
- Stockings, tights, panty hose, etc.
- Tattoos, piercings, makeup or artificial anything.
- By far, the biggest turn-off is when they aren't enjoying it and/or having fun with it.
I'll toss in some other personal preferences:
Like:
- Must be clothed for at least some of the messy play. Happy to have them naked for part of it, but start clothed and work towards being naked, though nudity isn't necessary.
- Savory preferred, but all is good.
- The girls having fun with it and enjoying it. That includes keeping their face and reactions visible as much as possible.
- I love reactions from true amateurs and first-timers.
- Sexual play as part of it (masturbation, blowjob, full-on sex, etc). Not a requirement, just a plus.
Dislike:
- Acting, in ANY way. The worst of which is a producer feeding lines to the model for her to say.
- Stockings, tights, panty hose, etc.
- Tattoos, piercings, makeup or artificial anything.
- By far, the biggest turn-off is when they aren't enjoying it and/or having fun with it.
sororia said:
See? I didn't even know that existed and now I super want to see it. That's the beauty of this thread.
MuddyOtter said: guys getting messy in latex animal suits
See? I didn't even know that existed and now I super want to see it. That's the beauty of this thread.
I'm sure it's a subgenre I'll end up contributing to some time!
I'd like to see a soaking wet model, preferably in a tight, lowcut sexy dress, getting hit with pies. I'm also turned on by other wet, sexy outfits (shorts, shirts, even bikinis).
I don't get to see this very often. The closest on a regular basis is when Slapstick Stuff "waters" the model for the second or third round.
I also much prefer thrown pies "out of nowhere" to pushed, and pushed by another sexy woman to pushed by a man.
What this discussion shows is that there's a wide variety of interests. For everyone who loves A, there's someone who hates A.
For producers that means "if you build it they will come." (couldn't resist)
I don't get to see this very often. The closest on a regular basis is when Slapstick Stuff "waters" the model for the second or third round.
I also much prefer thrown pies "out of nowhere" to pushed, and pushed by another sexy woman to pushed by a man.
What this discussion shows is that there's a wide variety of interests. For everyone who loves A, there's someone who hates A.
For producers that means "if you build it they will come."
(couldn't resist)
SStuff said:
It took me a lot of years (and shoots), but eventually I figured out that it's worth it to take the time, and even shoot less scenes... but make them all look good... rather than trying to cram in as many as I can. Cuz you wind up with at least 1-2 scenes where the model looks exhausted, her hair is wet & stringy, barely any makeup, etc. Better for her to take the extra time and really look amazing. (And also not be wiped from shower after shower.) And that said, there's still models who tell me their hair needs hours to dry properly... so invariably their hair is the "giveaway" even when the rest of them looks great.
Also, I try with local models to do a set rate for 2, or 3 scenes, and then we're not watching the clock. If someone's flying in, ideally you shoot two half-days of 4 hours or so. SOME models can shoot all day with a couple breaks, but most get wiped after the third or fourth shower.
johnnypie said:
And I'm right there with ya - I also have to pay models their hourly rate, on top of travel depending on the distance. If it goes over "X" amount of time then I'm paying a day rate.
So I try to cram as many scenes into a few hours as possible so I have a lot of content out of a single session. Not really possible with what you're doing.
And I'm right there with ya - I also have to pay models their hourly rate, on top of travel depending on the distance. If it goes over "X" amount of time then I'm paying a day rate.
So I try to cram as many scenes into a few hours as possible so I have a lot of content out of a single session. Not really possible with what you're doing.
It took me a lot of years (and shoots), but eventually I figured out that it's worth it to take the time, and even shoot less scenes... but make them all look good... rather than trying to cram in as many as I can. Cuz you wind up with at least 1-2 scenes where the model looks exhausted, her hair is wet & stringy, barely any makeup, etc. Better for her to take the extra time and really look amazing. (And also not be wiped from shower after shower.) And that said, there's still models who tell me their hair needs hours to dry properly... so invariably their hair is the "giveaway" even when the rest of them looks great.
Also, I try with local models to do a set rate for 2, or 3 scenes, and then we're not watching the clock. If someone's flying in, ideally you shoot two half-days of 4 hours or so. SOME models can shoot all day with a couple breaks, but most get wiped after the third or fourth shower.
I'm heartened to hear this, Rich. I think milking it becomes counter-productive. It comes over in the final product (which, in the end, will have to be undersold) and the models are miserable and won't want to do it again. Although the initial excitement for a new scene provides that necessary payback for the costs - a good back catalogue does provide a better residual income, long term.
The stuff I like to do (and fans expect) is too long and messy to even consider doing multiple scenes. Hair usually gets quite fucked up in the course of things and usually requires more treatment than just a wash to recover. Isla (a fee paid model) has done 2 in one day with me but that was just mud on its own. She just about got her hair right again in time.
What we all can do, though, is cram in little bits of people's niche fetishes into ongoing scenes without too much departure or distraction.
Bringing pleasure to literally tens of people!
I had a wam friend who was asked by a guy if he had taken any pictures of girls getting muddy in trainers/sneakers.
He sent the guy some pics, and the response was off the scale - abusive, negative, labelling him as every sort of idiot under the sun .....
..... because they weren't Dunlop Green Flash trainers!!
He sent the guy some pics, and the response was off the scale - abusive, negative, labelling him as every sort of idiot under the sun .....
..... because they weren't Dunlop Green Flash trainers!!
Normality is subjective.
Ooh, I've got one.. For some reason chokers do it for me.
That's a ribbon or wide necklace, usually with a pendant or something on the front, instead of hanging down like a necklace.
No idea why, not particularly into bondage, although weirdly, I have a thing for Mary Jane type shoes too, closed toe, with a strap and a loop just above the ankle..
I have a deep hatred/phobia of feet too, so doesn't make sense either. I think m just weird
That's a ribbon or wide necklace, usually with a pendant or something on the front, instead of hanging down like a necklace.
No idea why, not particularly into bondage, although weirdly, I have a thing for Mary Jane type shoes too, closed toe, with a strap and a loop just above the ankle..
I have a deep hatred/phobia of feet too, so doesn't make sense either. I think m just weird
Lapwingboy said: Ooh, I've got one.. For some reason chokers do it for me.
That's a ribbon or wide necklace, usually with a pendant or something on the front, instead of hanging down like a necklace.
No idea why, not particularly into bondage, although weirdly, I have a thing for Mary Jane type shoes too, closed toe, with a strap and a loop just above the ankle..
I have a deep hatred/phobia of feet too, so doesn't make sense either. I think m just weird
That's a ribbon or wide necklace, usually with a pendant or something on the front, instead of hanging down like a necklace.
No idea why, not particularly into bondage, although weirdly, I have a thing for Mary Jane type shoes too, closed toe, with a strap and a loop just above the ankle..
I have a deep hatred/phobia of feet too, so doesn't make sense either. I think m just weird
None of us (or you could say all of us) are weird. We have very detailed specifics about what we love or hate, but somehow, we got wired that way, probably as children.
I'm in the ooey gooey sticky/stuck fetish corner of the wam playpit. One of my formative experiences was playing in less than waist-deep mud as a child (and wishing it was deeper). I remember being captivated by finding pics online (via dialup) of Pippa in the mud. Another influential scene I saw was in The Lost World tv series in the episode with giant bees. The buxom Jennifer O'Dell falls into a chamber full of honey. It turns out there's a giant bee larva in with her that tries to get snippy. As "Veronica" struggled and fought, you could see how viscous all that honey was as she moved through it! And don't get me started on the Battlestar Galactica Cylon slime pods!
From childhood my interests matured. One of my first play attempts involved melting down 20 pounds of marshmallows and gummies to make a gigantic sticky blob to play with in the bathtub. This was also an early lesson to be careful what to (try to) put down the drain!
It wasn't until my 30th birthday that I really started putting myself out there seeking out my messy fetishes. I had a grand "Dirty 30" - I got to be enveloped in thick bottomless mud and was introduced to massive-scale slime play!
So as far as actually living out my sticky/stuck fantasies, I've done:
- Bottomless tidal silt
- Crewing and directing quicksand videos
- Writhing around in gallons of clingy slippery slime on my waterbed
- Filling a bathtub to the brim with over 30 gallons of thick, sticky, stretchy black "tar" slime
- Getting sucked into a vacbed (a new facet to the "stuck" area)
More fantasies to come (possible and purely fantasy):
- Vacbed with longterm sexual gratification
- Sinking in MPV's "mpvbleck" (sadly may be impossible now)
- Getting super sticky with Jayce and Kaydens!
- Getting rolled around in a vac-cube... completely stuck and immobile, flipped over and upside down!
- Any slime girl envelopment scenarios
- I want to play with that sticky stuff used by Opera and which also made an appearance in the short-lived "I Survived A Japanese Game Show" - I think it's called birdlime, and it looks super sticky!
- I was also agog at the massive tank of slime eels on Fear Factor
- And might consider some minor misdemeanors if it would mean getting hit with that wacky sticky foam crowd control weapon developed years back
- Being stuck in the hot melt psa glue Sticky Barbi used with Mandy
https://www.clips4sale.com/studio/21297/20568815/mandy-stuckfast-in-hot-melt-100-lbs
OMG I just want to lie down on that glue "bed" and feel every inch of my body stuck and held fast!
Currently I have over 50 gallons of glue-borax slime stored in 5-gallon buckets taking up space in my closet , over 90 "Slime Baff" packets - enough for over 100 gallons of slime, 5lbs of sticky yuck (in dry powder form), Bodyslime, nuru gel, way too many inflatable pools, and for good measure, Sybian and Venus2000 machines, not to mention my old-school king size waterbed. I have a session booked with wam newcomer Aubrey, and I can't wait to share the messy fun we get up to!
So... who else wants to get enveloped in sticky slime??
From childhood my interests matured. One of my first play attempts involved melting down 20 pounds of marshmallows and gummies to make a gigantic sticky blob to play with in the bathtub. This was also an early lesson to be careful what to (try to) put down the drain!
It wasn't until my 30th birthday that I really started putting myself out there seeking out my messy fetishes. I had a grand "Dirty 30" - I got to be enveloped in thick bottomless mud and was introduced to massive-scale slime play!
So as far as actually living out my sticky/stuck fantasies, I've done:
- Bottomless tidal silt
- Crewing and directing quicksand videos
- Writhing around in gallons of clingy slippery slime on my waterbed
- Filling a bathtub to the brim with over 30 gallons of thick, sticky, stretchy black "tar" slime
- Getting sucked into a vacbed (a new facet to the "stuck" area)
More fantasies to come (possible and purely fantasy):
- Vacbed with longterm sexual gratification
- Sinking in MPV's "mpvbleck" (sadly may be impossible now)
- Getting super sticky with Jayce and Kaydens!
- Getting rolled around in a vac-cube... completely stuck and immobile, flipped over and upside down!
- Any slime girl envelopment scenarios
- I want to play with that sticky stuff used by Opera and which also made an appearance in the short-lived "I Survived A Japanese Game Show" - I think it's called birdlime, and it looks super sticky!
- I was also agog at the massive tank of slime eels on Fear Factor
- And might consider some minor misdemeanors if it would mean getting hit with that wacky sticky foam crowd control weapon developed years back
- Being stuck in the hot melt psa glue Sticky Barbi used with Mandy
https://www.clips4sale.com/studio/21297/20568815/mandy-stuckfast-in-hot-melt-100-lbs
OMG I just want to lie down on that glue "bed" and feel every inch of my body stuck and held fast!
Currently I have over 50 gallons of glue-borax slime stored in 5-gallon buckets taking up space in my closet , over 90 "Slime Baff" packets - enough for over 100 gallons of slime, 5lbs of sticky yuck (in dry powder form), Bodyslime, nuru gel, way too many inflatable pools, and for good measure, Sybian and Venus2000 machines, not to mention my old-school king size waterbed. I have a session booked with wam newcomer Aubrey, and I can't wait to share the messy fun we get up to!
So... who else wants to get enveloped in sticky slime??
Lapwingboy said: Ooh, I've got one.. For some reason chokers do it for me.
That's a ribbon or wide necklace, usually with a pendant or something on the front, instead of hanging down like a necklace.
No idea why, not particularly into bondage, although weirdly, I have a thing for Mary Jane type shoes too, closed toe, with a strap and a loop just above the ankle..
I have a deep hatred/phobia of feet too, so doesn't make sense either. I think m just weird
That's a ribbon or wide necklace, usually with a pendant or something on the front, instead of hanging down like a necklace.
No idea why, not particularly into bondage, although weirdly, I have a thing for Mary Jane type shoes too, closed toe, with a strap and a loop just above the ankle..
I have a deep hatred/phobia of feet too, so doesn't make sense either. I think m just weird
I love legs and high heels - but I have zero interest in bare feet. Zero.
Bringing pleasure to literally tens of people!
Richard Trouso said:
I'm heartened to hear this, Rich. I think milking it becomes counter-productive.
I'm heartened to hear this, Rich. I think milking it becomes counter-productive.
Agreed. It's always a balancing act though. These days a lot of my models either drive some distance or fly in, and you can't really justify that for just shooting 1-2 scenes. BUT you can arrange the schedule so you only doing 3 scenes (4 max) over the course of the day, so the model isn't completely exhausted. (And TBH *I* am completely exhausted too! No idea who that guy was who got in 6+ scenes in one day on multiple occasions...)
It's also really nice when a model is able to shoot a lot, but is fine with just one scene per session... That's how both Breana and Taylor do it, and it's no coincidence the scenes wind up being super epic and super messy! (With the model in good spirits at the beginning, if not always the end.....)
Okaaaaaaaay, this may sound a lil odd but hey we're all friends here right ? One thing I REALLY get off on is seeing a girl pied, gunged etc. (who is in all likelihood not aware she is) dribbling. The sight of a stream of drool hanging off a chin is a huge turn on.
Indulgence over abstinence.
I may not be alone in this but I get incredibly horny when I see wam and leather leggings/faux leather leggings combined absolutely amazing.
Also love models getting absolutely filthy in mud like they don't care where it all goes or goes in.
And maybe another niche one mud and sex/blowjobs/handjobs/footjobs with facials
Also love models getting absolutely filthy in mud like they don't care where it all goes or goes in.
And maybe another niche one mud and sex/blowjobs/handjobs/footjobs with facials
Lapwingboy said: Ooh, I've got one.. For some reason chokers do it for me.
I'm with you on that one. And like you, I too don't know why!
Make a mess, create memories!
joeschmo said: I have a fetish for shaved heads so I love seeing them in WAM settings, preferably female but also with men.
You think it would be more common since it makes clean up easier but apparently not.
You think it would be more common since it makes clean up easier but apparently not.
Yes, I love Leah's Messygirl scenes involving 'shaved' heads. Shame they're not for real - it would be a brave (but amazing) model who would agree to incorporate a real-life head shave into a wam shoot.
Make a mess, create memories!
Another of my all-time favourites in WAM is the funnel gag, or force-feeder. To my knowledge, a few of the Messygirl models are the only ones to have tried it - and I was delighted to see the first scene to feature it, as I'd long harboured an idea to try it!
I know it's not to everyone's taste (perhaps literally) but to me this perfectly combines elements of my love of WAM and enjoyment of S&M.
I know it's not to everyone's taste (perhaps literally) but to me this perfectly combines elements of my love of WAM and enjoyment of S&M.
Make a mess, create memories!
scroggle said: I wonder if we get imprinted wiith the thing we see?
I've wondered that too. I would have started watching TV in the late 50s and the women pied on the variety/comedy shows (not the sitcoms) were wearing elegant, lowcut gowns and long gloves. I don't remember any specific shows. Later in college I saw a compilation of quick clips from early TV, and one part of it was such women getting pied, one after the other. Wish I cud remember its name, but I was busy trying not to show my hardon in the lecture hall!
But I do remember a Mickey Mouse Club Show film insert where Annette and other girls were pushed in a lake fully clothed. Nothing sexy there, I mean this was DISNEY, but I do like wetlook ever since.
Asian girls (a sad rarity these days)
If it is a gunge/slime scene featuring an Asian girl then it's an insta-purchase.
If it is a gunge/slime scene featuring an Asian girl then it's an insta-purchase.
One would think my kink is widely covered by our producers but it is actually doesnt happen that often.. two girls casual (jeans or leggings) + (t-shirt.. tank top etc) wrestling in mud or clay or slime.. undressing their oponent as their wrestle.. then pleasuring one another..
For some reason that sounds like WAM 101 to me, but those videos are pretty rare.. theres probably 250 pie videos to 1 video like that coming out..
For some reason that sounds like WAM 101 to me, but those videos are pretty rare.. theres probably 250 pie videos to 1 video like that coming out..
My general likes:
Women only or at the very least, first in the
scene.
Slime is number 1.
If she is genuinely having fun with it, express it.
I'm not a fan of humiliation, I just want to see a lady get messy.
My niches:
Glasses
Redheads (not NEARLY enough of either one)
Slime pulls her top down
Looking up
Self-sliming only if it's a pull cord release
Don't like
Camera panning up and down her body while the slime is still in full force. This can wait until it's done.
Face coverage without looking up doesn't count to me
Self-slimings
Women only or at the very least, first in the
scene.
Slime is number 1.
If she is genuinely having fun with it, express it.
I'm not a fan of humiliation, I just want to see a lady get messy.
My niches:
Glasses
Redheads (not NEARLY enough of either one)
Slime pulls her top down
Looking up
Self-sliming only if it's a pull cord release
Don't like
Camera panning up and down her body while the slime is still in full force. This can wait until it's done.
Face coverage without looking up doesn't count to me
Self-slimings
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