Even the D.B. Cooper of the Pie Culture, the legendary Hurley Coward, use to have his off days. Maybe it was the beauty of our model Jo Bache that distracted him and caused his usual perfect aim to go awry.

Here is behind the scenes footage with a rare backview glimpse of the mysterious pie master when he visited my pie shoots in 1992. Even though the first 2 throws totally missed the target, Hurley makes up for it in the end.

Teachable Lesson = never try to direct the model while throwing pies at the same time. Lenny learned that and he always separated the directing and pie throwing to different people.

Messy Playlist
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jD01WGk97qA&list=PLTvS8edshDKaCCaI4ouiwPj_NbBeb_LS7

Messy Poll = Messy Fans now in 2nd place at 31% to wet fans 43%
https://www.youtube.com/c/FMKModels/community

https://youtu.be/jD01WGk97qA

Thanks for sharing. This was just a couple of years before I learned that I wasn't alone with all of this so I remember the scene well. It's interesting to see the behind the scenes.

Here is another back stage video of preps while we made the eggs and flour food fight with Jo Bache and Dawn Davis. Apologies for the abrupt ending -- this is as much as Youtube will allow me to show, because it got very raunchy after that, and ended up with the girls wrestling naked in several gallons of maple syrup.

The full uncut behind the scenes footage is on my Fly on the Wall site @ http://fotw.vidown.com

https://youtu.be/5Bn6ceK6ktM

What IS the YouTube deal anyways?

On one playlist, I have been watching hours and hours of 70s Italian Giallo movies that couldn't even get an R rating these days without loads of cuts. Nudity AND gore in the same scenes!

Another playlist I found is literally a hundred or so of those 90s direct-to-VHS-and/or-skinemax "erotic thrillers". All unedited, all with thousands of views.

But any of the wam producers posts a pie hit with even so much as a nipple slip and the ban-hammer comes down.

_("~)_/

Jo and Keeley are two of my all time favorite models that appeared in those older Lenny & Wamtec videos. Just absolutely stunning women

.....intent....it's what matters.

A movie containing a lot of erotica doesn't have to explicit intent to cause sexual arousal (I'm sure we can debate that to death) but WAM videos only exist with the sole intent to cause sexual arousal.

You can try to start a youtube channel for a socks fetish, and if youtube catches on that the intent of your channel is sexual arousal, it's coming down, even though it's socks.

Case in point was a very popular hypno channel that has amassed a ton of subscribers, but was getting noticed for the fact that hypno was a fetish and yotube yanked it. One issue was the comments - people who were into it sexually had no prob commenting which is one reason why if you're trying to maintain a YT channel for a fetish, either turn your comments off or heavily moderate them.

You guys nailed it. There is a huge double standard that Youtube applies to Wam Producers, and they don't apply that same standard to mainstream movies and music videos. E.G. I have had several videos removed and deleted by Youtube, that did not have any nudity or copyright issues, but Youtube deleted them and sent me a notice saying they were "inappropriate content".....e.g. my models were doing sexy motions and movements that Youtube did not like.....when I can point to thousands of rap music videos where the girls in music videos are engaging in far more provocative actions than my girls were doing....just look a any music video by Cardi B...and that is pornographic compare to the stuff I produce.....yet videos with girls Twerking are allowed but if I show a close up shot of one of my models backsides wiggling it gets flagged and deleted.

Youtube cannot claim that the definition of what they call "inappropriate" is any scene that is sexually arousing, because that is the entire focus of rap and top 40 music videos these days. I just had a video deleted with my model Jennifer gunging herself with a bucket of slime. She was fully clothed and she did not caress her body, she was just gunged with a bucket of slime and it was deleted by Youtube 1 hr later for being "inappropriate".

What is the difference in the "intent" of a music video producer and the "intent" of a wam producer.....they both produce sexually oriented media with the same intent...i.e. to promote and sell a product. The only difference is, mainstream music videos producers are considered to be "artists" and their media is deemed to be "art"...whereas wam producers are considered to be lowlife fetish producers and their media is not considered to be art.

Sorry....but when Christina Aguilera grabs her crotch in her music videos it is no different to when one of my models grabs her crotch in a video....a crotch grab is a crotch grab is a crotch grab.....

The Youtube TOS rules don't seem to apply to mainstream Hollywood and Music Video Producers...because Youtube gives them a pass because they deem that as "art"....but the rest of us must adhere to a stricter standard

So far, all the problems I have been having with Youtube deleting my videos all seem to be with messy videos....because I can post sexy wetlook and underwater videos and those do not get flagged and deleted....but whenever I post a messy video.....it gets taken down if the girl looks like she is enjoying the pie or the gunge in her face. So now I have to label my messy scenes on Youtube as "Comedy Pie scenes" etc...because otherwise they will interpret the scene as "erotic" and then they will remove it. So...Youtube seem to have a real problem these days with messy scenes where the girl appears to be enjoying the mess.

Maybe I should hire a band and start producing music videos, because if you write your own music you can get away with anything these days. We should find some wammers on UMD who can write music, play instruments and sing, and then we can do anything we want to on Youtube.

MK

Very interesting perspective, MK. Thanks for sharing it.

I wonder if some of the "intent" issue is almost class-ist in the way that it discriminates.

The highly sexual videos that are produced to promote music and even the lowest, of the low-budget movies on the channels I referred to in my OP are still "productions". They clearly have a professional studio look to them.

Amateur-shot content seems to get closer scrutiny and no benefit of doubt that it isn't only produced to appeal to fetishists.

Two thing to remember:

YT is now using AI to identify 'inappropriate' video material (so, the judging is based upon one or more algorithms)..this is the main reason the YT does not offer an rationale for its take-downs (whether one video or an entire channel)...it would ave to explain why its algortihms ID'd one video as 'bad' while another gets a pass. ...it's a 'blackbox' situation and the ubernerds at google don't dare second guess their trade secret algorithms...kind of like a Mormon questioning the origin of the 'gold plates' found by John Smith.

and

'community policing' is in high-gear these days...many efforts of which come from anti-erotica / anti-fetish crusaders and trolls (not to ignore members of this community with a grudge) who routinely flag (for take down) videos they've already concluded are 'violations of community standards/guidelines' ...these types relish the disappearance of a popular site offering material that -- for whatever reasons -- they resent.

The last responder has it. It use to be vetters (according to the WSJ all those years ago).

I know wonder if the the vetters set the standards for AI.

It seems to be amazing how AI is able to detect what is art and what is purely meant for sexual arousal. AI programing may be able to determine the intent of the video creator, but how can it know what is the intent is of the viewer of such videos (unless it can turn on your webcam and check to see that your fly is not unzipped). For example, you can post full nudity on Youtube if the girl is having her breasts or crotch pierced or tattooed and you can find numerous naked girls having their landing strip being waxed. The intent of the uploader may not be sexual but more clinical in nature, but what is the intent of the millions of viewers that watch those videos. I am sure the millions of guys who tune in not for the intent of a "learning experience" but merely for the sexual arousal they get from watching such procedures.

The AI programmers at Google and Youtube also have a political and social justice agenda in their AI programming to determine what is Woke and not Woke. E.G. Any WAM Producer can test this theory by creating and uploading 3 test videos, and see the results for themselves...i.e. create three erotic versions of gunging scenes in the exact same style with the same girl:

Video A: An erotic gunging scene where the girl wears a plain white t shirt and a bra

VIdeo B: The same scene shot where the girl wears a social justice T shirt and no bra.

Video C: The same scene where the girl wears a Trump logo and a bra.

I am willing to bet $1000 which video will stay online forever on Youtube while the other 2 videos will get taken down.

I had a video taken down of my model Jennifer gunging herself with a bucket of black colored slime (so it looked like oil) and we made that video several years ago when the BP oil disaster happened. When I made the video and put it on my site I made the title as "A BP Protest"....but when I posted that scene to Youtube several years later the BP oil disaster was no longer in the news, so for Youtube I changed the title to "Jennifer gets Gunged" and made no reference to BP. So they removed my video as being "inappropriate". In retrospect I should have mentioned BP Protest in my Youtube title because then Youtube would have allowed it to be online as a environmental protest video.

I am slowly learning how to play the Youtube "game".....i.e. if you want to fool the idiots who do AI programming into thinking your video is not a fetish but is art or a social justice message, it is very easy to fool them....e.g. In some of my old pie fights with Lenny, which were clearly meant to be erotic. I now label them on Youtube as "Comedy Pie Fight"....because Youtube AI routines do not treat the word "comedy" as a fetish.

We should document some tips on how to fool the Youtube AI routines...e.g. if you want to post a video of a topless girl being gunged in chocolate, shoot it in a Tattoo parlor where she gets her nipples pierced or tattooed at the same time....because that is perfectly acceptable on Youtube.

MK