It is the opposite with my girlfriend - I have to convince her that I do enjoy getting messy, and she isn't being cruel by dishing it out to me!

It just goes to show that not everyone is comfortable with the dom/sub or humiliation aspects. But I agree with the other replies - the fact that he prefers this kind of role playing does not necessarily mean that he wants you to be submissive in all other aspects of your relationship. I'm sorry to hear that your previous partners didn't observe such a distinction, which I consider unacceptable. But it doesn't always have to be like that.

Try to find out exactly what he wants, and how far it extends. Does he want you to pretend to be humiliated and to not be enjoying it, but actually still be comfortable? Or for you to act naturally, enjoying it, but with the key aspect being that he is in control of delivering the mess? I'd imagine one of those is most likely, and perfectly acceptable as long as you both agreed to and were comfortable with the situation. It's only if he wants you to be genuinely humiliated, or considers that you should be submissive outside of this situation as well, that I'd be worried. That's not the impression I get from your posts though.

If, as is most likely, he simply wants this as a role-playing exercise and still respects you and your wishes, then you have to work out what you yourself are comfortable with. But you could do this knowing that it's a game, pretend, rather than having concerns about his overall character.


That's a shame, and part of the issue here. As Bobpooey said, you shouldn't have to suppress your sexual desires just because it reflects a traditional view of gender roles. I highly doubt that indoctrination is the reason for you wanting to be submissive, you are clearly too strong-minded for that! You enjoy it, and there is nothing wrong with that. So long as your partner understands that it is only in the context of the role-play, and that you can still assert yourself at any time during or after.

In a sense, I think you have it backward. By suppressing this aspect of yourself, you have given up control over your sex life and tried to conform to what you think is 'right'. But that means you've submitted to an different influence other than your desires. You should be free to state what you want (being submissive), and get it. That is you taking control of the situation, and therefore being assertive!

You clearly have made a big effort to understand your bf's wishes, and I'm very impressed by that. Not many people would seek out this forum and ask for help as you've done. Keep communicating with him, understand what exactly he wants, and try not to let ideas about gender roles or issues from previous relationships cloud your judgement. You are free to do anything (within reason) within the relationship as long as you both enjoy it, in the end that is all that matters!

Very best of luck.

If I may, there is a book I would highly recommend at this point. It's not specifically about WAM, it's about kink in general and mostly focused on BDSM, but it's one of the best-written books on this topic, in my opinion as a kink educator. It's entitled When Someone You Love is Kinky, by Dossie Easton and Catherine A. Liszt.

It answers quite a few of the questions you're having about balance of power and the meaning of such matters in the outside world, as well as giving an overview of why people might be into certain kinks. Whilst it does not mention WAM at all, I find a very large percentage of what it does speak on can be extrapolated to apply to just about any kink, WAM certainly included.

First, some overdue praise for the OP:
If I'd been dating someone for four months -- which seems like a pretty long time when you're twenty, but is basically a blip on time's radar by the time you reach your mid-forties -- and we'd discussed WAMming, and she'd been hesitant, but rather than simply slamming the door on the whole idea, she came to the UMD and actively engaged in an extensive conversation about the fetish... well, I'd be pretty damn impressed by her efforts and her open-mindedness. I think the majority of partners of both sexes simply say "no" when you bring up the idea of fetish play that makes them uncomfortable, and if you keep bringing it up, they stop being your partner. It's easier, and besides, the relationship has stopped being about two people and started being about one person's fetish.

We can't help what turns us on, and we can't always do anything about what doesn't turn us on, or indeed what actively turns us off. Nor can we do anything about the specificity of our respective kinks. A tiny change to a single detail can change the nature of the activity and kill the arousal factor in the process. It can't be helped.

I think the key here for both parties is to remember that a relationship, ideally, is a long game, so to speak. Sometimes it's hard to remember that not getting exactly what you want right now doesn't mean you'll never get it -- especially where bedroom activities are concerned. Perhaps the boyfriend could try some mutual messy play now, in the interest of allowing Ms Wampartner to get comfortable with the activity, Once he's experienced what he's putting her through, she might be more willing to go solo. Or perhaps he'll discover that mutual WAM is actually pretty damn awesome on its own. Regardless, relationships are all about compromise, and sometimes not getting exactly what you want shows you that what you wanted was the least interesting of the available options.

I think you need to sit down and have an honest face to face with your boyfriend. I am in a relationship where we enjoy wam. It is a mutual enjoyment and we both get "trashed". I am of the same mind set that you are that everything is equal. If he does not have enough respect for you as a person to be the recipient, I would think about other areas of your relationship. If he is a dominant person and you are more submissive, are you comfortable with this role? Once you both get messy, is this something that you would be willing to get shackled up for? You could both switch turns and still keep things equal. But above all, do not do something you are uncomfortable with. If you don't want to then please don't. It is not worth it to go through something sexual if you are not enjoying it too.

This sounds like a great book!

Does Miss Catherine have a *liszt* of the kinks that are covered?

Norman