First and foremost Susan and I would like to thank you all that have supported and purchased our videos. But it comes time for the end of an era. When I first joined UMD I was like anyone else, shocked to find such an amazing community of people who think just like me.... and endless amounts of awesome models, pics, and videos. I lurked for a long time not then said what the fuck and signed up and jumped right in. Along the way I met my girl and even made of those thread you see all to often "how can I get my girl into WAM?" I one day laid my cards on the table and BINGO... she agreed to try it and I could not wait. She even let me grab some photos and right away I posted them here to show the community what a little bit of luck can get you. In time we began having session after session slowly pushing the threshold again and again. Now and again I would post photos... Slowly I was turning her into a wammer. If you look below you can see the chronological order these events. (I posted 1 favorite shot from each set.) One day we decided to open a store to help sponsor our messy fun. It was great... I got to make my own branded videos and use the money earned to get supplies for future sessions. That was the appeal to share WAM sessions for us. But now the payment system on UMD has changed and we are required as store owners to submit tax paperwork and I cant do so. Our tax accountant is family and I cant let him see any of this life style. MessMaster is not to blame though. He runs and incredible site that's his lively hood and he needs to run his books correctly I get it... So we are not going to go on sadly. I very much doubt you guys will see much more from us now to be honest because I rather be in the action than behind the camera. So I guess where I am going with is thank you all for all you have done for us... catch ya later.

As I told you already, I hate to hear that! But I certainly understand.

You two did a fabulous job with what you shared with us! The cute, beautiful, sexy Susan is a real trouper, getting very messy in a lot of sets!

(Not even counting what *we* never saw!)

All of the pics that you posted are fantastic! But that 2nd one has always been one of my favorites! Susan looks so sexy lying there in the shower, covered in chocolate in that fishnet bodysuit! The little dab of chocolate on her nose looks so cute, and her expression just melts me! :lovestruck:

I hope that we'll see some occasional pics, but either way, good luck to you both! I'm sure that you'll continue to get messy for each other!

Norman

thats for sure!

Yeah, sucks man. Your stuff is great, and I'm having the same issues.
I will not be able to release the dozens of videos I have left because of this tax shit.

I wish I had the chance to get stuff out of your store, I was waiting for my card to come in the mail.

Sad to see another one go.

I apologise in advance if this sounds rude as I don't mean it to be but surely you would have to declare any form of money being paid to you no matter how small anyway?

The reason I say that is that my accountant is a relation of mine and all the WAM stuff is just marked as digital content sold online - it could be photos of landscapes for all he knows they don't need all the ins and outs.

With that in mind could you all not continue?

I hope you can find a way to stay. She is gorgeous

Here is the US they issue you a 1099 with the name and identity of who is paying you. You could declare it with out the 1099 but since the 1099 is linked to you the IRS will want to see it on your tax filing form.

My guess is since his family member is an accountant that receiving a 1099 that says "ultimate messy directory" is not what he wants his family to see.

Ah ok that makes more sense

My accountant is going to see "loverbuns" UMDs LLC... its very questionable... i just cant have it... All well.. I'm still going to be around the boards.. just not producing...

Also forgot to include a pic from the session of the first time we did oatmeal together. Now its a regular staple of ours.

There have also been some changes in VAT requirements in the EU and UK in particular. Hitherto there has always been a threshold below which VAT is not chargeable, even for someone earning a living by selling goods or services. Most one man operations (gardeners, electricians etc.) are (or were) VAT exempt. I don't understand the full implications of the rule changes, but it appears that anyone selling a "service" into the UK from other countries has now a liability for collecting and paying Value Added Tax. Someone selling electronic media over the internet, i.e. not selling hard copy DVD's for example falls into that category. International agreements mean that the USA will collect the tax and forward it to the UK and vice versa. I suppose it all depends on how seriously a country takes it's obligations in matters like this.

I don't see that this is going to raise any great revenue for the countries involved, but administrations like things nice and orderly even if it is costing them money to collect the taxes. The box tickers will be happy, besides it is easier to rattle the little guy than the Amazons and Googles who avoid billions in tax every year.

It is indeed sad when a "cottage industry" such we support here, is adversely affected by the bureaucrats who like stamping out anything that has been below the horizon for a while. Ant and I have crossed swords in the past, but I wish him and his beautiful partner every happiness and prosperity in the future.

Yeah, EU VAT requirements are killing my yezzclips business: they take 21% out of my earnings rather than add 21% onto the customer's purchase.

Thank you for all you've shared with the community. You're a lucky guy to have such an amazing partner.

Happy wamming.

Yeah, MM, ignore all that federal tax liability stuff and flout the law! "Felony tax evasion" is just words people throw around to scare off WAM producers, afterall.

I think this is one of those "neither side is wrong" situations.

I 100 percent understand what has necessitated MM having to go the route he did.

I also understand Ant/Susan's situation, and the many others like them.

HUGELY disappointed, both for the content's sake, but also because it seems to have discouraged so many folks -- it's a weird internet based "fire sale/ghost town" situation that has unraveled in the past couple weeks here, similar to what it's like to drive through the streets of many an American town or city. Empty store fronts, whole blocks abandoned, etc.

"squeezing out the little guy" is essentially the end result of having to tighten reigns in the economics/financials department.

I think the fact that ANY UMD still stands after all this time is wonderful, much less one that still has a great many great things about it. But if that's how things must change with the times...while I sympathize with those who ask, "Surely this can be stopped -- think of the future, MM!", I'm sure that w/o such changes there wouldn't be a future of the UMD.

Really am sorry to see Ant/Susan go (she's beautiful, one of the prettiest WAM models in the history of this site, IMO), though. Hopefully they will grace us with their presence now and again, let us know the fun they're having...

JY

Thank you all for the overflowing amounts of love . I got a bunch of PMs and messages from people telling me how much they are going to miss us and our videos. I regret that the store had to close. If anyone ever wants something for my back catalog just PM me and we can work something out. It maybe off UMD but it's not entirely off the market. I will still be on UMD... Not going anywhere... Just won't be going through the hassle of filming and editing rather than partaking in wam with my partner. But I can't say for sure that won't be a few pics of sessions down the line :devil:

FYI I just posted a lengthy message on the WAM Producers private forum that I think will explain many things and give some tips for possible tax related strategies for budding WAM content makers. See my message on that sub forum.

But here is another thought that could enable MessyAnt and other wam hobbyists to continue having fun doing what they enjoy doing, get compensated for their time and materials with some extra on the side, and without causing them the hassle of tax reporting documentation requirements.....why not create a WAM Marketplace "Exchange" where WAM Hobbyists can offer their services as wam content providers where they license their media to other WAM Producers who may be interested in hiring them to make scenes or to acquire the licensing rights to their scenes. The larger WAM Producers are always looking to license media from 3rd parties for their stores, and they don't mind the hassles with tax issues because they have to deal with all that anyway, so many of them would be interested to hire the independent hobbyist producers to create content that they can licence for their stores etc.

In the last 5 years my business partner Tracie and I preferred to focus on shooting wetlook and underwater scenes for our stores, and we had no time to do messy scenes any more, because that was not our main interest anyways, so we ended up hiring a mainstream producer guy in California to create messy scenes for our stores, and he would produce scenes for us, but often they were not very good because he was a mainstream photogragher and he did not "get it" where it concerned messy gunging scenes (e.g. we once commissioned him to do a messy gunging bath tub scene...and he failed to follow our guidance for what substances to use...and so he decided to shoot a scene with a naked girl in the tub with milk and cornflakes....i.e. a total fail...cos you can't get a decent messy scene by using corn flakes).

I am not trying to solicit wam producers to work for me, but if any hobbyist wam fan is visiting our area (South Florida) we will gladly hire them to work on wam scenes for our shoots that we do each month. But we are pretty much focused on producing underwater and wetlook media now and we more or less retired from doing pies and gunge scenes because we used to partner with Lenny and now he does these kinds of scenes much better than we can because he has a passion for the pies subject matter, and this is not our passion. Currently I am only looking to hire producers who make underwater or wetlook scenes, but I am sure there are other messy producers who would like to hire hobbyist wam producers to create media to be licensed to their sites. So...imagine this...

....if Messmaster created a new forum for "Models and Media", then the models and hobbyists who do not want the hassles of dealing with tax forms can go to this forum and offer their services to create media for other Wam producers who may need more content for their stores. So, partnership deals or licensing deals can be made with those Producers seeking to license media from other hobbyist producers, and it would be a open and free marketplace where a hobbyist producer can produce media for multiple different WAM producers who seek to commission their services. The hobbyist Producer then makes deals with several different wam producers for the exclusive rights to specifc clips, and the hobbyist producer get compensated for their time and service and reimbursed for their expenses. 1099 forms only have to be filed if somebody pays you more than $600 in the same year, so then, work for several different producers and not with one producer only, and get $500 or so from each producer to produce x amount of clips, and then the person who hires you does not need to file a 1099 tax report on you, only on their overall wam store incomes, so the larger wam Producer deals with the tax filing issues and the hobbyist producer never receives a 1099 if he works for several different producers during the year and never gets more than $600 from the same producer in the same year.

It would be nice to have a wam models/producer media exchange system where those producers who are seeking to commission people to create media for their wamstores, can hire motivated wam hobbyists and models to partner up with them to make a few clips each year....cos whenever I try to hire external mainstream cameraman or producers to create some wam content for my sites, they never "get it" and understand the wam culture and how things should be done, whereas the wam hobbyists DO get it cos this is their passion and they know the genre very well.

As I said, I am not looking to hire messy producers at this time, because we are mostly focusing on underwater and wetlook scenes today, but I am sure there are other messy producers who maybe interested in partnering with MessyAnt and other motivated wam hobbyists.

What I would like to see is a database of models and producers who are available and willing to model for us when they are in our area, because I prefer to film things myself at our own location, so it would be cool if available models and producers were listed in a forum/directory and their locations (e.g. South UK, Central UK, Northern UK, California, Florida, New York etc) because we do shoots every month and are always looking to hire new talent who really understands the wam culture. Mostly we go to 3 model agencies that we deal with and the ModelMayhem website to find girls for our videoshoots, and that is always a crapshoot cos many of them don't get the wam culture and so I am always willing to hire an experienced wam model if they happen to be traveling in my area. For example, MessyAnt is located in New York, and there are several wam producers in the New York/New Jersey region already and Lenny and his pies and gunge productions are in that area too. If you live in the Seattle, WA area...talk to UMD admin "Soundguy", cos that is his turf and he is always looking to hire experienced WAM models for his shoots.

So, if you are a hobbyist who does not want all the hassle of running a store and tax forms, then just become an amateur hobbyist model/custom video provider who does licensing deals with other wam producers instead.

MK

I'd imagine Mess master does not do this because it cercumvents what would be his cut. Dunno though. I'd never ask susan to be someone elses model. We make videos I enjoy, from my own vision. That is most of the apeal. What I'm showing people in our videos is a slice of our wam life behind closed doors. For others this maybe good though.

Well, there is no way to avoid the $600 threshold tax reporting requirements when you place your clips on a 3rd party hosting company system, because all the other major hosting companies follow the same rules, cos I have stores on the Mothership system and on Clips4sale as well as UMD and they all follow the exact same rules viz the $600 threshold for 1099 tax reportings.

The only other option is not to use a 3rd party hosting company and to host your clips yourself on your own website and server space, and then all the onus falls upon you to decide how to handle your own income and expense accountings. You could declare your site to be a not for profit fan site and then raise funds via crowdfunding website sources and fundraising appeals using Paypal donate buttons. If you are really "artistic" in your wam style you may be able to open a ppv site on the Vimeo.com pay per view system because they will allow scenes with nudity that are deemed to be "artistic" because they have many videos in their system featuring artistic nude paint and mud scenes.

FYI you still are legally required to pay taxes on your income regardless of who your accountant is.

I am not trying to get away without taxes. Like if it was just going through paypal and i had to submit my paypal paper work than fine. I can tell whoever looks that its from selling junk around the house etc etc. MY problem is that UMDs company name is blatantly obvious that we are making porn. If it was something like "mikes trader co" as a name we'd be made in the shade. Like the vid-down service a lot of people use to host WAM videos comes up as "mothership.net" on your credit card bill... which is fantastic cause its in no way a give away on what it is...

I think he means more like, UMD should change its corporate name to "Digital online media production LLC" or something inoffensive like that, so that people can get a 1099 form without advertising to the world that I MAKE AND SELL AMATEUR WET AND MESSY PORN VIDEOS